Nu-Dubstep

debate, appreciation, interviews, reviews (events or releases), videos, radio shows
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renegatus
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Post by renegatus » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:48 pm

Jolly Wailer wrote:
Tomity wrote:
Paulie wrote::u:
Indeed. I'm not so much frustrated by the topic but by the tone of the post and the replys. People are getting OTT. Must be collective period day.
originally for me it was the use of the 'Nu' prefix
Same, if it has the nu- prefix it clearly isn't the original sound, so who cares?!

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Post by wil blaze » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:50 pm

Renegatus wrote:I guess you could talk about hip-hop in relation to this whole thing. For years, hip-hop in the mainstream has been transformed into some kind of disgusting guns-bling-and-bitches format, but it's not real hip-hop. As long as people who really love it realise that, and then search deeper in the genre for great producers and groups, we find that it doesn't really matter what happens in the mainstream and it's nothing but a shame for the people who really get off on that music. Mention hip-hop to most people and they'll think Snoop Dogg, Akon, 50 Cent, etc. Mention hip-hop to the heads and they'll pull up J Dilla (R.I.P.), Madlib, MF DOOM, Peanut Butter Wolf, etc.

The same can happen with dubstep. As long as the people on the inside, the underground, love the music and continue to search for the best sounds, their need will be provided by the producers, no matter how destroyed the dubstep tag becomes in the mainstream.

WORD!!!

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elementalism
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Post by elementalism » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:58 pm

pete bubonic wrote: SO you reckon Dubstep is an imaginative name?!
No, I reckon a name is a name. I don't need the name to hold any importance, I listen to the fucking music, not the name.

The name is fine. Dub = bass, dubplate culture, reggae vibe. Step = tempo, garage influence, open-endedness.

What's your problem?

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Post by blackdown » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:03 pm

pete bubonic wrote:Tempa didn't invent the term Dubstep. A mag by the name of XLR8R (I think) did. Tempa just ran with it.
Actually, they did. XLR8R were the first to publish the word, but they got it from the Ammo press release, written by Neil (co-founder of Ammo, founder of Tempa) about Horsepower (who were on the cover).
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Post by pete_bubonic » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:06 pm

Elementalism wrote:
pete bubonic wrote: SO you reckon Dubstep is an imaginative name?!
No, I reckon a name is a name. I don't need the name to hold any importance, I listen to the fucking music, not the name.

The name is fine. Dub = bass, dubplate culture, reggae vibe. Step = tempo, garage influence, open-endedness.

What's your problem?
You've picked up on something which was more a tongue in cheek throw away observation rather than the actual points of my post. If you like the name, fair play -- sorry, I mean if you don't give a fuck about the name fair play, neither do I.

The reggae vibe prerequisite is kinda what I was refering to in headfukkah's post. Bar DMZ, most reggae vibes in tunes by dubstep producers don't go much farther than sticking 'jah rasta' sample in their tune and maybe some skank piano/guitar.

I don't have a problem with the name though, just a bit boring.

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Post by pete_bubonic » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:23 pm

Blackdown wrote:
pete bubonic wrote:Tempa didn't invent the term Dubstep. A mag by the name of XLR8R (I think) did. Tempa just ran with it.
Actually, they did. XLR8R were the first to publish the word, but they got it from the Ammo press release, written by Neil (co-founder of Ammo, founder of Tempa) about Horsepower (who were on the cover).
I stand corrected. Cheers Martin. My apologies to Headfukkah. :)

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Post by adam_misst » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:30 pm

dribble...do shit yourself son, sort it out if thats how u feel...

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Post by digistepz » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:31 pm

So what if more and more are picking up on the sound? alot of people seem to be uptight at the fact that dubstep isnt some cosy little thing they can hide from everyone who isnt a dubhead anymore.

My mum likes Untrue..but does it bother me? No...she might like the music for different reasons than me, and when she meets up with friends do they bang on about Rusko and Coki over a cup of Yorkshire Tea and a biscuit? I dont think they do....

Fuck it, as long as you keep buying the music, going to nights, promoting, blogging ect, the "scene" will be fine, so stop worrying about Skins or the Klaxons remix (or the bloody name of the genre for that matter), it could be called Gimpcore, and id still listen to the hundreds of artists who make the best fucking music round at the moment.

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djgyn
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Post by djgyn » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:48 pm

SOMEBODY THROW A PIE ALREADY!
OUT IN THE STREET,
THEY CALL IT MURDA

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Post by nubian minds » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:52 pm

This is like drum and bass all over again.

You guys really just want to argue for aguing's sake don't you?

:lol:
Life is like a box of chocolates.

It gets stale after a while....

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Post by hedfukkah » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:11 pm

The Nu-Dubstep title was tongue in cheek. More referring to the indie crossover stuff than the new wave of diverse and talented producers.
DIGISTEPZ wrote:So what if more and more are picking up on the sound? alot of people seem to be uptight at the fact that dubstep isnt some cosy little thing they can hide from everyone who isnt a dubhead anymore.
I will reitterate. My problem is not that dubstep is growing or that indie kids are grooving to wobble or that Tempa have a monompoly or that lots of people copy their idols.

My concern is that with Dubstep as a genre being the invention of Tempa with their early catalogue and dubstep allstars series that the umbrella term which refers to everything from Shackleton to Sully via Redline, Blackmass Plastics, Scorn, Burial, TRG, Toasty etc etc etc is obscuring the lesser artists who do not conform to the Temp(a)late.

People listen to the big shows for their fix of dubstep and the buzz is all around the Ammunition empire WHICH IS FINE AS THEY CREATED THE TERM DUBSTEP. The media do features on TEMPA artists and people get into the sound via FWD. But the Tempa side of things is not representative of the sound we know of dubstep as a whole. Therefore by using the dubstep tag lots of artists are getting lost under the surface....
They will probably NEVER play at FWD, they will probably NEVER be on dubstep allstars, they will probably NEVER be featured in papers or magazines because the sounds are varied and diverse (everything that dubstep started as..) but they have this dubstep name attached so get overlooked in favour of the big boys (the same as in dnb a few years back).

There is so much good music emerging, Rottun's hardstep sound, Combat and Creative Space's electronica sound, Urban Graffiti's deep and dark sound. 2 step influences more akin to broken Niche than Dubstep, Techno stuff, dnb stuff, experiemntal stuff...however by referring to stuff as dubstep it goes under the radar as there is not an identity for it in the same way as with the Tempa sound.

I want to see Rottun go massive in the same way as Tempa has not have it more underground than thou but by having a preconceived identity people overlook it when there is a lot of diversity amongst the artists (check Excision's new mix for proof http://dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=33283).

Obviously everyone is not going to get the same coverage but in the name of keeping the genre and sound diverse certain barriers need to be broken and the shackles of the dubstep tag, media interpretation and the imbalance between certain aspects of the sound and others are holding the diversity back.

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Post by osk » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:27 pm

Personally, I think this was a point well made and explained.

I can't be fucked to get into why.

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Post by blk plague » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:46 pm

HEDFUKKAH wrote: the Tempa side of things is not representative of the sound we know of dubstep as a whole. Therefore by using the dubstep tag lots of artists are getting lost under the surface....
They will probably NEVER play at FWD, they will probably NEVER be on dubstep allstars, they will probably NEVER be featured in papers or magazines because the sounds are varied and diverse (everything that dubstep started as..) but they have this dubstep name attached so get overlooked in favour of the big boys (the same as in dnb a few years back).

There is so much good music emerging, Rottun's hardstep sound, Combat and Creative Space's electronica sound, Urban Graffiti's deep and dark sound. 2 step influences more akin to broken Niche than Dubstep, Techno stuff, dnb stuff, experiemntal stuff...however by referring to stuff as dubstep it goes under the radar as there is not an identity for it in the same way as with the Tempa sound.

Obviously everyone is not going to get the same coverage but in the name of keeping the genre and sound diverse certain barriers need to be broken and the shackles of the dubstep tag, media interpretation and the imbalance between certain aspects of the sound and others are holding the diversity back.
seen.
I AM NOT OK.

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Post by badger » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:52 pm

Osk wrote:Personally, I think this was a point well made and explained
heh i agree, theres some good points there. lots of tunes/artists go under the radar (mainstream radar anyway, heads are still gonna go looking for other stuff) due to the term dubstep which is truly a shame. but it seems a little bit reactionary to argue that the only solution to this is to change names and start anew. i dont like the term dubstep either personally but isnt it a bit late to just decide we're something else? i mean would this even work anyway? and if it did wouldnt this just waste all the good work into publicising the sound go to waste? yeah we might get rid of a lot of the assoications to dubstep which i do think are slightly damaging but surely the best way to promote alternative sounds is to do as lots of people (and threads, theres been fuckloads) and support the alternative sounds by buying records and going to more alternative nights

think this post sums it up well:
Renegatus wrote:I guess you could talk about hip-hop in relation to this whole thing. For years, hip-hop in the mainstream has been transformed into some kind of disgusting guns-bling-and-bitches format, but it's not real hip-hop. As long as people who really love it realise that, and then search deeper in the genre for great producers and groups, we find that it doesn't really matter what happens in the mainstream and it's nothing but a shame for the people who really get off on that music. Mention hip-hop to most people and they'll think Snoop Dogg, Akon, 50 Cent, etc. Mention hip-hop to the heads and they'll pull up J Dilla (R.I.P.), Madlib, MF DOOM, Peanut Butter Wolf, etc.

The same can happen with dubstep. As long as the people on the inside, the underground, love the music and continue to search for the best sounds, their need will be provided by the producers, no matter how destroyed the dubstep tag becomes in the mainstream.

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Post by xor » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:55 pm

Anyone written any groundbreaking tunes during the duration of this thread?
I need a cup of tea
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Post by badger » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:57 pm

dunno but HEDFUKKAH put some fucking sick 140bpm junglist/dubstep tunes up on the dubs section a while ago. u done any more dude? i loved em :)

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Post by osk » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:04 pm

Renegatus wrote:I guess you could talk about hip-hop in relation to this whole thing. For years, hip-hop in the mainstream has been transformed into some kind of disgusting guns-bling-and-bitches format, but it's not real hip-hop. As long as people who really love it realise that, and then search deeper in the genre for great producers and groups, we find that it doesn't really matter what happens in the mainstream and it's nothing but a shame for the people who really get off on that music. Mention hip-hop to most people and they'll think Snoop Dogg, Akon, 50 Cent, etc. Mention hip-hop to the heads and they'll pull up J Dilla (R.I.P.), Madlib, MF DOOM, Peanut Butter Wolf, etc.

The same can happen with dubstep. As long as the people on the inside, the underground, love the music and continue to search for the best sounds, their need will be provided by the producers, no matter how destroyed the dubstep tag becomes in the mainstream.
Nail on the head business.

:T:

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Post by blackdown » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:33 pm

I think people are confusing music with organisation. Tempa/Ammo didn't get where they are because they invented the term "dubstep," they got there because they're organised, determined and put the work in.

You mention a bunch of labels you think should get PR on the level that Ammo do. I'm sure there's countless others that should also.

But putting decent music out and getting great exposure are two different things. You need to work hard, invest in PR, online media, market, organise nights, get on iTunes etc.

Sadly - i wish it were otherwise - just putting out great music just isn't enough. Otherwise dubstep would have blown up with Tempa 002 about six years ago!
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Post by spender » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:50 pm

Since when was 'Tempa' a byword for generic sounds?
That's bloody ridiculous. They might release the tunes way after the hype on them's blown over, but tunes like Night, before it got rinsed to buggery, 2D, Mind & Soul, Locus Lotus and Emotions didn't fit to any template at all. And if there was one, they've well and truly fucked with it.

It's ridiculous to suggest the Tempa 'Empire' is in some way holding the smaller labels back. It started off as a pretty bloody small label itself. A few hundred copies hitting the shops each release. I picked up the first Tempa Allstars for 49p months after it came out. The stuff really didn't fly off the shelves back then (however overvalued it might be on ebay now).

The point I'm making is they started small, they've got bigger and are having a few growing pains / getting a little big for their boots occasionally but they've pushed on and on even when they hype was non existent. To suggest they're only in it for the cash is pretty harsh.

For the record, I don't work for them.

The smaller labels are bound to be on the fringes, but only until they establish themselves - which labels like Hessle and Punch Drunk are doing in the blink of an eye.

Stop putting things in pigeonholes and enjoy it all while it lasts.

The amount of pointless whinging on here's getting me down!

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renegatus
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Post by renegatus » Wed Nov 28, 2007 7:48 pm

HEDFUKKAH wrote:My concern is that with Dubstep as a genre being the invention of Tempa with their early catalogue and dubstep allstars series that the umbrella term which refers to everything from Shackleton to Sully via Redline, Blackmass Plastics, Scorn, Burial, TRG, Toasty etc etc etc is obscuring the lesser artists who do not conform to the Temp(a)late.
Dubstep's not just about darkness and wobbly bass. There's loads of dubstep out there that's very different, I thought that was the point of the genre? Songs carried by deep sub-bass and jumpy, swingy beats. The middle is all up for experimentation and the majority of articles I've read on dubstep production emphasize this. In fact, that's why I like it, because you're always guaranteed something to make you skank or nod your head, but it's a real surprise finding what else they throw in the mix.

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