Prince Says The “Internet Is Over” And No Longer “Hip”.

[wirez]

@wirez

if you hate the internet so much maybe you shouldn't use it?

Truth. In later life I aim not to!

i love the effect internet has had on music, i don't care about woolworths closing down they were shit anyways. it's unfortunate a lot of indie record stores have gone down but then my local one is still going strong and has even started stocking more vinyl and more variety in the last 2/3 years . so i think there is definitely something to be said for good stores being able to keep their shit going.

I still fail to see what good the internet has done for music. In honesty music was doing just fine with the old school commercial vs. underground. The commercial artists were getting rich or getting screwed for not getting a decent lawyer, fair play to them. The underground artists were still making a lot more profit through pirate radio advertisement etc. There was still plenty of music to listen to, just with a decent filter system of pirate radio DJ's deciding whether or not music was worth being played.

In argument of the internet being good for music; the amount of shit music now being made on cracked copies of FL is something to think about. The internet may well be full of brilliant music, but my bet is that those musicians would still be being heard to the same if not more potential without the internet. Now we have to dig through shit to find good music. Yay!

i love the fact that learning anything has become so simple

This is a point well made. BUT, I still find a lot more in depth information from books and trust their information more than the internets, where there's a massive amount of contradiction everywhere.

i love the fact that loads of people who previously didn't have friends now have loads, they may only speak to these people through teamspeak and meet up once a year but hey, at least they now have a social circle. i love the fact things like second life exist, and that if i wanted i could go hang out in a virtual ankh-morpork that someone has meticulously modelled.

I'd far rather go to a field and run around with a cardboard box on my head pretending to be Buzz Lightyear. Come on! Everybody can find friends in real life. Things like Second Life are a waste of time and potential. These people devoting time to role playing weird shit should make movies, art or something else that would be remembered.

i love the fact that people's passions now have a place to be aired, no longer does someone make something cool and it sits in their basement for a while then gets broken up into pieces for the next project. now that project can blaze round the internet for a few months and make people smile and appreciate that persons creation.

If somebody is passionate about something surely they'd be showing it off anyway?! I swear all these examples you're giving are of people who are already internet gamer geeks who are too anxious to go out into the real world and see what it's all about?

i love how the internet has accelerated progress in certain artforms, i'm sure it's happened in loads but the object manipulation scene (juggling/poi/staff/CJ) has literally rocketed since the net. people being in isolated places in the middle of nowhere, disconnected from everyone else into this niche past-time now have forums where they connect, where the technical aspects of the artform can be discussed, refined and concreted into foundations which can be built on. somebody can watch a video of someone a 100,000 miles away and be inspired by one particular aspect of that video then go away and extend this one aspect into a whole new family of moves, that scenario could happen within a week and the effect becomes exponential.

True, but damn it's ruined the opportunity to travel the world and teach people your skills. There was a time when you'd be funded to do so in benefit of your countries economy.

[wirez]

And fuck tl:dr, people who say this will never learn anything to help them develop skills to progress away from the normal 9-5 shit life they live for somebody else's pocket and pleasure.

[Disco Nutter]

@ wirez

Mate, if it hadn't been for the internet, a lot of the music that comes out from "underground" producers would never ever have been heard in places more distant then, let's say, London.

Let me tell you, that shops down here stock nothing but top40 music. You can't even find more-famous-but-not-mainstream hiphop or any other genre. Haven't been to one in ages, but I doubt it has changed.

I love the internet, because it gives me access to music, that I would most probably never had to without it.

[symmetricalsounds]

@wirez

if you hate the internet so much maybe you shouldn't use it?

Truth. In later life I aim not to!

why wait?

I still fail to see what good the internet has done for music. In honesty music was doing just fine with the old school commercial vs. underground. The commercial artists were getting rich or getting screwed for not getting a decent lawyer, fair play to them. The underground artists were still making a lot more profit through pirate radio advertisement etc. There was still plenty of music to listen to, just with a decent filter system of pirate radio DJ's deciding whether or not music was worth being played.

In argument of the internet being good for music; the amount of shit music now being made on cracked copies of FL is something to think about. The internet may well be full of brilliant music, but my bet is that those musicians would still be being heard to the same if not more potential without the internet. Now we have to dig through shit to find good music. Yay!

see i don't think this is true, i think there are plenty of people who would never have gotten near producing music if it hadn't of been so easy to pick up, i know a few who have gone onto do some big things. i don't mind the sifting, if it's shit skip it.

i love the fact that learning anything has become so simple

This is a point well made. BUT, I still find a lot more in depth information from books and trust their information more than the internets, where there's a massive amount of contradiction everywhere.

yes but textbooks are expensive, and personally i can't justify that expense if i don't even know i'm going to use all that info. you do get conflicting info on the net but some common sense seems to sort that out, plus once you have a grounding and feel like you do really want to get your teeth into something then you can justify spending the money on a good book.

i love the fact that loads of people who previously didn't have friends now have loads, they may only speak to these people through teamspeak and meet up once a year but hey, at least they now have a social circle. i love the fact things like second life exist, and that if i wanted i could go hang out in a virtual ankh-morpork that someone has meticulously modelled.

I'd far rather go to a field and run around with a cardboard box on my head pretending to be Buzz Lightyear. Come on! Everybody can find friends in real life. Things like Second Life are a waste of time and potential. These people devoting time to role playing weird shit should make movies, art or something else that would be remembered.

then go to your field buzz.

there is nothing wrong with all these people enjoying RPG games, if that's what they wanna do then cool.

not everyone has to leave a trail behind them as they move through life.

i love the fact that people's passions now have a place to be aired, no longer does someone make something cool and it sits in their basement for a while then gets broken up into pieces for the next project. now that project can blaze round the internet for a few months and make people smile and appreciate that persons creation.

If somebody is passionate about something surely they'd be showing it off anyway?! I swear all these examples you're giving are of people who are already internet gamer geeks who are too anxious to go out into the real world and see what it's all about?

not everyone that is passionate about creating something is also passionate about showing it off. some people just don't have that need, maybe they show a friend if they come over but that's about it.

seems your own issues about needing to create and show the world keep coming up.

True, but damn it's ruined the opportunity to travel the world and teach people your skills. There was a time when you'd be funded to do so in benefit of your countries economy.

bullshit, i know several people right now travelling the world doing poi workshops and i know for a fact that this wouldn't have been possible without the interner. for starters they would never have been able to get to the skill-level needed to do instruct the workshops, well not in the same timeframe, maybe 2/3 times longer without the net which equates to like 15-25 years. also without the net they wouldn't have been able to network with the different people round the world and recruit people for the workshops etc...

tell me how many countries really care about a few people spinning balls in socks? or rolling sticks around their bodies? noone does.

[Basic A]

then go to your field buzz.

there is nothing wrong with all these people enjoying RPG games, if that's what they wanna do then cool.

You cant seriously be argueing that social networking and RPG's can replace real, human, friendshsips and relationships while only 'seeing each othe once a year'...

NON-FUCKING-SENSE.

Studies show, you isolate us from other humans for only a week and we'll begin to develop minor delusions about our realities.

not everyone that is passionate about creating something is also passionate about showing it off. some people just don't have that need, maybe they show a friend if they come over but that's about it.

And how the hell can you say the internet helps these people? Your contradicting yourself alot here man. If people dont wanna show thier work off too more then a few friends, they wont, if people wanna show it too the world, they will. The internet plays no factor in that. It doesnt force shy people o upload tunes too it. Obviously, these people DO wanna show thier work, if they didnt, the internet would not make them any more likely too.

@ wirez

Mate, if it hadn't been for the internet, a lot of the music that comes out from "underground" producers would never ever have been heard in places more distant then, let's say, London.

Let me tell you, that shops down here stock nothing but top40 music. You can't even find more-famous-but-not-mainstream hiphop or any other genre. Haven't been to one in ages, but I doubt it has changed.

I love the internet, because it gives me access to music, that I would most probably never had to without it.

Well let me tell you, I was raised alot further outside the city then where I sit now. Our shops stocked fuck shit but top40 singles back there, hell betting they still havent changed.... really shops here dont stock much either =/... but, point is, well before they brought a computer into my house, well before I had access to any of this, I was in love with Ska and Punk... not top40, but underground artists I bet alot fo the people on here havent even heard of... How did this come too happen? Thier promoters gotit too me, without the internet for one... And two, people were travelling around, interacting with each other, and seeing the world, and then bringing these experiences back and giving them too me and my 10 yr old preteen friends. Now I do the same thing, and bring them home to the little kids here.

We didnt use 'Second Life' or the internet...

We got out, had real life experiences, and shared them socially with our peers and the kids.

Youll never argue against that man, becuase thats a BIIIIG part of why we're human, not the internet.

[jolly wailer]

zines were the shit

[Sirius]

[tell me how many countries really care about a few people spinning balls in socks?

my country!! thats where poi comes from!!
my 9 year old has been learning it for the last 3 years at school!!chea
poi e, poi e!

[symmetricalsounds]

[tell me how many countries really care about a few people spinning balls in socks?

my country!! thats where poi comes from!!
my 9 year old has been learning it for the last 3 years at school!!chea
poi e, poi e!

yeah you invented it but you guys didn't do anything with it, original NZ styles are boooring and wack IMO.

basic a - i'll answer you properly later, but i gotta get a train in a bit. in short though, i'm not arguing against social interaction, i'm just saying it's cool there are all these alternatives now.

[Sirius]

[tell me how many countries really care about a few people spinning balls in socks?

my country!! thats where poi comes from!!
my 9 year old has been learning it for the last 3 years at school!!chea
poi e, poi e!

yeah you invented it but you guys didn't do anything with it, original NZ styles are boooring and wack IMO.

basic a - i'll answer you properly later, but i gotta get a train in a bit. in short though, i'm not arguing against social interaction, i'm just saying it's cool there are all these alternatives now.

you obviously haven't seen senior competitions!! you know nada cuz!

[qwaycee_]

Let me tell you, that shops down here stock nothing but top40 music. You can't even find more-famous-but-not-mainstream hiphop or any other genre. Haven't been to one in ages, but I doubt it has changed.

I love the internet, because it gives me access to music, that I would most probably never had to without it.

yeah there was a time when this wasn't the case (or maybe it always was where you're at). but i used to be able to scoop underground/semi-underground stuff in the bigger music shops. i think when wu tang forever (for example) came out there were line ups and shit.

now only built 4 cuban linx 2 came out, me along with so many ppl had problems finding it around town. mans in toronto could only find it in one or two retailers. imagine how pissed of you would be if you went to the store trying to purchase new raekwon, but no! you can't! instead theres yonug jeezy, rick ross, paul wall and other such nonsense.

but of course, the internet solved that problem

[alphacat]

Just finished reading the BlancoMusic piece. Interesting counterpoint: there are a handful of things I think were not factored into his assessment, though, that need to be.

1) The advancement & proliferation of technology makes all this wistful nostalgia for the "good old days" of brick & mortar record companies irrelevant. Even if the record companies hadn't shot themselves [repeatedly] in their own foot (by raping artists and fans... like how cd's were supposed to eventually go down in price) - the advent of high capacity data storage and transmission technologies would've happened anyway, and we'd all be dealing with the same issue regardless of how unethically the industry as a whole has acted in the past.

2) While it's true that the democratization of music (both production & consumption) as a byproduct of this technology has:

A) destroyed the business model of the ancien régime,
B) allowed fools who shouldn't be permitted to touch a goddamn ukelele to release 200 half-produced shitsongs a year, most of them stealing others' hooks, and
C) made it more difficult than ever for sincere, artistic producers/songwriters to get any attention...

...maybe it's worth considering that these aren't all bad things entirely.

What the hell do I mean?

Well, the record industry fell apart under its own bloated weight, much like the Soviet Union. Too many people had come to expect a cut, which in turn was part of the reason things like cd prices never came down as promised. Managers, PR people, and let's not forget the fees of fucking LAWYERS. The old model was corrupt through and through - all it needed was a little push to completely lose relevance. Technology provided that push.

As for the great lumpen masses suddenly fancying themselves the next Timbaland: good! Because despite the very noticeable increase in overall mediocrity of music these days, it's also my opinion that there's more interesting shit going on right now than ever before as well. When I got into 'underground' music in High School in the late 80's (yes, I'm that old) there were a handful of really, really amazing artists doing amazing things, and then a second tier of pretty cool bands doing sort of interesting things, and then... Top 40. The number of acts in the first category were always a small fraction, maybe 1 or 2 percent of the total volume of available music. And guess what? It's still 1 or 2 percent, except that there are 10 to 20 times as many artists doing it. Net result? More interesting music, more envelopes being pushed, more innovation; dubstep is clearly a product of this egalitarian evolution too.

And when it's all said and done, it also seems to be that people are, ironically, discovering that technology in and of itself has nothing to do with writing a great song either. That still takes talent and discipline, which brings me to point C - the present scheme of things making it harder for the genuinely talented to get heard. In biology, do you know what the greatest catalyst for adaptive evolution is? C'mon, sure you do. It's competition for resources. Which is not to say that it was ever easy for an artist to get his songs heard before - but with increased competition - plus knowing that technology is only the vessel, not the captain - I believe that music is poised to evolve in a significant way and maybe even take some part of human evolution forward, too.

Things are up in the air right now. In a hundred years I'm curious as to how people might look back on this period, because it's sure gonna be different from how it is now... the same way that how it is now is profoundly different from where music was a hundred years in the past.

[wirez]

why wait?

I'm not really sure. Probably because our country doesn't offer much more beyond the internet Things will change as I progress through my career. I'm not denying we're in an age where the internet controls everything, I'm denying that the internet has done anything specifically good with exception of long distance communication. It's like mobile phones... You can take a phone, give it a load of pointless shit that people think they need because they've been programmed into thinking they'll be bored if not doing something (like the nobheads who go out on a social evening to the pub and sit there on Facebook on their iPhone updating their statuses about how they're sitting in a pub?!), when really the only substantial thing a mobile phone has done for us has allowed us to make phone calls or texts whilst away from the house

see i don't think this is true, i think there are plenty of people who would never have gotten near producing music if it hadn't of been so easy to pick up

Hear music, want to make music, try to make music regardless of how they're making it, progress... Can't see how it can work any differently? So you're telling me they downloaded the software and made music without any prior urge to making music? Doubt it, if they were interested in how music is made, they would have looked into it with or without the internet.

yes but textbooks are expensive, and personally i can't justify that expense if i don't even know i'm going to use all that info.

Never heard of a library?

This is more of a personal thing, but all knowledge is useful to me and I'd never defy learning anything.

there is nothing wrong with all these people enjoying RPG games, if that's what they wanna do then cool.

not everyone has to leave a trail behind them as they move through life.

True and true, I just feel it's wasted talent.

seems your own issues about needing to create and show the world keep coming up.

I hope you're not implying it's an issue that needs to be addressed.

bullshit, i know several people right now travelling the world doing poi workshops and i know for a fact that this wouldn't have been possible without the interner. for starters they would never have been able to get to the skill-level needed to do instruct the workshops, well not in the same timeframe, maybe 2/3 times longer without the net which equates to like 15-25 years.

So what is the internet offering? A magic time saving potion or some shit? I don't get this part

tell me how many countries really care about a few people spinning balls in socks? or rolling sticks around their bodies? noone does.

I said there was a time. The same time that countries actually valued the arts and crafts that came from their country and wanted to share these arts and crafts with the rest of the world in hope of attracting tourists and therefor money. Few care now, hence the increase in lack of passion and pride in peoples work.

[wirez]

@ wirez

Mate, if it hadn't been for the internet, a lot of the music that comes out from "underground" producers would never ever have been heard in places more distant then, let's say, London.

100 profit making sales from London vs. 10,000 YouTube views worldwide
You might think I'm only thinking about profit here, in fact I'm thinking about those 100 dedicated fans who enjoyed your music enough to buy it and will have a hard copy of it to pass to other people and you'd be known as a local legend

Let me tell you, that shops down here stock nothing but top40 music. You can't even find more-famous-but-not-mainstream hiphop or any other genre. Haven't been to one in ages, but I doubt it has changed.

I love the internet, because it gives me access to music, that I would most probably never had to without it.

I understand what you're saying. But maybe the lack of foreign underground music around would give local acts back their support from local music fans.

It's not like my discussion is going to stop the internet in any way, I'm just saying... People act like the world wouldn't turn without it anymore maybe things would be a little harder, but maybe local business might benefit from the lack of the internet.

[wirez]

Well let me tell you, I was raised alot further outside the city then where I sit now. Our shops stocked fuck shit but top40 singles back there, hell betting they still havent changed.... really shops here dont stock much either =/... but, point is, well before they brought a computer into my house, well before I had access to any of this, I was in love with Ska and Punk... not top40, but underground artists I bet alot fo the people on here havent even heard of... How did this come too happen? Thier promoters gotit too me, without the internet for one... And two, people were travelling around, interacting with each other, and seeing the world, and then bringing these experiences back and giving them too me and my 10 yr old preteen friends. Now I do the same thing, and bring them home to the little kids here.

We didnt use 'Second Life' or the internet...

We got out, had real life experiences, and shared them socially with our peers and the kids.

Youll never argue against that man, becuase thats a BIIIIG part of why we're human, not the internet.

It's like nursery rhymes. They didn't need the internet to survive and manage to reach the entire world, they were just passed down generation.

Or the potato It wasn't bought back to the UK over the internet!

[wirez]

I think I was born into the wrong era.

[kingGhost]

Any tool that allows people to communicate freely on a mass scale is not a bad thing. Especially with art. Saying that the internet wasn't good for music is like saying CD's were bad for music. Yes, you are an old fogey.

[abZ]

Any tool that allows people to communicate freely on a mass scale is not a bad thing. Especially with art. Saying that the internet wasn't good for music is like saying CD's were bad for music. Yes, you are an old fogey.

Well CDs where bad for music just like records before that and radio before that and sheet music before that etc. You and I have no idea how great music sounded before all this stuff when you only got to hear music on a rare occasion. I actually do agree with wirez on this point the oversaturation is not good no matter how you look at it. I think the Internet is good for other reasons tho. Anyway the Internet would be harmless If it wasn't for the people using it so it seems kinda silly to blame it. Humanity is always the problem.

[kingGhost]

Oversaturation is a non-issue to me, I have learned to filter what I like, dislike, and what I know is bullshit. Just because some guy is making utter crap music and promoting himself through myspace or whatever, doesn't mean you or anyone else has to listen to it. And who knows, maybe that guy will get better with practice and make good tracks one day, due to the experience and insight he gains from the internet. I'd rather have it this way than have music be some super exclusive thing that you have to be wealthy or lucky to come across and/or create. Think about 200+ years ago. Do you think a normal person could take the time to learn the violin, or piano? No, they didn't have to waste on that, they had to go work on their dad's pig farm or something like that, so they could eat. It's not that way any more for a normal person (well, in developed countries anyway) ... there's a lot more outlets for artistic talent. I think it's amazing.


Ya'll still some old fogeys...

[back2onett]

If it wasn't for the internet I would without a doubt be unemployed, most likely would be a college dropout and probably would have sold all my guitars for drugs, with that said I think the internet is good

I guess in some ironic way, spending a load of time on the internet has helped me see more of the world

[wirez]

Humanity is always the problem.

Hence my rants about self discipline hehe