Pitchfork this month featuring...

[stanton]

What Clukid and LD have done is incorporate the old skool jungle sounds into the modern dubstep format, which means it sound like dubstep but with a jungle twist.

This is what I thought too, sort of. Anyway, even though this thread is a tad silly now, I do love the discussions that Blackdowns column's create every month.

Big up most of your chests.

[m9918868]

oh my christ, it's 2005.. who built the time machine? 'fess up

[epithet]

This is all an absolute madness. breakstep and dubstep are 2 completely different styles of music, yes there are similaritys but they aint the same.

Breakstep got over looked by people in the dubstep scene because it dont sound any thing like dubstep, nor jungle for that matter. it sounds like slowed down DnB.

I understand there have been people making what they thought was jungle sounding dubstep for a few years now but from what i have heard
its influenced by drum and bass not jungle.

You make it sound like d'n'b and jungle arent the same thing and are 2 different styles of music. To me they are as interchangeable and intertwined as dubstep and breakstep. Flip sides of the same coin ?

Would you call toasty or reso or vex'd dubstep or breakstep ? Would you call hotflush a dubstep or breakstep label ?

Dubstep never had a distinct sound until people started only trying to define it as halfstep before that it was everything from s&d to slt to dmz.

[shonky]

You make it sound like d'n'b and jungle arent the same thing and are 2 different styles of music. To me they are as interchangeable and intertwined as dubstep and breakstep. Flip sides of the same coin ?

I think there's a big difference to be honest even though there's similar elements. Jungle was more about breaks and subs and there was way more variety in the rhythms and far more space. Compare that to the maximalist over-produced schlock that passes for dnb these days and there's very little in common.

[geoff]

I think there's a big difference to be honest even though there's similar elements. Jungle was more about breaks and subs and there was way more variety in the rhythms and far more space. Compare that to the maximalist over-produced schlock that passes for dnb these days and there's very little in common.

I agree. I've just read through this thread, and generally I'm under the impression that Epithet has no idea what the hell hes chattin about.

[ory]

You make it sound like d'n'b and jungle arent the same thing and are 2 different styles of music.

This article was specifically about CK&LD's jungle styled dubstep. Their tunes have a very specific era of music in mind. That's why I find it surprising when people come in here and claim breakstep people have been doing it for years, when breakstep is predominantly influenced by modern drum'n'bass. There's quite a large difference, regardless of whether you consider them two sides of the same coin.

[unhygienix]

I agree with epithet here. Yes there is a massive difference between drum'n'bass circa 95 and drum'n'bass circa 2000, but they're both drum'n'bass. There was a conscious move away from the word Jungle in 94/95 when people wanted to disassociate themselves from ragga-type tunes like 'Arsonist', but as DJ Hype has always said, it's all the same music.
There are so many tunes from 95 up until 97 that you could call jungle or drum'n'bass - all the Bristol stuff springs to mind. Drum'n'bass wasn't a term that came in with Optical and everything that followed.
Really off-topic, sorry but I can see history being re-written before my eyes!

[seckle]

there is a massive difference between drum'n'bass circa 95 and drum'n'bass circa 2000, but they're both drum'n'bass.

there's days when i tend to agree with that kind of thinking.

revisionism is important. it's important that people have a right to say.." no, that's wrong, that didn't happen that way and here's why..." even if it's years after the fact. that's when forum's like this become important, because the community keeps itself in check before the media keeps itself in check.

imo, there's no question that jungle was bastardized by all the sub genre battles that happened around 1998-2000. i remember reading forum's and mailing lists back in those days where you had several members of the original metalheadz crew on a forum arguing about the bpm's increasing, and that the vibes were being sacrificed for the bouncey-castle aggression; the girls stopped coming to the dances..etc. now it's 8 years on, dnb is more global than ever, the bpm's are still faster than ever, and people are still trying to sub divide the music but now it's purely for bait marketing reasons. nowadays in dnb no one really cares or notices another sub genre name, when they've had to wade through 6 sub genre's before it. it's taken as a joke when someone goes on a forum and says " here's my crew and we make bubblestep, and you guys need to check for us"

let's say for example, i'm 13 years old, never heard jungle before, was a baby when it was big and i've just heard platinum breaks 1 ( metalheadz). soon afterwards, i'm online trying to find out about the history of jungle. now i have to wade my way through about 6 sub genre names (ragga, dark, liquid, jump up, tech , metal) to find the style i like?

there's something to be said; mainly for the internet at large putting far too much importance into genre and sub genres. it comes with the territory, as you need an attached connotation to be noticed in these myspace/facebook days we live in. i just hope that we don't end up looking back at this community in 5 years and go...yeah it was amazing back then before it splintered off into twinklestep, vroomstep, doomstep...etc

[threnody]

I think it's pretty crass to describe breakstep as slowed down dnb. Suprised to still see so many haters.

Breakstep takes influence from dnb, jungle, breakbeat, funk, dark garage, 2-step, dubstep etc..... it is as diverse if not more so than dubstep. Sonically different to dnb in my opinion....try speeding the beats up to 170bpm and they won't sound good. Are people saying Onson or like sun don't have as much space as halfstep?? Lots of generalizations being made.

The breakstep forum is made up of people from all backgrounds. All genres have diversity and in turn have sub-genres to help classify different areas of the sound. This is a lot less prevailant in breakstep than other genres where there is an emphasis on Bass, beats and breaks.

[epithet]

I've just read through this thread, and generally I'm under the impression that Epithet has no idea what the hell hes chattin about.

Your point being ?

[pacheko]

Blackdown, can you point me to some good "funky" mixes that dont just sound like an old house mix with a few new tunes? I really want to give it a fair shot...

i'm not saying funky is sonically next level yet, personally i still prefer dubstep, desi and grime, but this set changed my view on it.

Thats what I was hoping for, something to possibly change my opinion that its 'just house music'... Thanks.

anyone knows when this show is regularly on air?
is this a regular show at all?

[epithet]

haha...i'd forgotten how awesome this thread was.