gain structure and mixing aka THE MONEYSHOT THREAD

Brisance · Post by **Brisance** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:23 pm

Thanks for the info guys, I will try most of the stuff in the evening to see, which sounds best.

wirez · Post by **wirez** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:51 pm

nowaysj wrote:To my knowledge, you're going to loose something. There's just no way around that. The art is making the loss invisible (audiotorially speaking).

Dep's suggestions are the way, I think.

One thing I haven't heard - what made this audiotrack? Is this the output of a synth or sampler triggered w/ midi? If so reduce the velocity of the snare hit that made that peak.

Also, figure out if anything else is hitting there at the same time, take it out if the snare is what you want to hear.

Manually automate a volume cut right there on that hit.

Then - find the freq of that snare hit, eq the freq down a bit.

Use a good, transparent compressor and automate it - just for that hit - knock it down a few db's.

A little volume adustment, a little eq, and a little compression - again - all just for that hit should tame that peak w/o loosing everything.

But again 2x - you have to loose, no way around that, we're in a zero sum environment.

All that for one snare... My advice is leave it, it's all part of the art.

wirez · Post by **wirez** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:53 pm

WiREZ wrote:
nowaysj wrote:To my knowledge, you're going to loose something. There's just no way around that. The art is making the loss invisible (audiotorially speaking).

Dep's suggestions are the way, I think.

One thing I haven't heard - what made this audiotrack? Is this the output of a synth or sampler triggered w/ midi? If so reduce the velocity of the snare hit that made that peak.

Also, figure out if anything else is hitting there at the same time, take it out if the snare is what you want to hear.

Manually automate a volume cut right there on that hit.

Then - find the freq of that snare hit, eq the freq down a bit.

Use a good, transparent compressor and automate it - just for that hit - knock it down a few db's.

A little volume adustment, a little eq, and a little compression - again - all just for that hit should tame that peak w/o loosing everything.

But again 2x - you have to loose, no way around that, we're in a zero sum environment.
All that for one snare... My advice is leave it, it's all part of the art.

Oh, don't take that as me knocking your advice, it sounds like brilliant advice...

I was just stating that, in my opinion, music is an art form, and slight imperfections give character!

Sharmaji · Post by **Sharmaji** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:12 pm

Brisance wrote:
Help?

it looks fine. seriously. if it sounds good, keep it.

if it doesn't sound good, change it.

if you're worried about the peakiness of it, try some simple L2-ish limiting.

bellybelle · Post by **bellybelle** » Thu May 07, 2009 4:46 pm

oh. my. goodness.

you lot are making my journey into production sooooo much nicer. glad to see that my ideas about not putting too many fx and compression was on the right track. but man....after reading and reading and reading, when i started something new last night and just spaced it properly while i was mixing as i went.....the quality of sound improved tenfold and i still haven't finished a tune yet!

These lessons are invaluable. I'm glad I'm learning this all at once so that I can make sure I'm learning the right way from the start. Then maybe I won't mess up too much after that since the only way I'll be used to will be the right one.

Thanks you guys. From me and my ears, which, I swear, sighed in relief when I put things in their right places.

misk · Post by **misk** » Tue May 12, 2009 6:50 pm

great thread

macc · Post by **macc** » Tue May 12, 2009 9:12 pm

Still really glad this is helping people!

megaladon · Post by **megaladon** » Tue May 12, 2009 10:19 pm

Ask more Qs then.

ayonic · Post by **ayonic** » Wed May 13, 2009 4:02 am

from what i know there are vst plug-ins that specifically cancel phasing issues. i remember they had that with the computer music software bundle a few months ago.

peace

macc · Post by **macc** » Wed May 13, 2009 2:59 pm

Sorry for not answering absolutely everything to your satisfaction nowaysj

TBH it's getting on to phase issues which are not really related to this sticky. I know I mentioned it earlier in the thread but I didn't know the thread was going to be up here permanently, I was just trying to help a dude out

Now it is here permanently it is better IMO to keep it to what it is about - gain structure - than to branch off and possibly confuse matters for people reading. It's a gain structure thread, not an 'ask Bob' thread. Better to keep it tight and to the point - keep your levels sensible.

Not blowing you off - ask in another thread and I'll see what I can come up with.

eshscramble · Post by **eshscramble** » Wed May 13, 2009 11:26 pm

Macc wrote: Now go and listen to Kind of Blue, and think about this while you're listening.

this is my favorite piece of vinyl in my collection

richard sweat · Post by **richard sweat** » Fri May 15, 2009 11:48 pm

this thread delivers the greatness! Thanks to all of you guys that have been throwing out the knowledge!

iamadam · Post by **iamadam** » Sat May 16, 2009 3:38 pm

As an example for gain construction before the drums hit the main mix

I've tried

Kick = -9db

Snare = -16db

Hats = -25db

This gives me about -9db

What are people thoughts on the matter?

macc · Post by **macc** » Sun May 17, 2009 2:11 am

Hello there

So the drums are peaking at just over -9? Sounds about right to me

How do they sound?

iamadam · Post by **iamadam** » Sun May 17, 2009 4:46 pm

Not that bad, if you forget the out of tune kick and the funny snare but i think the basics of the gain construction theory are there and working.
I've added some sub bass about 2db beneath the drums and well here's the link to have a listen.

I think i would have more sub bass in there. Thats me tho,

Part 1 is a example boosted to about 0db >!naughty!<

? Is this what some people would do before playing out pre mastered?

http://www.divshare.com/download/7407055-8de

Part 2 is a example reaching about -7db

http://www.divshare.com/download/7407056-7d5

PS Ranting is good for the soul

bellybelle · Post by **bellybelle** » Wed May 20, 2009 11:41 pm

please pardon the question if its been beaten to death here. i honestly did check the search option to solve this question and perhaps I'm not sure of what I should be looking for or not...

posting in this forum is at times very intimidating...

my question is this: I'm doing some experimentation with using samples as notes and building from there. I have a personal goal that I'd like to work at, that all of the notes are sampled from previous recordings--then recombined into a new track. Ok so.....if this is the case, should I need to eq the piece that heavily if i either don't use any reverb or anything like that, or, at the most, might be pitching a sample up or down a little bit?

I'm really sorry if this has been asked. I did a search for samples and I found a lot of really great links. Same with checking the production bible. Lots of good links....but maybe if it was answered before, thats why I missed it.

gain structure and mixing aka THE MONEYSHOT THREAD

Drum Kit Gain Construction

Drum Kit Gain Construction Part 2

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