Twelve dubs that most people don't realise are dub.

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 3:44 am

It seems I hear dub everywhere.Some of it's obviously dub influenced,but it's not always clear to everyone I guess.But some of my favorite dubs come from some unlikely people:

Chapterhouse - Picnic[Dedicated]

The Boo Radleys - Lazarus[Creation]

Bauhaus - Bela Lugosi's Dead[Beggars Banquet](SO much of thier stuff was dubby!)

Moonshake - Secondhand Clothes[Too Pure](Actually,pretty much anything off "Eva Luna".)

The Wake - Host[Factory]

Swervedriver - Duress[Creation]

Cabaret Voltaire - Sluggin' For Jesus[Crepuscule]

Slowdive - Sing[Creation]

Dif Juz - Heset[4AD]

My Bloody Valentine - Only Shallow[Creation]

Tones On Tail - Lions[Beggars Banquet]

New Fast Automatic Daffodils - Big[Mute](The New FADs were HIGHLY underrated...sad.)

Anybody else get that?Like you tell people that you think it's sounds dub and they look at you like you're high?Of course,9 times out of 10,I probably am,but it still sounds dub to me.

parson · Post by **parson** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:10 am

thread inspired me to bust out souvlaki

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:40 am

Parson wrote:thread inspired me to bust out souvlaki

Yeah!'Souvlaki Space Station' is dubby as all hell!And 'In Mind' is a trip how the guitars sound like synth pads against that 4/4 dub with the echoey snare.

That record is bliss!

[Neil Halstead's setup c.1993]

and...

[Christian Saville's c.1993]

parson · Post by **parson** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:48 am

nice.

parson · Post by **parson** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:50 am

how about songs:ohia - ghost tropic

pretty dubby if you ask me

bedward · Post by **bedward** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:37 am

dub changed the world.

masstronaut · Post by **masstronaut** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 10:17 am

Echo Wanderer wrote:My Bloody Valentine - Only Shallow[Creation]

Sick.

New FADS huh? Gonna have to dig em out again. Never thought the recordings did them justice.

How about Les Rallizes Denudes - '77 Live?

bedward · Post by **bedward** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 10:57 am

sigue sigue sputnik : love missile f1-11

scoz · Post by **scoz** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 12:58 pm

I don't remember there being much dubbyness to New FADS Big but it is erm a big track. Have to go and dig out my copy now.

I've actually probably got about half of the original list somewhere. I have absolutely no memory of what Eve Luna sounds like at all.

masstronaut · Post by **masstronaut** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 1:05 pm

Secondhand Clothes is pretty low-slung and nasty IIRC.

Don't forget Kitchens of Distinction - Anvil Dub, even though it's explicitly dub, and a bit shit.

scoz · Post by **scoz** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 1:17 pm

Slowdive got a lot of very unfair flack. Admittedly even from me a few years ago cos I hadn't actually listened to the stuff they had done for ages. When I did listen to the records again I was blown away by it. I'd forgotten just how brilliant they were.

Anyway I read somewhere that they got dropped from Creation at the behest of Oasis so yet another thing to the list of reasons for hating Oasis.

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:09 pm

masstronaut wrote:
Echo Wanderer wrote:My Bloody Valentine - Only Shallow[Creation]
Sick.

New FADS huh? Gonna have to dig em out again. Never thought the recordings did them justice.

How about Les Rallizes Denudes - '77 Live?

Yeah.A shoegaze friend of mine got fucking PISSED when I said that about 'Only Shallow'!I actually got a lecture about how MBV aren't a bunch of pot smoking Jamaicans,to which I replied:"maybe that's because they are from Ireland originally?"Ha!The song isn't dub per se,but that opening/chorus part totally is.There's a full on dread bassline and if you listen close,one of the guitars is playing "chicka-chicka" reggae behind a shitload of effects(of course)!I think I can tell mostly,because when I used to play guitar in ska bands back in'89-'90 or so,the guitar riddim is between the beats,unlike most music where it's on the 2 and 4.

Er..."77 live"?That's kind of pushin' it,don't you think?I can see what you mean,but I think of it/them as noisy psyche.But 'Night Of The Assassins'(track 2 on "77 Live") is funny how they keep playing that bass loop of "My Girl" by The Temptations,only it's not actually a loop,it's the bassist.I guess that one is kinda dubbed out!Do you like Acid Mothers Temple too?

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:14 pm

scoz wrote:I don't remember there being much dubbyness to New FADS Big but it is erm a big track. Have to go and dig out my copy now.

I've actually probably got about half of the original list somewhere. I have absolutely no memory of what Eve Luna sounds like at all.

Listen to it again.That song is blatant dub.Especially starting at about 2:30s into the song.Reggae keys,Augustus style melodica,infinite washes of echo guitar...

masstronaut · Post by **masstronaut** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:22 pm

Echo Wanderer wrote:Er..."77 live"?That's kind of pushin' it,don't you think?I can see what you mean,but I think of it/them as noisy psyche.But 'Night Of The Assassins'(track 2 on "77 Live") is funny how they keep playing that bass loop of "My Girl" by The Temptations,only it's not actually a loop,it's the bassist.I guess that one is kinda dubbed out!Do you like Acid Mothers Temple too?

Yes it is totally pushing it. Haha. It's the way everything is drenched in Space Echo. There is a track on that 7" that came with a Japanese magazine that's pretty much all bass for ages.

Big fan of AMT. Got far too many of their CDs. Amazing live band.

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:38 pm

masstronaut wrote:Secondhand Clothes is pretty low-slung and nasty IIRC.

Don't forget Kitchens of Distinction - Anvil Dub, even though it's explicitly dub, and a bit shit.

I was going to mention 'Anvil Dub',but since dub is in the name,it's pretty obvious to most shoegazers.But,no...it's not thier greatest moment as you say(heh heh heh...).In thier defence though,'Anvil Dub' is a really political song on some levels,and most of thier other stuff is wonderful.Especially when Patrick goes all jazz on the bass,like on 'Hypnogogic' and 'Elepantine'.

Yeah...the first time I heard Moonshake,they blew me away.'City Poison' is another one.So different from all the other shoegaze bands.Noisy as fuck,but so dub and poli-punk too.Plus they got thier name from that Can tune,which is awesome.Then Margaret Fiedler and Guy Fixsen split of into Laika.Too Pure was an ace label too.I was really into Seefeel in thier early days.And PJ Harvey of course!

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:41 pm

masstronaut wrote:
Big fan of AMT. Got far too many of their CDs. Amazing live band.

Nice...

Saw 'em in SF once.Loudness,serious loudness.They remind me a lot of Hawkwind,and I like it!

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 6:30 am

Bedward wrote:sigue sigue sputnik : love missile f1-11

Total dub.

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 4:59 pm

Moonshake (and Laika, Margaret Fiedlers band) are definitely two of the most underrated bands ever.

echo wanderer · Post by **echo wanderer** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:25 pm

Shonky wrote:Moonshake (and Laika, Margaret Fiedlers band) are definitely two of the most underrated bands ever.

You got that right!Guy Fixsen(also of both bands) produced a lot of the early Catherine Wheel.And Maggie Fiedler played on the Boo Radley's "Giant Steps" record.Come to think of it...Meriel Barham(Pale Saints) sang on it too!

Even back in '91 when I was really heavy into the first gen shoegaze,no one paid attention to them.I think Moonshake were too rough,dubby,or political for people that just wanted the MBV or Slowdive sound.Same with most of the Too Pure bands,with the exception of PJ Harvey,but then again,she wasn't "shoegaze enough" apparently.Then she started dating Nick Cave and all the Goth kids started liking her when she is nowhere NEAR goth.

Anyway,SeeFeel(also Too Pure) was like electronic shoegaze years before Radiohead started getting around to do it,and people dismissed them too for some reason.But then again,Radiohead was just some alt-rock band out of Ox4 before they checked out Ride and Swervedriver(also Ox4)and decided to jump on the 'gaze train.Don't get me wrong,I love Radiohead.I am just tired of the mainstream acting as if they invented shoegaze.

I should have listed Ride's 'Paralysed' and 'Time Machine'(esp.that intro!) as dub tracks too.

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:44 pm

I think round that time, most eyes were on Seattle and grunge as the next big thing, and over here (if I remember right) it was Senseless Things, Ned's Atomic Dustbin, Wonderstuff and those sort of enormous shorts and stupid hair acts and the tail-end of the Manchester scene.

The shoegaze thing was pretty big (could find most of the big acts albums in the high street record shops) but don't think it was brazen enough for some and didn't really have any big personalities (it was pretty introverted) for the others.

Then a few years later Britpop came along, and in terms of any musical progression it hasn't really left since.

Know what you mean about Radiohead though, they wouldn't be where they are now if someone hadn't put in the groundwork. In much the same way that Jane's Addiction got the US ready for less cock-rock sounds.

Speaking of which, the beginning of "Ted, Just Admit It" is quite dubbed out too

Twelve dubs that most people don't realise are dub.

Twelve dubs that most people don't realise are dub.

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