Modulating the Reese

[stereotactic]

Loving this track (Triage on fire right now, heavy duty tunage).

My question is regarding the reese that comes in at the end of every 8 bars once the tune drops (the same reese in the intro before it abruptly stops before the drop). How is it modulated? It seems to snake about all over the shop but I can't quite make out exactly what is doing it, though I am sure LFO to cut off/WT/distortion etc is a safe bet, I can't put my finger on it but would very much like to learn how to make such disgusting sounds

As always, any pointers greatly appreciated, getting enough knowledge on this forum for real.

Cheers!

[kaiori breathe]

I've seen similar sounds made before in some renoise project files. Using automation on the eq. A peak around 1khz then slide it up to 5k anytime you want that woooaaaahhh sound. I don't think there's anything changing with the distortion. I could be very wrong here though. So I'd wait for somebody else to pitch in.

[Wrigzilla]

Here's some general tips for getting that moving reese sound:

You want to start with something that is full of harmonics so that's 2 preferably 3 oscillators, bit of detuning and some unison. I've found it's good to have at least one of the oscillators an octave above or below the others (or all 3 playing in different octaves but with the unison for movement you get from subtle detuning).

Subtle pitchbending can work wonders in adding movement as can a bit of chorus.

You'll want to split the reese up into 3 different frequency bands, so you can balance it to taste and then distort ect. Now resample your note and load it up into your sampler of choice.

What you want to do now is to use EQ or notch/peak filters to sweep through the freqencies. When you find a "sweet" spot set the cutoff around there and get lfo's, envelopes or automation to get some movement around there.

Resample, rinse and repeat until things are really moving.

Then start thinking about using low pass/band pass filters to get further movement.


Also this thread on DOA is worth checking out http://www.dogsonacid.com/showthread.ph ... did=298904

Also try bouncing several different versions of the same reese but with different lfo/envelope/automation settings and then cutting and pasting them together into move unusual forms.

[stereotactic]

Thanks for the replies fella's.

Looks like resampling is the way to go, I don't do this much at all tbh, perhaps it's about time I started.

Any further insights or tips, let us know!

Cheers

[daft cunt]

Triage rules, they make massive tunage & basslines. I can hardly get my reeses to sound that good but here are my 2 cents.
The key here is having a lot of movement, so anything goes : notch filter, phaser, flanger, chorus, frequency band shifting in a multiband distortion plug like Ohmicide, vowel/phaser filters (Kontakt), ring modulation, reverb, everything you can think of.
But you do not want to go too crazy on the wet/dry knob, it's better to add a small amount each time so it doesn't get messy after using a couple of effects.
Also, in my experience it's better to resample everytime you add something rather than having long effects chains. That way you have many versions of your sound so you can always go back to a previous one that sounds better and you also have better control over your sound.

Imo splitting frequencies is useful for keeping the sub+bass area clean & compressed but for upper frequencies, multiband distortion and careful usage of other effects makes splitting unnecessary (perhaps it'll have more weight if I tell you Noisia only splits in 2 bands as well). So usually I cut at 150 Hz with a very steep filter so there's no gap between the 2 bands. Mono the bass band and compress to get rid of the volume amplitude due to the detuning. Other effects go in the upper band.

Also, distortion and other effects bring out unwanted frequencies so it's important to EQ your sound regularly. Parametric EQs are best for this, set a narrow Q, boost by 6 or 9 dB, sweep until you reach an unpleasant spot then cut by the appropriate amount. It makes it easier than cutting then sweeping.
Personally, it took me a while to start having an idea of where to cut. A/B with professional basslines may help.

Feel free to post your experiments

[Moxxiedubstep]

You really dont need to constantly resample anymore for a decent dark reese sound.Constant resampling is WAY overrated. you can make all these "resampled" dark reese sounds with Z3ta ,multidynamic splitting and expanders. if you need to "resample" more than 20 times, get a new computer.

[Basic A]

So usually I cut at 150 Hz with a very steep filter so there's no gap between the 2 bands

Hmmm Ive recently learned this is a bad thing... filters are not linear phase eqs, and thierfore, regardless of how you set the curve really, thier values, once summed back together after splitting frequencies, will not add properly, and youll have altered the sound. Try it with your method, split the frequencies, and then route them back to a final bus, and compare the before and after sound, without any effects on them, jus the split and summed signal vs. the signal.

Now open a multiband compressor, and adjust the frequency bands to where you need them to split, and save this as a preset/patch... route your signal to however many mixer channels you normally would to split frequencies, and then rather then putting and eq or a filter to split, open the multiband compressor preset on each new mixer insert, and solo the bands one by one, so they split through the compressors.

Now compare the a-b of your orignal signal and the summed value of the multiband compressors, and they should sound virtually identical, granted you are at same relative gain and the compressor isnt made to warm or color.

This is really effecient, and I thank Depone for pointing my error out hear, and I think itseven more important in a Reece context then your average brostep bass. Reece's are delicate sounds, they rely on some pretty interesting movement from additive synthesis, and tampering with the phase in sucha delicate sound can lead to bad results if not careful. After dep pointed my error here, reece's were the first thing that became more clear, in the frequency splitting aspect at least.

[yamaz]

This is really effecient, and I thank Depone for pointing my error out hear, and I think itseven more important in a Reece context then your average brostep bass. Reece's are delicate sounds, they rely on some pretty interesting movement from additive synthesis, and tampering with the phase in sucha delicate sound can lead to bad results if not careful. After dep pointed my error here, reece's were the first thing that became more clear, in the frequency splitting aspect at least.

Hmm thx for the tip again, I remember seeing Depone talk about this but haven't had a chance to experiment yet Any possibility that with reece's or maybe more specifically, bro step bass lines, that a bit of overlapping with traditional filter seperation might benefit the overall sound or add some extra texture that's good?

[daft cunt]

So usually I cut at 150 Hz with a very steep filter so there's no gap between the 2 bands

Hmmm Ive recently learned this is a bad thing... filters are not linear phase eqs, and thierfore, regardless of how you set the curve really, thier values, once summed back together after splitting frequencies, will not add properly, and youll have altered the sound. Try it with your method, split the frequencies, and then route them back to a final bus, and compare the before and after sound, without any effects on them, jus the split and summed signal vs. the signal.

Now open a multiband compressor, and adjust the frequency bands to where you need them to split, and save this as a preset/patch... route your signal to however many mixer channels you normally would to split frequencies, and then rather then putting and eq or a filter to split, open the multiband compressor preset on each new mixer insert, and solo the bands one by one, so they split through the compressors.

Now compare the a-b of your orignal signal and the summed value of the multiband compressors, and they should sound virtually identical, granted you are at same relative gain and the compressor isnt made to warm or color.

This is really effecient, and I thank Depone for pointing my error out hear, and I think itseven more important in a Reece context then your average brostep bass. Reece's are delicate sounds, they rely on some pretty interesting movement from additive synthesis, and tampering with the phase in sucha delicate sound can lead to bad results if not careful. After dep pointed my error here, reece's were the first thing that became more clear, in the frequency splitting aspect at least.

Thanks for pointing that out. Sonicly there's no difference to me but I can see a difference when looking at a filter splitted and a non splitted version of the same unprocessed sound in Sound Forge.
That being said I still don't get what this phasing issue is all about. I've been told it's bad but I don't know how and why.
I noticed that HPing kicks with a steep filter for instance makes the kicks louder when you'd expect them to be quieter. So what I do is limit it afterward. I'm sure it's technicly wrong but if you can't tell the difference by ear, what exactly is the problem ? I mean, all the reese driven music that ever existed has been done like that, hasn't it ?

[riskotheque]

Detuning is the way to go

[daft cunt]

Detuning is the way to go

Detuning a reese... Come on man, is that the best you can do ?

[Basic A]

Well no not really all the Reece msuic has been done like that per se, I mean, this isnt a new technique, multiband splitting, Im sure its been around since the days of early DnB (though itd have been pricier to use hardware comps haha)...

The deal with phasing is two things, the biggest, being that stereo sounds, when put into mono, will sum thier values in a way similar to additive synthesis theory, creating displaced waveforms, thierfore if you had a sine on the left and a sine on the right which was a millisecond late, youd get an additive effect in mono and theyd be a new sound.

But thats not the issue here, the issue is alterance of orignal sound, and basically, if the phase's of the different bands go out of time, the synth patch WILL have fundementally changed. When you make a reece you rely on detuned oscillators phasing a single to create a new, evolving wave... if you split bands and alterthe time of this, you might of well have increased or decreased your detuning.

Make some kinda sense? Hard ot explain whats in my head right now

[stereotactic]

EZ fellas, nice work, loads of great tips here.

Already got my reeses beastier, still not quite getting (understatement) that ridiculous swirly movement Triage has going on, but that's why I'm sitting at my DAW practicing and they are blowing shit up.

Thanks for all the insight, top stuff.

[tripaddict]

You really dont need to constantly resample anymore for a decent dark reese sound.Constant resampling is WAY overrated. you can make all these "resampled" dark reese sounds with Z3ta.

z3ta wooot my favorite plugin ... i will do a tutorial if you'd like ?

[stereotactic]

z3ta wooot my favorite plugin ... i will do a tutorial if you'd like ?

Of course man! Tut's are essential on a forum like this, noobs and old heads alike can learn stuff from other people's processes, get on it bro!

[Basic A]

z3ta.. tutorial,,

[daft cunt]

z3ta.. tutorial,,

I bought z3ta when the price dropped to 15 € but I didn't really play with it yet.
At first I was a bit disappointed about how few waveforms it has compared to Massive but then I found the shaper button
Apart from a few modulation matrix parameters it looks pretty straightforward but yeah tutorials are always welcome.

[gravity]

id say its lots of different filters, although the twistyness probably comes from some notch filters, or perhaps a manually automated phaser or a kontakt-esque phase filter.

[boko91]

So usually I cut at 150 Hz with a very steep filter so there's no gap between the 2 bands

Hmmm Ive recently learned this is a bad thing... filters are not linear phase eqs, and thierfore, regardless of how you set the curve really, thier values, once summed back together after splitting frequencies, will not add properly, and youll have altered the sound. Try it with your method, split the frequencies, and then route them back to a final bus, and compare the before and after sound, without any effects on them, jus the split and summed signal vs. the signal.

Now open a multiband compressor, and adjust the frequency bands to where you need them to split, and save this as a preset/patch... route your signal to however many mixer channels you normally would to split frequencies, and then rather then putting and eq or a filter to split, open the multiband compressor preset on each new mixer insert, and solo the bands one by one, so they split through the compressors.

Now compare the a-b of your orignal signal and the summed value of the multiband compressors, and they should sound virtually identical, granted you are at same relative gain and the compressor isnt made to warm or color.

This is really effecient, and I thank Depone for pointing my error out hear, and I think itseven more important in a Reece context then your average brostep bass. Reece's are delicate sounds, they rely on some pretty interesting movement from additive synthesis, and tampering with the phase in sucha delicate sound can lead to bad results if not careful. After dep pointed my error here, reece's were the first thing that became more clear, in the frequency splitting aspect at least.

yeah that little gem was on Logic pro help about 2 yrs ago. was just getting into production then and didn't really understand it!!! Mite as well of been written in Latin!!! Def a good idea tho, but opening 4 multiband compressors to split your frequency! Ouch!!

[xx773xx]

When doing all the cute notch work is it best to use and EQ and modulate or to use a notch filter with an LFO? I ask because in Ableton it seems when I sweep through with a notched EQ I hear little bleeps and blips, ie NOT part of the original sound.

I should also ask, is there any harm done by constantly resampling and notching out the midrange?