LA beatmaker production techniques

[rx]

Hey guys, it's Alex / Rx from Dubspot.

I've been inspired by a lot of LA beatmakers / "future-blap-or-whatever-you-want-to-call-it" producers for a while. I thought I'd share some trends I've observed and use in my own production which I think are really unique.

Clever use of side-chaining:

Let's face it - side chaining gets a bad rap. People associate side-chaining with producers that overdo it, or use it in really "obvious" style. I myself avoided side-chaining for a while because I felt this way, until I heard people use it in clever ways. Here's a track that's a personal favorite of mine and I feel uses side-chaining in a clever way:

Mike Slott - Knock Knock:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQIvccf4 ... re=related

I don't know for sure--I would have to ask Mike himself--but it seems like he side-chains the bass kick, snare, and vocal parts. Even though the whole track feels "loose" and "busy," no part of the song sounds muddy...every sample comes in really clearly. The bass kick and snare sound side-chained, as well as the vocal parts. It also sounds like the attack is turned up on the vocal side chain parts, to give it a less rigid, "breathing" feel. I started thinking about this because I was working on this video for Dubspot where Steve Nalepa breaks this down: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCY4Dgnq8Nk .

MPC sample libraries:

This may sounds obvious to a lot producers, especially anyone who loves hip hop, but I've found that a lot of drum sounds I've been feeling use MPC drum kits. MPC drum kits tend to make a track "pop" like a hip hop tune rather than "snap" like a techno track. You can find a lot of free MPC sample libraries online. Here's an older Flying Lotus track that sounds like it uses MPC sounds for drums but still has a loose feel...

Flying Lotus - 1983:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CybO7XtYpdU

Clever use of 8 bit sounds:

8-bit sounds have been around for a while, but the "wonky" sound seems to be getting more popular in all types of club music. I've found the most effective use of the 8-bit wonky sound is clever use of delay and/or reverb, combined with an arpeggiator and modulation. I personally use a Mac and haven't found as many free 8-bit VSTs, but there seem to be a lot more for PCs. When it comes to good, commercial VSTs, I personally like PoiZone ( http://www.image-line.com/documents/poizone.html ). The default patches sound cool, but I'd recommend taking one of the 8-bit default sounds and turn off its default arpeggiator. Then put on your own arpeggiator (I use the built-in one for Ableton), find a groove you like, add subtle delay and reverb, then mess with the "frequency" and "resonator" parameters. You can then automate the arpeggiator, delay, reverb, frequency, resonator and other parameters for crazy results. Here's an older Zomby tune which I think is a cool use of the technique I'm talking about:

Zomby - Gloop:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjEEjmeiYEc

Does anyone else have any insight of recent techniques you've heard? Are there certain tracks you've heard you've been wanting to figure out how they made certain sounds?

[Alby D]

Great post mate this it the kinda sound I'm really feeling right now.

Here's my two pence: Get an interesting field recording (rain, traffic, vinyl crackle etc,) add whatever effect chain you like and sidechain it your kick/snare/anything - blam you're using an interesting texture as an instrument. Artists like Flylo and Mount Kimbie use this technique very nicely.

Also don't be afraid to experiment and use unusual techniques - if a sample of your dog barking pitch shifted and reversed sounds good then use it!

Looking forward to hearing what everyone else has to add to this thread.

Peace

Al

[daft cunt]

Nice post!

Another clever use of side-chaining I learnt watching the Ctrl Z masterclass : when applying delay to vocals, use the vocals signal to control the volume of the delay so that you only hear it when the vocals stop.

[Mushroom Buttons]

<troll> But Slott and Zomby werent from LA </troll>

Haha, nice to see a thread here leaning more towards the "future-blap-or-whatever-you-want-to-call-it" category!

How about layering a slightly off drum break beneath a programmed beat? That'll give you a little swing.



If you listen to the right channel, there's a layer of drum break. I didn't even notice it on the first listen until the outro. Hah!

[Alby D]

Here's a nice example of these techniques applied in a dubstep context. Big vibes on this one

[rx]

Alby D - Thanks! You're DEFINITELY right about field sounds. Mount Kimbie is an excellent example. I've also found even just putting some sort of interesting tone low in the mix adds an interesting layer (the hum of a fridge, hum of an elevator, an open field, etc...)

And LOVE that Sepalcure song. Played it out a bunch of times. Machinedrum, 1/2 of Sepalcure, also makes really interesting electronic hip hop stuff and I can see how this translated to this project. The snare sounds like a combination of a synthetic snare/clap with some field recording sound (wood block? not sure.) Also this track has what sounds like a tape-hiss low in the mix to give it an analog vibe. Boards of Canada and Burial use this a lot, and I think FlyLo does this on a couple tunes. Feeding your digital, computer made track into some sort of analog output--be it a mixer, tape deck, stereo or whatever--then recording it, gives it a "warmer," more analog and less digital sound that adds to an organic feel.

daft tnuc - cool video. I also like how he panned the drum parts...I'm going to start doing that more often.

Mushroom Buttons - This Take song is awesome! I haven't heard it yet until now. Really cool. I'm listening to this track in head phones, and you're right, it seems like there's a really repetitive, loose drum break panned pretty hard to the right. But if you listen to it on speakers, it sounds like a loose shaker...then he puts delay on it at the end. I like the use of cut-up, 1/2 bar, repetitive drum breaks...it's an infectious, loose groove.

You can also check out any of our online courses at: http://dubspot.com/online-school/ . Anyone who likes this approach to producing should check out the "Sound Design & Synthesis Level 1: Synthesis Basics" class...we have an online course available, and I'm going to be taking the class myself at our NYC location next semester.

[step correct]

Nice one guys, def the direction I'm headed now. .. or at least as a side project.

LA is the place for this sound big time right now. I remember saying to a friend last Summer "dude I don't get it, it sounds like a bunch of dubstep and Trip Hop thrown together quickly on a n MPC or something..lol"

At 1st this stuff was driving me nuts as I couldn't understand how people would want to hear a bunch of beats that go off and fly all over the place. Not really the most DJ friendly material either, but it really grows on you especially if you get to see one of the live shows.
Anyhow I'm trying to figure out how to get those weird subtle wet souning drums (if that's what they actually are even)
Also I notice a lot of reverse drum hits, or maybe even a whole loop reversed and toned down a bunch. Aside from alot of obvious field samples and pitched down 808s I can't really nail it yet. Trying though.

[step correct]

oops

[rx]

Hmmm step correct, can you find an example of track that fits the "wet drums" sound you're talking about?

[deadly_habit]

live playing without hard quantization, clever use of quantization with offbeat programming, not overly engineering sounds or clinically eqing everything, emphasis on the melodies and patterns rather than the engineering, chiptune elements and vintage gear preset sound/feel, sampling from not the cleanest of sources and leaving in that grit
hell read paradox's DOA Q&A about sampling air from breakbeats
i mess with this sound quite a bit and those are some of the techniques i use that and some plugins that simulate imperfections like pitch drift, record pops/dust noises, the techniques i listed here and some in your original post plus more

[rubiconguava]

At 1st this stuff was driving me nuts as I couldn't understand how people would want to hear a bunch of beats that go off and fly all over the place. Not really the most DJ friendly material either, but it really grows on you especially if you get to see one of the live shows.
Anyhow I'm trying to figure out how to get those weird subtle wet souning drums (if that's what they actually are even)
Also I notice a lot of reverse drum hits, or maybe even a whole loop reversed and toned down a bunch. Aside from alot of obvious field samples and pitched down 808s I can't really nail it yet. Trying though.

Yeh man, went to see fly lo live the other week and it was bangin. had dorian concept on keyboard and a live drummer, sounded sweet. Emphasis is so much more on vibes and melodys than traditional production technique but theres some sick stuff goin on west coast america atm. You should also check out this guy who works ll these techniques briliantly.

[green plan]

Wicked thread. Definitely feeling this sound. Using heaps of field recordings, I carry round my little zoom h2 recorder everywhere and just record everything. Awesome way to get textured percussion sounds, and background atmospheres. Using layers of background noise sidechained to different things giving all that push pull. Hand placement of drum sounds with auto snap off. Playing in rhythms on pads. Not overloading on sub.

[qwaycee_]

yall might wanna check out ghf for a few techniques. wealth of info over there.

[rubiconguava]

ghf?

[deadly_habit]

ghf?

glitch hop forum
http://glitchhopforum.com/glitchhop-production/
there's some good stuff on there, you just have to dig, plus it's a bit on the cluttered side

http://deadlydreams.tentativerecordings.com/archives/76
i have the two q&a sessions i've seen over there linked here

[gkmusic]

Alot of the majour techniques have been covered on this thread like sidechaining, sounds etc

another one of the majour parts of the sound is the that warm and tangible sound where all the instruments jump out you, at first i thought it was compression but after a while i realised what it was not only that but it was also OVERDRIVE

when i say over drive i don't mean distortion but overdrive to warm the sound and add some "colouring" (but distortion is also used) afte that then compression to gel it all together and create that warm fuzzy texture - On FL Studio I know the bloody overdrive is a plugin for this but you can all use the PSP vintage warmer

Layering is also a main part of the sounds, they have so many layers of different things hence they sound very "alive"

I think the main ascpect of that sound is having your own style i.e flying lotus has that progressive dark/atmospheric sound scape style, samiyam has the fragmented basic synth/jazz sampled hip hop feel, zomby has that arrpegiated melodic loose atmopheric sound etc just meed to create a different sound and apply this techniqe

also for alot of the la stuff i know alot of the producers use the SP line of samplers or dr sample; dilla used, samiyam uses it, gaslamp killer uses etc i think the roland effectgs on them sound really warm and give some of the beats it character

also another thread with some good advice on this topic

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=79397

[Ldizzy]

great tips above!!

one of my very good friend makes them post jay dee glitchy hip hop beats ... hes good at it .. very good if you ask me.

he basically puts every single channel on fl studio to the maximum amount of juice so it clips like hell... then bangs a cool drum... most of hip hop oriented producers dont have proper techniques besides following rythmics.

flying lotus for instance... could bang out a crazy drumline in 10 secs... he does it live...

i guess the best advice is to get good at banging samples to a loop, live i mean.

[street_astrologist]

+1 for field recordings, leaving the grit in the samples, layering/collage and emphasis on melody (especially "Loops which are not breaks") as basic techniques for West Coast bass music. The use of hip hop style drum processing, MPC/pad controllers and Ableton Live are also common.

At the risk of going all "whaddayoucallit?": As a local and as a musician, I have been doing a lot of thinking about this music coming out of the West Coast in the last few years. Like with any new style, we run into danger of making the music formulaic if we try to nail the sound down too much (which includes not only widely propagating semi-official technique as in this thread or at GHF, but placing any one musician or group as the figurehead of the movement to be imitated or referenced). To me, one important thing that is keeping these sounds fresh right now is the lack of a unifying label that everyone can agree on, in the press or even in the underground. Articles covering the movement in the music press tend to read hilariously as instead we have a dozen different attempts to box up the sounds together or give them a leader, none of which truly stick. Is it a Jay Dee worshiping, nostalgic after-times cult? Is it a bunch of Fly Lo imitators? No, not really any of that...

My personal feeling about what is going on is that while most of the West Coast techniques and obvious influences are hip hop in origin, this music is an inevitable, groundswelling wave of fusion from a generation of musicians coming up equally influenced by hip hop, EDM, rock and reggae. Right now that means it's all over the place. Time and again, once the publicly accepted genre label arrives, the sound created by musicians who identify with the movement starts to fit its label, instead of journalists being forced to create fleeting subgenre tags constantly chasing the changing, experimental sounds as we see now. In my dream world, the music would never stop moving long enough to be nailed down.

[JayZest]

that sepalcure tune is sick, heard it a while back in a mix. sick tune

[Etches828]

Like Alby said towards the top of the thread, experimenting with unusual sounds to create atmospheres is a big one, field recordings, pitch shifting. Think outside the box (an extremely overused term i know), but i know on a lot of my tracks which tend to lead in the sort of sound direction spoken of in the thread and a sort of burial-esque garage feel. Before actually even making any musical parts or a beat even, i create a bed of textures and sounds for the rest of the track to lay in almost. I'm not just talking your average crackle and rain (which i do use too) but the parts of field recordings and home recording you wouldnt expect, like backwards pitch shifted guitar tones, wind, general movement of objects in the room run through filters. I find that when i have this bed of textures and sounds I can roll out a track a lot quicker (not quite sure why...). I feel using non-typical drum sounds is also a big part of getting this sort of experimental hip hop/dubstep sound, while trying not to dick off burial too much, the sounds of wooden object hitting, keys, glass smashing, splashes etc....

Good thread!