Question on bpm, keys and beatmatching

[dan_thompson07]

Bringing in tunes - If you listen to the track enough, you'll know it like the back of your hand. That too is a case of personal preference, getting a breakdown and an intro to drop at the same time is a double drop, popular mixing technique.


Hope that helps.

No your wrong, double drops are a hugely contentious issue and your confusing simple regular structured mixing with arguably the most debated mixing technique out there, well it used to be in dnb anyways, its a really tricky technique that almost always sounds crap, finding two tracks that double drop together well (i.e both basslines start at the same time but work together in a rhythm without conflict) is like the holy grail of mixing.

sorry to be pedantic, just wanted to clear that up.


Drop (music)
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The drop is the point in a track where a switch of rhythm or bassline occurs and usually follows a recognizable build section and break.

In hip hop and electronica, the proceeding reintroduction of the full bass line and drums is known as the drop.
[edit] Double drop

In drum and bass, skilled DJs sometimes perform what is called the "double drop": beatmatching two tracks in a way that the drop, and hence the respective climaxes, occur at the same time.

I'm not so sure this is always the case? As long as the tracks are in key, EQ is applied correctly and the drums don't clash too badly you should be ok. My 2 favourite tunes to mix at the moment is skream - filth into whys everything in mono by benga. I stumbled across it by accident and as long as i cut the bass enough on the track im mixing out of (benga) the double drop sounds fucking ace. I'm pretty sure this only works well because of the simple 1st and 3rd beat drums of filth though. Try it!

[djsupple]

No need to complicate things, just get the beat matching down first. Their is no set formula for the eqs as every tune is differnt. You will find that some tunes simply dont work together and others go together like peaches and cream.

Just use your ears, and put the hours in. your not going to get good overnight.

The more mixing you do the better you will get (within reason). Also the more you experiment the more creative you will get. Its just about enjoying what you are doing and the rest will come in time.

GOOD LUCK

edit: this tread makes mixing sound harder than it actually is, really its about training your ears to know what sounds right and what sounds wrong.

[Dubzteppa]

so am i right to be matching the snares when i mix two tunes together? it seems the easiest and most obvious way to beatmach.. is this right?

[wilson]

so am i right to be matching the snares when i mix two tunes together? it seems the easiest and most obvious way to beatmach.. is this right?

It's up to you mate. I tend to use the snare in hip hop, but the first beat (or kick) in D'n'B. Haven't tried mixing dubstep before but I'd imagine I'd go with the snare, cos their usually so ridiculously snappy so it's easy to hear

[Dubzteppa]

so am i right to be matching the snares when i mix two tunes together? it seems the easiest and most obvious way to beatmach.. is this right?

It's up to you mate. I tend to use the snare in hip hop, but the first beat (or kick) in D'n'B. Haven't tried mixing dubstep before but I'd imagine I'd go with the snare, cos their usually so ridiculously snappy so it's easy to hear

ah right cheers, thought so, it just seems to be the obvious thing to do.. anyone else got any mixing tips for a noob dj?

im getting better thanks to all this help haha, i never imagined a forum could actually be of any help thanks everyone!

[Dubzteppa]

so am i right to be matching the snares when i mix two tunes together? it seems the easiest and most obvious way to beatmach.. is this right?

It's up to you mate. I tend to use the snare in hip hop, but the first beat (or kick) in D'n'B. Haven't tried mixing dubstep before but I'd imagine I'd go with the snare, cos their usually so ridiculously snappy so it's easy to hear

ah right cheers, thought so, it just seems to be the obvious thing to do.. anyone else got any mixing tips for a noob dj?

im getting better thanks to all this help haha, i never imagined a forum could actually be of this much help thanks everyone!

[little boh peep]

anyone else got any mixing tips for a noob dj?

On DJing technique: http://www.dubstepforum.com/dj-techniqu ... t6906.html

On key mixing: http://www.dubstepforum.com/keymixing-t20410.html

[Dubzteppa]

anyone else got any mixing tips for a noob dj?

On DJing technique: http://www.dubstepforum.com/dj-techniqu ... t6906.html

On key mixing: http://www.dubstepforum.com/keymixing-t20410.html

thanks that frist thread helped quite alot.. just one question, by snare i mean the 'tsk' in the beat pattern, its basically always the loudest part of the beat pattern.. this is the snare isnt it?

and if its better to beatmatch by lining up the kicks, is their any easy way to identify these? as in alot of tracks they barely even exist (or are really quiet) with just the 'tsk' every four beats keeping consistantly noticable throughout most of the track.

are these ditinctive 'tsk' beats the kicks? or the snares? ultimate noob question there sorry guys haha

[Dubzteppa]

anyone?

[ahier]

its not necessarily about the drums, drums can change for example producers might put a snare on the 3rd beat, 4th beat, 2nd and 4th beat, many variations. what you need to learn about is how to count bars and bar structures in songs, so that you can recognise the 1st beat of the bar even with a syncopated drum beat. Coming from a background in music this has been drummed into me since the age of 5, so im not really sure on the best way to get used to it now. it sounds lame but a book that helped me was DJing for dummies (amazon it), it jus provided a basic introduction to the concepts of beatmatching, song structures, and all that jazz in a friendly format

[DRTY]

Kick is Low Frequency, the meaty sounding drum low in tone, Snare is Mid Frequency, the snappy/clappy sounding one.

Surely you know what a kick and snare sounds like?

I start off with the kick. By start off I mean beginning to match the cueing record (the one that's not playing) with the kick of the other one.

But sometimes It can be easier to switch to using the snares to match your beats as in almost every track they hit on the same beat in almost every bar.

At the end of the day though just experiment, it's better to teach yourself than trying to conform to other peoples' techniques. Just trial & error is your best bet, hammer it! Listen to all your tracks get to know them, where the bridges happen, how long until drops, etc etc etc.

Good luck!

[Dubzteppa]

Kick is Low Frequency, the meaty sounding drum low in tone, Snare is Mid Frequency, the snappy/clappy sounding one.

Surely you know what a kick and snare sounds like?

I start off with the kick. By start off I mean beginning to match the cueing record (the one that's not playing) with the kick of the other one.

But sometimes It can be easier to switch to using the snares to match your beats as in almost every track they hit on the same beat in almost every bar.

At the end of the day though just experiment, it's better to teach yourself than trying to conform to other peoples' techniques. Just trial & error is your best bet, hammer it! Listen to all your tracks get to know them, where the bridges happen, how long until drops, etc etc etc.

Good luck!

as i thought, just wasnt completely sure haha, so basically i can match the snares its just not always possible due to the patterning.. ive also got my head around bars and such, i think anyway, so a bar is one set of 1234 yes? and there are 16 bars in each part of the tune? and four of these? im think im getting there haha....

[deadly_habit]

it helps to have a natural ear, otherwise to get going god bless technology snag mixed in key software and take into consideration pitch shifting when it comes to bpm and learning some musical theory is a great tool to have in your arsenal
not all mixes need to be in key, just do what sounds right and flows naturally if that makes sense

[Big MD]

okay thanks

so is +1 on my cdj 1 bpm? so if one track is 143 i need to put the pitch to -3 in order to mix it to a 140 bpm track?

the only tempo to get that effect, that +1% speed = +1 bpm, is on 100bpm original tempo. so if you play dubstep on 140 bpm original tempo, it should bee 1,4 bpm per %

[deadly_habit]

oh yeah math is a nice skill to have as well when it comes to pitch

[Big MD]

yeah to mix whit help ofr splitted hearing, is the easyest way, but this must bee alearnd. math helped me arround the starting up to dj. today i use mostly math, when it comes to doubble or halftime mixing. it's verry useful for me.

[morigami]

as i thought, just wasnt completely sure haha, so basically i can match the snares its just not always possible due to the patterning.. ive also got my head around bars and such, i think anyway, so a bar is one set of 1234 yes? and there are 16 bars in each part of the tune? and four of these? im think im getting there haha....

Here's a little diagram to give you a visual idea of how mixing the different patterns work:

Mixing half-time with half-time:

1 2 3 4
Half-time: K-------S--------
Half-time: K-------S--------

Mixing full-time with full-time:
1 2 3 4
Full-time: K---S---K---S---
Full-time: K---S---K---S---

(Note that all full-time drum beats will have a kick on beat 3)

Mixing full-time with half-time:

1 2 3 4
Full-time: K---S---K---S---
Half-time: K-------S--------

As you can see, the only sound that is the consistently the same when mixing full-time with half-time is the first kick of the bar on beat one. So in terms of drums and snares, you only have one thing each bar in which to beat-match by. Having a full-time snare can be easier for beat-matching because you generally have 3 things in each bar to beat-match by - kick on beat 1 and a snare on beats 2 and 4. If you're starting out, just stick to mixing either half with half, or full with full.

Music structures on tunes vary massively so that's where knowing your tunes comes in handy. You can mix two tunes together and get a good mix, but if you know exactly when it's best to mix the two, then you can get a great mix out of them. Some producers, rather annoyingly, like chucking in the odd random structure which is where knowing your tunes is a must. A few of my vinyl have an extra two bars before the first drop, some 4 bar intros, and many have just eight bar breakdowns.

edit: the beat numbers wont line up with the drum patterns after submitting, so just imagine they're over the patterns.

[Dubzteppa]

just watching a show on getdarker tv, man id love to be talked through every move they do! its annoying trying to teach yourself to DJ.. but this thread has helped no end though guys, big up!

thanks and respect out to all of you!

[Dubzteppa]

hey again, just got a question on EQs,

when mixing, where abouts do you keep the treble mids and bass once a track is fully in? i tend to wind the bass up right the way, keep the mids full also, and run the highs about 3 quarters.. am i right to be doing this? well, i know it works fine and sounds good (no distortion) on my set up.. but at gigs ive noticed people tend to keep them around half.. what is the norm out and about

cheers all

[deadly_habit]

if it's a perfectly made tune and rig they should all be set at unity gain
otherwise based off your first tune. it's called mixing for a reason heh