dubplate culture...

Post by **dubway** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:20 am

dubmugga wrote:u must be gettin the good stuff on CDR dubway while we still pay for vinyl...

not really.. 90% of my collection is on vynil

Post by **dubway** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:49 am

as RR already told..
i can't explain you feeling when i hear new coki's tune on rinse.. an the fact that i will not ever have it in my hands (or if i get lucky - in a year or so) is only increasing the desire ("and leads to fetishising"!)

Zefa wrote:...if the music's good then why not share it...

i can't give you answer to that question cos it's not my music
you should ask that producers

Zefa wrote:...how did you get in to dubstep...i guess you heard a tune and thought, rah, this is it!! Then went looking for more tunes to buy...

but there is a lot tunes out to buy today.. so it shouldn't be a problem anymore.. at least now there is a enough dubstep releases.. they are not the newest tunes but they are great still.. (well, maybe not so great if you haven't wait for them for two years.. but they are for me)

but to answer your question.. yeah.. i heard a lot of tunes that i couldn't buy.. but that didn't make me leave dubstep - quite opposite - it made me even more attracted to this exclusive, egzotic, wierd, small, underground sound.. sounds stupid but "Though most people prefer to think of themselves as autonomous consumers, scarcity has a psychological effect on most that generates desire."

dubmugga · Post by **dubmugga** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:58 am

I don't feel the need to own a tune I just need to hear it and like it cos afterall it's only music...

...here today gone tomorrow only to be replaced by the next big thing

then again I don't play out or buy vinyl but my fellow hell scientist does...

so dubway the 10 percent that isn't on vinyl would be the exclusive pre release latest shit yeah ??? :shock:

Post by **dubway** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:13 am

dubmugga wrote:...here today gone tomorrow only to be replaced by the next big thing

well, you answerd to your own question

i don't throw my old tunes away. you would probably understand this if you have only a handful of tunes and they are on vynil (and you payed 5 UKP for tune, and you waited them for months) - i will play these tunes to my kids!
and if you just download milion newest mp3s a day (which you even forgot to name after the artist) you forget them as soon as 10 new tunes came in your playlist.. well, that's how it is with me..

seckle · Post by **seckle** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:16 am

dubplate culture is older and wiser than cdj's, final scratch, the internet or soulseeking could ever be. now that message boards like this ,aim, msn and soulseek are around, the record store's don't have the control anymore. producers that put their blood, sweat and tears into the music guard the product. do you blame them?
the way i see it is this. everyone's got to make a choice. either you want to support dubplate culture, the shops, the labels, the producers, the dj's of the scene........or you want to tear it all down, get on soulseek, steal the music, share it with your mates and generally send a big fuck you to everybody.
that's one of the huge problem's with many dj's today. no one has patience. everyone wants everything yesterday, and when they do get something in their hands they get bored of it in 5 days. i never understand it.
be thankful there is a scene to support, wait for the releases and buy the music you love.
larry levan " if you can't afford to buy the vinyl, you shouldn't be a dj. period."

Post by **dubway** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:23 am

dubmugga wrote:so dubway the 10 percent that isn't on vinyl would be the exclusive pre release latest shit yeah ??? :shock:

well, you should first recalculate how many dubstep releases there are.. and you'll see that there's nothing shocking here

descent · Post by **descent** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 2:43 am

dubplate culture is a double edged sword that has been going on probably since the day the dj was recognized for what the dj does, amongst other things, promote music.

as i see it, being a dj that has been buying records for about 8 or 9 years, most of them being limited pressings, I get, at times, frustrated by the fact that I can't play this or that track that i've been feeling for months, to my audience, cause it won't see the light of day for ages and maybe never will.

But at the same time I understand that the day i get to buy that record is the day i do two great things. I get to share that which I have felt for quite some time, with a mostly innocent audience and I get to support the artist that helped create that moment.

the artist has to make a living and supporting that artist in this particular case is the dj mostly, not forgetting that the djs in themselves are artists of course - I'm sure all djs here were happy that first time they got paid for a gig. i know i was, instantly made up for the the 4 years i didn't.

supporting the artist of course is also the person that doesn't dj or produce, and their support comes from buying what releases they can on whatever format they want. if they also support the dj, whether they're the dj that gets those hot dub cds (which i am not by the way), or they're the dj that buys the releases, they are creating the opportunity for more people to hear the sound. this of course leads to more interest, more releases, more exposure and so on and so on. and we all benefit.

support the music, anyway you can.

rickyricardo · Post by **rickyricardo** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:00 am

Dubstep is just too small to be a beat factory like house music or even drum'n'bass. Hype has to play a critical factor if the sound is going to spread. And that is why dubplate culture exists....to generate hype.

In an ideal world, a music's popularity would spread on it's merits alone, but as they say "There is always someone, somewhere making the best music that you've never heard"

Edit:
Also, I'm of a mind that actually having *less* tunes to play increases the appreciation of the ones that you do have. I noticed back when I used to buy alot of jungle (as in, weekly batches) that the tunes which were "hot" were only "hot" until the next "hot" tune came around...and then slowly buy surely certain tunes start working their way to the back of your crate never to be heard from again. Not saying everyone is like this, but most jungle DJ's I know barely even touch stuff in their crates that's older than two years.

That's not to say that I don't play my new dubstep more than my old dubstep (I do), but the staggered releases of dubstep allow me time to mix up my collection more...and form greater appreciation for the older stuff, while not worry so much about grabbing the new stuff (since most of what I would want isn't even out, yet).

Also, being someone that's living on a budget...it's nice that dubstep isn't nearly as demanding on my wallet

ufo over easy · Post by **ufo over easy** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:05 am

seckle wrote: larry levan " if you can't afford to buy the vinyl, you shouldn't be a dj. period."

That's well fair.

I'll never understand why you place so much importance in money...

Post by **dubway** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 9:38 am

RickyRicardo wrote:Dubstep is just too small to be a beat factory like house music or even drum'n'bass. Hype has to play a critical factor if the sound is going to spread. And that is why dubplate culture exists....to generate hype.

In an ideal world, a music's popularity would spread on it's merits alone, but as they say "There is always someone, somewhere making the best music that you've never heard"

Edit:
Also, I'm of a mind that actually having *less* tunes to play increases the appreciation of the ones that you do have. I noticed back when I used to buy alot of jungle (as in, weekly batches) that the tunes which were "hot" were only "hot" until the next "hot" tune came around...and then slowly buy surely certain tunes start working their way to the back of your crate never to be heard from again. Not saying everyone is like this, but most jungle DJ's I know barely even touch stuff in their crates that's older than two years.

That's not to say that I don't play my new dubstep more than my old dubstep (I do), but the staggered releases of dubstep allow me time to mix up my collection more...and form greater appreciation for the older stuff, while not worry so much about grabbing the new stuff (since most of what I would want isn't even out, yet).

Also, being someone that's living on a budget...it's nice that dubstep isn't nearly as demanding on my wallet

you talk like sugar

that's what i wanted to say

thinking · Post by **thinking** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 9:59 am

Dubplate culture is A&R for labels - the tunes that go down best are the ones to release. When we sent round the first Vex'd CDs to a handful of the 'big' DJs, it was Lion & Pop Pop that were getting cut by them, Lion & Pop Pop that we were hearing when we went to Fwd>>, so it was logical that Pinch chose these two tunes to be released as Subtext 001 & 002.

I don't have a problem with dubplate culture at all, it's preferable to the alternative of complete non-exclusivity of music. The negative aspects piss me off though:

I detest this elitism over dubs/CDs. Yeah dubs sound crisp for about the first ten plays, after that they start to sound terrible. Plus at Subloaded in April, we had a monster system, and the older acetates just couldn't cope with the bass and skipped. 95% couldn't tell the difference between a dubplste or a CD in a club situation (and the other 5% only when the system is top quality and well tuned), plus CDJs can't and don't feedback/skip due to volume. Frankly, if it's good enough for some of the world's top DJs, in every single genre of underground music, it's good enough for me.

Also, some DJs take the elitism of dubplate culture too far IMO - only plyaing a select few producers' beats or, even worse, playing beats by a certain producer even if it's wack, just because it's by this particular person/crew. This does nothing to push the scene forward, and only serves to hinder its expansion.

paulie · Post by **paulie** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 11:51 am

ThinKing wrote:I detest this elitism over dubs/CDs. Yeah dubs sound crisp for about the first ten plays, after that they start to sound terrible. Plus at Subloaded in April, we had a monster system, and the older acetates just couldn't cope with the bass and skipped. 95% couldn't tell the difference between a dubplste or a CD in a club situation (and the other 5% only when the system is top quality and well tuned), plus CDJs can't and don't feedback/skip due to volume. Frankly, if it's good enough for some of the world's top DJs, in every single genre of underground music, it's good enough for me.

Also, some DJs take the elitism of dubplate culture too far IMO - only plyaing a select few producers' beats or, even worse, playing beats by a certain producer even if it's wack, just because it's by this particular person/crew. This does nothing to push the scene forward, and only serves to hinder its expansion.

100% agree. It really does get pathetic with some people. Then you hear their arguments and they have no clue what they're talking about!

zefa · Post by **zefa** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:04 pm

Descent wrote:
I get, at times, frustrated by the fact that I can't play this or that track that i've been feeling for months, to my audience, cause it won't see the light of day for ages and maybe never will.

But at the same time I understand that the day i get to buy that record is the day i do two great things. I get to share that which I have felt for quite some time, with a mostly innocent audience and I get to support the artist that helped create that moment.

support the music, anyway you can.

This is what i was trying to say...you said it better!!

I think everyone here is coming from the same angle...we all love dubstep and i do enjoy going shopping and getting a tune that hasnt seen the light of day for ages eg Skream's Skunkstep and Acid People...hasn't been off my turntable since it arrived yesterday!!

spaceboy · Post by **spaceboy** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:08 pm

I use cd's because its much quicker for me to cue them up...and i need that with my style of mixing.

i do agree that dubplates create a more wholesome sound - but if u get wav's of the tunes ur playin onto cd then your ok as well.

dunno about others but i aint rich enough to cut dubs on the regular which is what i'd have to do...to stay competitive (and not use cd's)

orson · Post by **orson** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 2:52 pm

UFO over easy wrote:
dubmugga wrote: Y: Each to their own but to be honest, it aint even a case of whether you prefer CD or dubplate; it actually sounds better on a dub and that's the bottom line. Dubplate sounds better, someone's mastered it for you more or less, whereas if you play it straight from a CD, it hasn't been touched. The benefit of having a dubplate is that you've got sound through a needle which is totally different to a digital sound and you've got the bonus of a dub being warm. All of them things just piss over CD.

Maybe that'd be true if he started cutting dubs somewhere that doesn't completely kill the top end and make it sound like pillow case music.

yo ufo .. where you get that from ??? .. to me youngstas dubs sound good .. i mean the whole dunbstep allstars mix by him was mixed with dubs .. right .. and they sound great if you compare them to the actual vinyl release's like the d1 or neverland tune

paulie · Post by **paulie** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:05 pm

orson wrote:
UFO over easy wrote:
dubmugga wrote: Y: Each to their own but to be honest, it aint even a case of whether you prefer CD or dubplate; it actually sounds better on a dub and that's the bottom line. Dubplate sounds better, someone's mastered it for you more or less, whereas if you play it straight from a CD, it hasn't been touched. The benefit of having a dubplate is that you've got sound through a needle which is totally different to a digital sound and you've got the bonus of a dub being warm. All of them things just piss over CD.

Maybe that'd be true if he started cutting dubs somewhere that doesn't completely kill the top end and make it sound like pillow case music.
yo ufo .. where you get that from ??? .. to me youngstas dubs sound good .. i mean the whole dunbstep allstars mix by him was mixed with dubs .. right .. and they sound great if you compare them to the actual vinyl release's like the d1 or neverland tune

You reckon dubs sound better than finished vinyl?

Sorry, no.

And, yes, badly cut dubs often omit a lot of top end.

baz · Post by **baz** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:29 pm

what sort of mastering is done to a tune before it's cut to dubplate? is it much like the mastering a tune gets before a "proper" vinyl release?

reza · Post by **reza** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:39 pm

dubplates? all about CDs these days as far as I can make out...

paulie · Post by **paulie** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:44 pm

baz wrote:what sort of mastering is done to a tune before it's cut to dubplate? is it much like the mastering a tune gets before a "proper" vinyl release?

Depends who/where does it. They certainly don't spend as long as they (in my experience) do for a proper release.

reza wrote:dubplates? all about CDs these days as far as I can make out...

In the real world, you're right.

ufo over easy · Post by **ufo over easy** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 4:04 pm

ThinKing wrote: I detest this elitism over dubs/CDs. Yeah dubs sound crisp for about the first ten plays, after that they start to sound terrible. Plus at Subloaded in April, we had a monster system, and the older acetates just couldn't cope with the bass and skipped. 95% couldn't tell the difference between a dubplste or a CD in a club situation (and the other 5% only when the system is top quality and well tuned), plus CDJs can't and don't feedback/skip due to volume. Frankly, if it's good enough for some of the world's top DJs, in every single genre of underground music, it's good enough for me.

Also, some DJs take the elitism of dubplate culture too far IMO - only plyaing a select few producers' beats or, even worse, playing beats by a certain producer even if it's wack, just because it's by this particular person/crew. This does nothing to push the scene forward, and only serves to hinder its expansion.

Good post, agree with all of it.

dubplate culture...

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