how to create thick basslines by splitting freq. in ableton?

[yamaz]

Im trying to get a nice sounding thick bassline, and I have tried to follow a couple threads on this but I cannot seem to get the desired effect. I'm using massive and ableton.

I put massive on midi track 1 and route audio to track 2, 3 ,4 and reroute all those to final track 5. I tried splitting frequencies with auto filter on each of the 2,3,4 tracks and then putting different effects on each one, like chorus, reverb and delay. But it doesn't come out as clean.

Not sure if I'm not splitting right, or maybe using wrong effects on each band? I've heard people using send sitting to get this effect, is this better? Should I be using 3 seperate instruments for each band like a sine sub for low, gritty distorted saw-square for mid and some glistening triangle/sine type for highs?

If anyone has an ableton template file for me to dissect, that might help the best....

Thx guys!

[jobbanaught]

Theres an effect rack out there called "SweepableCrossover", which has the EQs specially calibrated to make the freq splitting transparent. transparent means if you dont fx the splitted channels, the sum will be EXACTLY the same as the original sound, so the splitting itself does not change the sound. Best tool for the job, imo. Nees only one track, just put FX in the rack to affect either Low or High frequencies. And if you need more bands, just put another crossover IN the rack and you have splitted the signal again (and again, and again, and...)

[jsills]

^^^ nice one, ill have to check for that, sounds perfect.

i use my own template. load 3 sends filtered to their respective ranges (30-95hz, 95 to 800hz, and +800hz, or there abouts depending on the sound). i then route the sound i want to effect to sends only and manipulate. then resample the output of the 3 sends solo'ed. pretty quick and that way you can route any sound you want thru and manipulate as you like.

[yamaz]

Sweet, I will look for that and give it a try. Any tips for what kind of effects and what freq. band to apply those said effects? An I right in thinking one should not apply any effects to the low end besides making it mono?

[jsills]

Sweet, I will look for that and give it a try. Any tips for what kind of effects and what freq. band to apply those said effects? An I right in thinking one should not apply any effects to the low end besides making it mono?

aha, the question within the question. again typical guidelines not set in stone:
lowest freqs ill make mono, compress if needed, maybe a little eq but probably not. thats about it.
mid freqs is where i distort or saturate, compress, add chorus, etc etc whatever until your heart is content. then eq
hi freqs, phase, chorus, saturate, reverb possibly. and make sure the highs are clean sounding and not harsh to the ear, tooo much distortion and white noise will fuck up your end product.
and then you can adjust how much volume is going to each band to balance them.

with the effects chains just experiment as much as possible and if you find a cool chain post it here and let us know whats up.

[jobbanaught]

Theres lots of possible fx you could use. Personally,i like to keep the sub as dry as possible, just using some compression. For the mids and highs, careful distortion, and some movement created by either a flanger/phaser or chorus/delay (try using the filter delay in Live). Reverb and compress. Try not to clutter everything up by using all of the possible effects, but rather find a combination that works good together. If the sound becomes to full anyway, sometimes carefully placed notch filters work wonders and add some nice grit to the sound

[yamaz]

Awesome, you guys rock This should get me going on the right path.

One last area of confusion remains. With the routing in ableton, once everthing is routed to final bus, in my case, track 5, do you put any eq, compression, reverb or something else on it, to gel it all together? Also do you have to resample at this point or is it best to do this to save on clutter and cpu usage? If one chooses to resample, does it matter which note you keep, like say the root note of your key your playing in, or does it not really matter much?

[moki]

Man that rack is insanley awesome!! saves lots of time.

[maelstrom99]

That rack is in ableton 8? Not seeing it, suite only?

[gh02]

That rack is in ableton 8? Not seeing it, suite only?

it's on the ableton forum..you'll find it on google. Huge possibilities!

[WeBang]

I just put Massive on 1 Track eq our anything lower then 120 add what effects I like. Then I send it to a return A and B. on A I will take a 3 eq and set it to only play Mids. on return B I will put 3 EQ and set it to Highs only.

I like to put flangers/Phasers to what sounds cool right before both EQs on the Returns.

[yamaz]

Webang-do you add a second track for massive sine bass only and low pass cut at 120 hz then?

[vly]

Just use Operator for a sub..massive takes a lot of your cpu so not rly a good idea to use it just for a sine wave.

[yamaz]

Fuck me, no buyeth thy suite and so no haveth thine operator goodness!

[WeBang]

Webang-do you add a second track for massive sine bass only and low pass cut at 120 hz then?

I add a sine from Z3ta but don't really cut it all the way to 120. But I do layer a sibe under the massive track.


The reason I gut at 120 is becasue I want to cut the main sub freq. Depending on the Key Ill cut from 120 to 140

[rook]

This thread is a bit old, but as I was goolging some Ableton split stuff and stumbled upon this post, I figured I'd share my way.

It's really easy, allows saving of your fx chains, and is just about transparent.

Make an effect rack
Put a multiband compressor into it.
Set the amount to 0%
Set your crossovers.
Solo one of the bands (low/mid/high)

Next, create another chain in the effect rack, and copy over that same multiband, but solo the next band.
Copy once more and you should have 3 channels now in the effect rack. Your lows, mids, highs. Usually helps to name accordingly.

After that, setup is over, you have the 3 bands to work with independently. Just drag plugins and order them however on each respective band.

Sometimes if the sound is getting too messy I'll copy the multiband that splits the freqs at the beginning of the chain, to the end of the same, thus cutting the same ones again. It can be a bit hard to balance, but can also produce some really tight sounds.

Once you have some rad fx chains, name the fx rack, and make a folder for your splitters, and every time you make a chain that sounds cool, toss it in, saved fo-evah.

Also, sometimes I'll go micro on it. Usually it's overkill, but going into the mid band (usually) and splitting it again, but with different crossovers.

[th@-pu$$y]

You can really fatten the sound in massive. It's really easy. Route your tops to filter 1, and your sub to filter 2. Make sure F1 and F2 are running parallel,Then do what ya do with whatever sound ya is making. At this point, I've found that the on board Dimension expander if used moderately, along with turning the boost in the on board EQ menu up just a little bit works wonders. I know it sounds cheesy, but sometimes the most effective answer is the simple one. Not to say that freq splitting is not the route to go......this is just a really good first step. (Quick side note: To get the sub to wobble along with the top, just drag the same lfo envelope that is assigned to the top to the box with the minus sign to the amp knob and match the poliarity).