Less than amateur producers...assemble!

[Sheff]

I know theres a production forum but people talking about really simple stuff is annoying as the people that go into the main forum and ask where to find dubstep, so i thought id make a thread for the lost causes of producers.

i guess i just want to relate to people that have heaps of motivation but when it comes down to making a tune you just seem to hit constant dead ends...its frustrating. surely im not the only ninja in this situation.

For all the people that overcome this stage in production, how did you manage it?
I know the production bible is a good source of info but its just bare links and its just abit overwhelming for me.

Did you keep reading? watch tutorials? experiment enough to find out what every single button/knob/effect does?

[Shum]

What sort of "constant dead ends" are we talking about here? I can relate to your feelings about the production forum also lol.

[Sheff]

just trying to get a certain sound going then having it proper not working for you. or if you do manage to get a certain sound, trying to get it sit in with the rest of the song it just sounds shit.
or trying to get a good subbass and it just sounding muddy as fuck

[Shum]

I can't remember the word (or even if there is one) for the solution to all your problems (as I am drunk and yelling at my cricket team), where you isolate sounds into frequency "bands" to avoids sounds clashing with each other. As for sounds not working, save a copy of your project file and try your hardest to make that sound work out for you, if it fails in the end you can always go back to where you started from.

[oli90]

LOL

[Mr Hyde]

just trying to get a certain sound going then having it proper not working for you. or if you do manage to get a certain sound, trying to get it sit in with the rest of the song it just sounds shit.
or trying to get a good subbass and it just sounding muddy as fuck

yeah, i end up spending days trying to get certain sounds and failing.

stopping muddy sub for me seems to be all about getting it mono and playing with eq/limiters/compressor loads.

other parts not sitting right with everything else i find is the same sort of thing, want it to sound as if all the parts are being played to you from the same band/room space- so the same things like echo, reverb, compression, EQ, etc need to try and make each piece fit together in the space.

but yeah trial and error and lots of frustration for me! ive got about 200 unfinished tunes ....all practice though i guess. have a smoke and zone out over it for hours is how i generally do!

[oli90]

stopping muddy sub for me seems to be all about getting it mono and playing with eq/limiters/compressor loads.

Considering most subs are just sine waves eqing will have no effect on them as they contain no harmonics. Compression and limiting will have no effect beyond making it louder also, unless you've enveloped your sub, in which case it would be counter intuitive.

For a clear sub you need to make room for it in your mix using basic separation. Keep it centred (save the centre of the mix for only key elements of the mix, kick snare, sub etc), make sure other elements of your mix have had their lower frequency content attenuated with eqs. Also having a subwoofer obviously helps.

One of the best things you can do as a beginner is learn what your plugins/gear actually does to the signal. A lot of people starting out seem to feel that a good mix HAS to use certain processing (unessential eq, compression, limiting on every channel etc), only use it if it need to be there, otherwise it's most likely going to be detrimental.

[lloydnoise]

about 6 months ago I decided to strip down, stopped using Reaktor, mad pluggins, overly complicated synths etc, reduced my virtual kit to:
Ableton
free Piano emulator
free EPiano emulator
free TAL bass synth
samples I ripped off Youtube

so much more fun limiting yourself and I've found I've been concentrating on musicality more than sound design which is really where I wanted to be. I need to get back on it tho, haven't made a tune since I moved house over christmas

Good thread btw, the produckle forum is full of twats

[deadly_habit]

finish your tunes don't just make loops
weed out crap samples you won't use into a solid library
have a template for your workflow all ready when you open a new project
limit your plugin folder and learn what you have in and out

[hasezwei]

about 6 months ago I decided to strip down, stopped using Reaktor, mad pluggins, overly complicated synths etc, reduced my virtual kit to:
Ableton
free Piano emulator
free EPiano emulator
free TAL bass synth
samples I ripped off Youtube

so much more fun limiting yourself and I've found I've been concentrating on musicality more than sound design which is really where I wanted to be. I need to get back on it tho, haven't made a tune since I moved house over christmas

Good thread btw, the produckle forum is full of twats

nice approach, with the limiting. just gave me a great idea

basically having three different kitlists, including a DAW template for:
- designing sounds and synth patches for later use in my music (no kit restrictions needed obviously)
- songwriting (just a couple of really basic instruments, creative fx and a sampler routed to my midi controllers so i can immediately start jamming)
- finishing/mixing (eq's, compressors, limiters, panning tools, imaging tools, all that stuff.)

niiice idea!

[deadly_habit]

Good thread btw, the produckle forum is full of twats

only to people who can't read stickies, use search and generally deserve it

[kidshuffle]

I usually just get drunk, stoned and force myself to keep going once I hit a dead end.

Deadly Habit's advice is pretty spot on as well!

[wub]

Good thread btw, the produckle forum is full of twats

Whilst there is some twatty behaviour in the production group at times, it's not any worse than SNH or General.


There are production members who do try and help wherever possible; it's just when the same question is asked over and over again it understandable seems to get peoples' backs up.

[kidshuffle]

What are some decent free piano emulators anyways? I wanna get back on some old rave business

[wub]

What are some decent free piano emulators anyways? I wanna get back on some old rave business

Most DAWs come with a piano plugin as standard. Cubase & FL do for sure. FL it's called Keys (I think), can't remember the name of it in Cubase.

[Sheff]

great replies everyone and deadly, finishing tunes is the one thing i can never do, i have about 20 tracks and none of them are even halfway finished yet haha. ill definately take it into consideration though, im sure its completely different listening to a full finished track rather than a shitty loop you've been trying to get right for ages

lloyd i think thats a problem i have to be honest, i have way too many plugins and samples and everything which i dont even know how to use to their max potential.
i always think getting a new plugin will make me automatically better but it obviously doesnt.
then again though i really need practise on making my own sounds, thats my weakness.
imagining a sound in my head then trying to put it down in the DAW

thanks oli and shum gonna have a long read at some point about all that stuff and try get my head around it.

does anyone ever make a tune which you think sounds great, then listen back the next day and its not amazing as you remembered it to be? lol its truly a par

[Sheff]

Good thread btw, the produckle forum is full of twats

Whilst there is some twatty behaviour in the production group at times, it's not any worse than SNH or General.


There are production members who do try and help wherever possible; it's just when the same question is asked over and over again it understandable seems to get peoples' backs up.

cant blame them either if people never search for stuff thats been covered a million times already

[deadly_habit]

as far as finishing structure it even if just loops into a say common structure like 16 6416 32 or something
then load up a patch that you think would compliment it and loop it and jam out on your midi keyboard till something hits

ie: tune in my sig is just foundation work, still have other patches i'm dinking about with for melody, recording vox, background atmospherics and those lil variations etc

also i tend to mix as i go, but for some people who are just starting out but don't have the ears they spend time overly tweaking and engineering when they should be getting their ideas down before they forget them.

[Sheff]

yeah never thought about the last bit, i think i spend more time trying to get a perfect sound instead of focusing on the bigger picture. good advice all in all
i like this thread alot already
liking that tune aswell in your sig, flows real nicely

what else annoys me is that i have so much motivation with this, sometimes in the morning its the first thing i do after having a coffee and a cig, and ill spend hours on it and just end up saving a 32 bar loop that took me hours which sounds shit.
its like i KNOW what i want to make and have an idea in my head how to do it, then just completely hit blank when it comes to it.
also when i listen to songs like Jkenzo - Rotek (for example) its sounds so simply and easy to make that certain type of tune but its just not
with most dubstep tunes in general they sound really simple like its just 1 synth, a simple bass, and a flowing drum beat and all that.
i think i try and put too much stuff in at once. i dunno...
thanks again for all the replies though its nice to have help like this.

its like when it comes to mixing on decks, my mate often comes round and he always wants me to teach him. to me it comes naturally (after all the practise over the years obviously) and it sorta gets frustrating watching him not be able to keep two tracks anywhere near in-beat, or even in the right bar, because it seems so simple to me.
when i think back at it i remember how hard and frustrating it was though when i first started

[wub]

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=176281


This thread always helps me when I'm feeling the creative juices running a little dry.