Why sample?

[tripwire22]

god i couldnt imagine trying to synthesize a drum hit

[In The Shadows]

I just think tho, couldn't i just sample a bunch of dubstep tunes to make a new track but it wouldn't be very original? N can noone tell me a big track that uses no samples (e.g. Digital mystikz, skream, etc)

well thats the other side of the tipping point when it comes to samples, theres a difference between sampling a Herbie Hancock record form the 70s to make 90s jungle and sampling a 2010 dubstep record to make 2010 dubstep. Skream uses drum samples in all his tunes Im guessing, I dont know for sure but I am willing to bet he has never gone into a studio and recorded a live drum kit himself, therefor most drum sounds he uses have been taken from somewhere as a wav sample and used for his beats. Again theres a difference between taking drum sounds and then making your own beat with them, and just sampling an entire drum loop from a bit of music and using it unedited. DM, first thing comes to mind is Blue Notez by Mala, got a sax in there, Im willing to bet Mala didnt record himself playing that saxaphone line on his own bit of brass and that it is a sample. Again, its probably from an old bit of music, I doubt very much youll find that sax line on Hospital Records latest sample cd set.

Synthesizing drum hits isnt too bad actually, bit of noise generation and attention to your envelopes can bring you some very basic synthetic drum hits quite quickly. For house etc its a little more common place Im told, but when you want a real sounding drum hit its either sample or record yourself from a drum kit basicly.

[deadly_habit]

god i couldnt imagine trying to synthesize a drum hit

it's not that hard
hell peep some of current value's or machine code's stuff

[deadly_habit]

hum samples is a form of celebration of our musical patrimony...

but thats the hip hop head in me...

i just cherish old music...

the more u sample the more u get into those things...

sampling old records, u dont just sample sounds, u sample soul. and thats no artsy-overstatement...

that + the above

btw dh, love the sub on that one...

808s mang

[zitanb]

I live to sample There is such a diverse range of sounds/instruments out there you can use. Like having an orchestra available to you its just awesome. Sometimes it takes a long time to get them to work together but its well worth it. For example sampled strings just sound more authentic than midi strings. Great for live sounding drums too. Not so good for bass.

Good luck.

Z.

[ammo]

I just think tho, couldn't i just sample a bunch of dubstep tunes to make a new track but it wouldn't be very original? N can noone tell me a big track that uses no samples (e.g. Digital mystikz, skream, etc)

well thats the other side of the tipping point when it comes to samples, theres a difference between sampling a Herbie Hancock record form the 70s to make 90s jungle and sampling a 2010 dubstep record to make 2010 dubstep. Skream uses drum samples in all his tunes Im guessing, I dont know for sure but I am willing to bet he has never gone into a studio and recorded a live drum kit himself, therefor most drum sounds he uses have been taken from somewhere as a wav sample and used for his beats. Again theres a difference between taking drum sounds and then making your own beat with them, and just sampling an entire drum loop from a bit of music and using it unedited. DM, first thing comes to mind is Blue Notez by Mala, got a sax in there, Im willing to bet Mala didnt record himself playing that saxaphone line on his own bit of brass and that it is a sample. Again, its probably from an old bit of music, I doubt very much youll find that sax line on Hospital Records latest sample cd set.

Synthesizing drum hits isnt too bad actually, bit of noise generation and attention to your envelopes can bring you some very basic synthetic drum hits quite quickly. For house etc its a little more common place Im told, but when you want a real sounding drum hit its either sample or record yourself from a drum kit basicly.

Ah right, but how du kno that sax isn't a virtual instrument or something?

[deadly_habit]

I just think tho, couldn't i just sample a bunch of dubstep tunes to make a new track but it wouldn't be very original? N can noone tell me a big track that uses no samples (e.g. Digital mystikz, skream, etc)

well thats the other side of the tipping point when it comes to samples, theres a difference between sampling a Herbie Hancock record form the 70s to make 90s jungle and sampling a 2010 dubstep record to make 2010 dubstep. Skream uses drum samples in all his tunes Im guessing, I dont know for sure but I am willing to bet he has never gone into a studio and recorded a live drum kit himself, therefor most drum sounds he uses have been taken from somewhere as a wav sample and used for his beats. Again theres a difference between taking drum sounds and then making your own beat with them, and just sampling an entire drum loop from a bit of music and using it unedited. DM, first thing comes to mind is Blue Notez by Mala, got a sax in there, Im willing to bet Mala didnt record himself playing that saxaphone line on his own bit of brass and that it is a sample. Again, its probably from an old bit of music, I doubt very much youll find that sax line on Hospital Records latest sample cd set.

Synthesizing drum hits isnt too bad actually, bit of noise generation and attention to your envelopes can bring you some very basic synthetic drum hits quite quickly. For house etc its a little more common place Im told, but when you want a real sounding drum hit its either sample or record yourself from a drum kit basicly.

Ah right, but how du kno that sax isn't a virtual instrument or something?

http://www.linplug.com/Instruments/SaxL ... xlab_2.htm
used it before for sax and flute and it really does sound authentic with some tweeks

[ammo]

I live to sample There is such a diverse range of sounds/instruments out there you can use. Like having an orchestra available to you its just awesome. Sometimes it takes a long time to get them to work together but its well worth it. For example sampled strings just sound more authentic than midi strings. Great for live sounding drums too. Not so good for bass.

Good luck.

Z.

Thanks man

[ghosthack]

You are often capturing all other little artefacts and imperfections that give the samples certain characteristics or the processing that sample went through in it's creation, that just well sound nicer than some digital clean synth sounds pre processed.

^^^!!!

Personally I can't stand listening to that type of electronic music that's just all synth and no sampling. Just feels plasitcy to me.

Absolutly true, I love to work with samples.

[In The Shadows]

Ah right, but how du kno that sax isn't a virtual instrument or something?

I dont, it could be, would it matter though? Its prob safe to say its not a virtual rasta on Dread Commandments. Mala uses Reason so if its not a stock Reason sound its probably a sample. I used to have an issue with samples before I really understood what was going on, but in truth most people are using samples in electronic music, and its just as creative a process as using a synth tbh. You can press one key on a z3ta patch and it will launch almost an entire trance track at you as someone mentioned on the forums not so long ago, and you can press one key with a trance loop sampled and get the same thing. But you can go in with both synth and sampler, take them down to a single note and create your own music from that, its no different which you use youre still creating somehting form a note. Uk dance music was built on sampling just as American hip hop was before it.

I still have that same distain for people using sample loops to create the bulk of their music, but sampling is about much more than that when you get into it. Just listen to a Burial record, 100% samples, 100% gold, very original sounding, then listen to a Tiesto record, 95% synths, very generic, very boring, done to death painting by numbers drivel. You can pinch a sound from somewhere and do something creative with just like you can synthesise a new sound and do something very unoriginal with it. Id almost have more respect for Mala if he went digging through old jazz for a little note of sax he could use to create his melody than him loading up an nn-xt and reaching for the brass presets.

Some music made, to my knowledge, exclusively with samples...









now the question is, would these tracks have the personality and individuality they have if they were made completely from the Reason nn-xt sampler presets? I would argue no way, and Id also say that in my option it took more tallent to go dig out these sounds from various locations than to load up a sampler/synth and reach from the presets. Its all opinion though, no rules, I have issues with some sample use, namely drum n bass tracks made form drum n bass sample cds and the like, some people whos music I love wouldnt give a shit about even using cds like that. Id never sample bass from a dance music producer, but Breakage does and hes a don, so whatever your opinion on it is, thats fine, stick with it. You got to feel proud of the music you make, if sampling leaves a bad taste in your mouth then its not for you. I could probably solve the main problems in my own tracks by downlaoding a torrent of a vengence pack and replacing my drum sounds with them, would take 1/10th of the time its going to take me to properly process my own, but it would break too many of my morals, we all have a line somewhere.

[zitanb]

Nice post In the Shadows! Amon Tobin is absolutely brilliant btw. Obviously Burial is too

I always thought it was interesting that Portishead "record their material to old tape from real instruments, and then sample their recordings, rather than recording their instruments directly to a track".

Z.

[notts57]

When I make a tune I always chop up drum loops so I'd probably end up with 5 channels of sampled audio:
1. Kick
2. Snare
3. Shaker
4. Closed Hat
5. Open Hat (Although sometimes I'll use the shaker)

It depends on what sound you're going for I suppose... I do it because I have a real lack of decent drum sounds, I'll download loops from previews of sample packs, import them into Cubase 5, target the hitpoints, then chop it up (usually 5 different loops because I listen out for the different components. If you're sampling drums, it gives you an all-round advantage imo because you can get pretty much exactly what you want... an Old Skool sound, Heavy, Light etc... It's just a preference to be honest, each person will have their own method of working.

[Sharmaji]

"blue notes" is def. one of my fave dmz tracks, but that's 100% not a real sax, sampled or otherwise, in there.

great example of using the tools you have tho-- whether or not he wanted a real sax in there, he wrote a KILLER melody. seeing people sing along to this one in 2006/7...

[grooki]

You are often capturing all other little artefacts and imperfections that give the samples certain characteristics or the processing that sample went through in it's creation, that just well sound nicer than some digital clean synth sounds pre processed.

it's all about character, textures.

[mks]

Growing up with Hip-Hop and Jungle in the '90's, sampling is a natural part of my musical language. I often sample myself these days but still reach for the old vinyl sometimes.

EZ

[qwaycee_]

manipulating samples is one of the bestest things to does.

basically what mks said, minus jungle. i wasnt a big jungle head coming up.

premo, marley, easy mo bee, pete rock, etc. that shit was fascinating. whenever i'd be a new album, straight to the liner notes to see who produced what, and what the samples were. even as a pre-teen that shit was really interesting.

[Ldizzy]

^mehehehe proper saggy-dressed djiankstah up in herre...

seriously tho... one should at least spend a couple weeks on http://www.the-breaks.com

[ammo]

Ah right, but how du kno that sax isn't a virtual instrument or something?

I dont, it could be, would it matter though?

It doesn't matter to me in the slightest, it's a sick tune. It's relevant to the question I asked as you quoted it as an example of a great use of sampling but there's no evidence to say it is a sample n it appears that some people think its definitely not a sample. So it is relevant because if it sounds like a sample but it's not then it seems you can achieve the same level of quality without sampling. Which again leads me back to my opening post (where I already mentioned that I understand the use for little quotes etc). I understand what you are saying, I was wondering though if there are any big tracks that do not use any samples in contrast to everyones views here. Evidently I'll never really know without asking one of those producers. At some point Ill give sampling a try once I can do a bit more lol

[yamaz]

See Dub Music.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dub_music

[In The Shadows]

"blue notes" is def. one of my fave dmz tracks, but that's 100% not a real sax, sampled or otherwise, in there.

great example of using the tools you have tho-- whether or not he wanted a real sax in there, he wrote a KILLER melody. seeing people sing along to this one in 2006/7...

yeah I made the comment just from memory of a sax being in there, went back and listened last night after I made that last post, out of interest, and thought 'actually, that could well be an nn-xt' Credit to Mala that it actually blatantly does sound like a bad sax preset and Id never really noticed before, it doesnt stick out like they normally do, hes handled the sound very well.

Ah right, but how du kno that sax isn't a virtual instrument or something?

I dont, it could be, would it matter though?

It doesn't matter to me in the slightest, it's a sick tune. It's relevant to the question I asked as you quoted it as an example of a great use of sampling but there's no evidence to say it is a sample n it appears that some people think its definitely not a sample. So it is relevant because if it sounds like a sample but it's not then it seems you can achieve the same level of quality without sampling. Which again leads me back to my opening post (where I already mentioned that I understand the use for little quotes etc). I understand what you are saying, I was wondering though if there are any big tracks that do not use any samples in contrast to everyones views here. Evidently I'll never really know without asking one of those producers. At some point Ill give sampling a try once I can do a bit more lol

of course the question was relevant, wasnt trying to challenge what youre asking my man, just saying that creatively it probably wont change any of our opinions on Malas skills either way which has its own relevance to the discussion. Hard to say if any tracks have been made in dubstep without samples, Id say no, that drum smaples and/or sampler patches have been used in everything Ive heard to the best of my knowledge, but definatly a fair few tracks out there that only use stock samples that come with the samplers people have.

Making your own sounds is always a more original and credable than stealing them, like Photek said in an interview 'the sounds there, I can just take it and use it, but Id rather make it myself'. Thing is a synth, as versitile an instrument as it is, can only make a narrow selection of sounds. If we want that real sounding sax, guitar, vocal, drum etc then we have to reach for the sampler, if we use a sample that came with our program and that everyone has in their daw or we load up our own sample weve sourced ourselves, its still a sample ultimatly. In some sense the stock patches are closer to the sample cd option in terms of how much effort you are putting in and individuality you are getting out than reaching for you album/film collection for something thats never been used in dubstep before.

In my head theres a heirarchy of credability when it comes to sound sourcing. In order of most credable to least credable acording to my snooty sealion beardstroker brain...



1 Synthesising/recording your own brand new sounds

2 Sampling an obscure old film/record

3 Sampling a recent/well known film/non dance music record

4 Using a synth/sampler preset

5 Using a sample found on the internet but not from dsf or doa

6 Using a sample cd not made by vengence or designed for dubstep/dnb/garage

7 Sampling a non dnb/dubstep dance record

8 Using a sample found on dsf or doa

9 Using a sample cd designed for dnb/dubstep or a vengence thing

10 Sampling a dnb/dubstep record

11 Sampling Skream/Loefah


shit gets a bit grey around number 6 for me, Ill go there in shame now and then when needs must, below that I get my snooty thing on and by number 11 Im shouting heresy and foaming at the mouth. Each to their own though, down to number 10 Im willing to call fair play if you want to go there