Skream

[plastician]

Theres a lot of people saying stuff on this thread about "real dubstep" at DMZ.......

People are pissed cause dmz aint about that style of music otherwise we'd have Doctor P, Datsik, Excision, Flux Pavilion and Cookie Monsta at every dmz.

bullshit. i expect 95% of DJs on this forum could draw a better, more DMZ appropriate set than was played. but they don't have the profile, so aint gonna get booked.

people trying to hush the haters are really underestimating how much DMZ, 'that sound' and the heritage of the event mean to people. that set wouldn't have got this reaction if it was played at any other event in the entire world, which is why people are so much less forgiving. it's like the last bastion of what real dubstep means has been lost to the moshcunts.

OK....

Basically I'm here to throw a cog in the works.

in 2005, every DJ at DMZ was playing music at 140 bpm (70bpm if we are talking the half step stuff). This is without exception. There were slight trends like the grime stuff and the mellow stuff and also a little bit of the early lfo / midrange stuff but it was always at the same tempo.

So, if we're talking about heritage, real dubstep, 'that sound' then why is nobody moaning about all this house / juke / 130 bpm stuff DJ's are playing nowadays?

I think its because a lot of people on this forum are just sheep following trends set by DJ's deemed to be "acceptable" or "cool" on this forum.

Theres a lot of talk about how this new tearout strain of dubstep is so far away from the "original DMZ vibe and sound" and that is your reason to hate it.

But so is everything released on Swamp 81, Night Slugs, and all the other much loved labels on this forum. Yet when people draw for this sound (in my opinion even further away from the "original" sound) there's no problem with it? A lot of this stuff is built at 96bpm / 130 bpm and owes a lot of it's roots more to techno than croydon dubstep.

You lot need to work out a proper reason for disliking hearing this sound at dmz.... because it clearly has nothing to do with it not being "the original sound".

Truth of the matter is simple: music evolves. We aren't all going to like the same forms of this evolution. DMZ has celebrated this evolution for 6 years and embraces it with open arms, and its a breath of fresh air that people can hear the likes of Doctor P and Flux Pavilion alongside names like James Blake and Addison Groove in my opinion.

We all need to accept that the music changes and it's ok if you don't like it all. What nobody on here (other than Mala / Coki / Loefah / Pokes) can do is make assumptions on what is or isn't acceptable music to play at DMZ. If you enjoy the juke stuff or the funky and feel that has a place at DMZ, you should also embrace other forms of the sound - whether u like it or not we all came from the same place and it all has a place within the scene in some form.

Sorry for the rant. I just think people on here need a reality check. You can't knock something for not being true to original dubstep if you're willing to embrace stuff not even made at the same tempo as the sound represented at the first DMZ events.

DMZ is and always will be a place to "meditate on bass weight". It isn't a place to be a snob. I obviously don't represent DMZ with this view, but its always been my perception of the vibe of the night since attending the very first one at 3rd Bass. Some people just like to meditate to different frequencies of bass, this is life - and this is dubstep as we know it.

[64hz]

[BANNERWORX]

Finally, one of the firm have spoken

[plastician]

For the record I funnily enough do enjoy everything from the chill to the tearout, no matter what bpm. The only stuff I don't enjoy is the really IDM stuff, so long as the kicks and snares are straight I enjoy it generally. If you can hum the bassline thats a good rule of thumb. I don't enjoy the hardest tip of the tearout stuff but thats not to say it doesn't have it's place.

[snypadub]

I hear ya plastic I really do and a lot of people justifying themselves aint doing a proper job.

I have no problem with evolution of music, in fact I welcome it with open arms. It aint about staying in one place any scene will become way too heavily oversaturated if there was no progression.

For me the tearout dancefloor stuff doesn't work. Not because of evolution but for me, and i'm gunna come across as elitist but hey I have an opinion, because it is lacking what I look for in music; I like music with a hell of a lot of bass. I am a junkie for sub bass regardless of genre. It can be a km and leon switch track or a loxy and resound track, it could be a cyrus 140 roller or a roska housey beat, it doesn't matter about genre to me it really doesn't. For me great music comprises the following elements (and again this is my taste and not anybody elses): Sub bass, originality, and passion.

I think a lot of this tearout stuff, wether you want to call it brostep (I really hate that term though) or whatever, lacks some of these elements. A lot of it sounds too similar (and i know there are loads of sub low tunes that the same could be said for). I think that whole high end screechy thing has been done to death. I genuinely like some of that stuff honestly do, and it really sends a dancefloor mad.
I was listening to one of your shows on rinse recently and you played loads of tearout and it sounded great, N-type pulls it off to. The thing is You still pay respect and give a platform to variety and skreams set lacked that. The vast majority of it was tearout, and there wasn't enough variation for me to feel it.

All being said, it was one set and I aint gunna judge one of my all time favourite artists on one set.
None of this matters of course, as long as we stick to our principles and don't look to others as a basis of our own beleifs things will be fine. I will keep being me and skream will keep being himself innit, so what If i don't like his direction. If it makes him happy then great I am happy too.

Rant over.

[mIrReN]

Like vivek always points out; "you have to feel it", reason I like the 130 bpm / juke stuff, but that ain't no reason to disrespect/slate Skream & Benga's set, I felt the tunes I've heard
anyway to plastician

[plastician]

Don't get me wrong I aint saying everyone has to like all strains of the sound, or even to understand it. I just think everyone needs to respect that other people do enjoy it, and we all need to spend lessv time talking on here about stuff we DON'T enjoy and focus channeling energy into more positive things to do with our time. I've heard a lot of sets over the years I really didn't enjoy but you won't catch me on here starting a topic about how much I hated it.

[lolmatelol]

I happen to think hearing doctor p, datsik etc alongside Addison Grove and James Blake is terrible. Just because you feel that screechy kiddiestep is a "breath of fresh air", doesn't mean everyone else does.

Once again, I don't think anyone is hating on Skream and Benga, they can play whatever they like, I will still listen and buy their music. But, from what I have seen, dj's seem to be getting all arsey with this forum because people expressed that they were disappointed with the set, which in my opinion is just plain retarded. It's so damn obvious that quite a few people aren't going to like what they hear at DMZ if Basscannon is dropped.

Are people seriously NOT allowed to be disappointed with a set? Stupid.

[plastician]

I happen to think hearing doctor p, datsik etc alongside Addison Grove and James Blake is terrible. Just because you feel that screechy kiddiestep is a "breath of fresh air", doesn't mean everyone else does.

Once again, I don't think anyone is hating on Skream and Benga, they can play whatever they like, I will still listen and buy their music. But, from what I have seen, dj's seem to be getting all arsey with this forum because people expressed that they were disappointed with the set, which in my opinion is just plain retarded. It's so damn obvious that quite a few people aren't going to like what they hear at DMZ if Basscannon is dropped.

Are people seriously NOT allowed to be disappointed with a set? Stupid.

U got it all wrong. I said hearing them all at the same event was a breath of fresh air. Not the sound in particular.

We're all allowed to not enjoy a set, but must we expend our energy to moan on web forums about it?

[dj $hy]

IAre people seriously NOT allowed to be disappointed with a set? Stupid.

I dont think that was his point mate...!

Personally been saying it on here for ages - one mans shit is another mans gold! You are never gonna like everything but why the moaning, why cant you just support your sound n par the other instead of hating on it so much!

I have to say LMFAO, "Oh no some tearout got into DMZ" You lot might wanna av a chat with the bouncers, maybe its their fault?!

[snypadub]

agree with the whole directing our energy towards a more positive vibe.

Rekon this should be left ot rest now innit.
It always happens though people focus on the negatives, i'm guilty of it as much as the next person and I rekon there's some psychological explination out there for why it is we do that but regardless theres far more positive things happening within the music I love than negatives.

I simply don't listen to the stuff I don't like and rinse the fuck out of the stuff I love. Skream does the same thing i'm sure as well as every other fucker.

will always continue to love bass music and will always surround myself in the stuff I love.

[Genevieve]

Theres a lot of people saying stuff on this thread about "real dubstep" at DMZ.......

People are pissed cause dmz aint about that style of music otherwise we'd have Doctor P, Datsik, Excision, Flux Pavilion and Cookie Monsta at every dmz.

bullshit. i expect 95% of DJs on this forum could draw a better, more DMZ appropriate set than was played. but they don't have the profile, so aint gonna get booked.

people trying to hush the haters are really underestimating how much DMZ, 'that sound' and the heritage of the event mean to people. that set wouldn't have got this reaction if it was played at any other event in the entire world, which is why people are so much less forgiving. it's like the last bastion of what real dubstep means has been lost to the moshcunts.

OK....

Basically I'm here to throw a cog in the works.

in 2005, every DJ at DMZ was playing music at 140 bpm (70bpm if we are talking the half step stuff). This is without exception. There were slight trends like the grime stuff and the mellow stuff and also a little bit of the early lfo / midrange stuff but it was always at the same tempo.

So, if we're talking about heritage, real dubstep, 'that sound' then why is nobody moaning about all this house / juke / 130 bpm stuff DJ's are playing nowadays?

I think its because a lot of people on this forum are just sheep following trends set by DJ's deemed to be "acceptable" or "cool" on this forum.

Theres a lot of talk about how this new tearout strain of dubstep is so far away from the "original DMZ vibe and sound" and that is your reason to hate it.

But so is everything released on Swamp 81, Night Slugs, and all the other much loved labels on this forum. Yet when people draw for this sound (in my opinion even further away from the "original" sound) there's no problem with it? A lot of this stuff is built at 96bpm / 130 bpm and owes a lot of it's roots more to techno than croydon dubstep.

You lot need to work out a proper reason for disliking hearing this sound at dmz.... because it clearly has nothing to do with it not being "the original sound".

Truth of the matter is simple: music evolves. We aren't all going to like the same forms of this evolution. DMZ has celebrated this evolution for 6 years and embraces it with open arms, and its a breath of fresh air that people can hear the likes of Doctor P and Flux Pavilion alongside names like James Blake and Addison Groove in my opinion.

We all need to accept that the music changes and it's ok if you don't like it all. What nobody on here (other than Mala / Coki / Loefah / Pokes) can do is make assumptions on what is or isn't acceptable music to play at DMZ. If you enjoy the juke stuff or the funky and feel that has a place at DMZ, you should also embrace other forms of the sound - whether u like it or not we all came from the same place and it all has a place within the scene in some form.

Sorry for the rant. I just think people on here need a reality check. You can't knock something for not being true to original dubstep if you're willing to embrace stuff not even made at the same tempo as the sound represented at the first DMZ events.

DMZ is and always will be a place to "meditate on bass weight". It isn't a place to be a snob. I obviously don't represent DMZ with this view, but its always been my perception of the vibe of the night since attending the very first one at 3rd Bass. Some people just like to meditate to different frequencies of bass, this is life - and this is dubstep as we know it.

Alright so...

I was at the DMZ in Amsterdam and I too wasn't crazy about Skream (though I did leave his set early), but I was simply not into it. It has nothing to do with what DMZ or dubstep's 'supposedly about' in my view.

I did enjoy Loefah's hip-house/electro-hop/acid influenced set, greatly. As well as Kode9's funky.

I'm really not one of the heads who thinks 'dubstep' or hell, even DMZ should be about a 'certain' thing.

So I'm not at all in the same camp as the people who complained about Skream, even though I myself don't like the Doctor P/Funtcase/Excision side of things (though I do like my harder shit and filth in the form of let's say... Milanese or Broken Note), I'm not gonna hold him playing that stuff against him.

Besides, he's been down with DMZ since day one. His view on what it 'should' be like is more educated than mine.

Anyway, to no longer beat around the bush. When I experienced the DMZ in Amsterdam, I kinda felt like I got a taste of what the UK underground is like. I'm not from London, so really, I'm not gonna claim that my opinion is all that educated.

But if my 7 hour experience of DMZ in Amsterdam is an accurate representation of what the London underground is about, musically, I thought to myself 'has dubstep, not as a style, but as a cultural phenomenon already happened?' I'm not saying that the music isn't hot anymore and that no one produces or enjoys or parties to that 140 bpm, deep bass sound anymore. But it seems that the movement as a whole has changed from being about a certain tempo/rhythm, to a mindset.

Nothing that James Blake, Kode9 and Loefah did, was rhythmically similar. The tempos and rhythms and influences were different. But nothing sounded out of place. I don't think that Loefah really sounded like a black dude with a sequencer from late '80s Chicago. I mean, he definitely took cues from the Chicago scene, but the overal vibe that I got from the music he played was the same vibe I got later on in the night from Digital Mystikz.

People may say they go for a certain 'sound' to DMZ, but I don't think the sound is reflected by tempo, or rhythm, or whatever, but by a certain vibe. And Loefah's 808 shit, to me, came closer to that 'vibe' than, let's say, Flux Pavillion's strain of dubstep does.

You can get a similar feel and vibe out of different sounding music, and you can get a different feel and vibe out of similar sounding music. Godspeed You! Black Emperor have more 'black metal' vibes to me, despite sonically probably being closer to Sigur Rós, who give off more of a dream pop vibe to me.

You can't restrict 'sound' to a rhythm or tempo.

[lolmatelol]

People can say whatever they like on this forum. I personally never bother with writing much on here. Clearly there are a lot of people who do talk a lot on here, and it's normal for people to talk about what they liked and didn't like at an event. There's also nothing wrong with that.

My friend who didn't go asked me what it was like. I told him who i really enjoyed and why, but also who i didn't enjoy.

The reason this whole issue has been blown out of proportion is because people can see all the Dj's taking the negative comments REALLY badly on twitter and other sites. Thus creating more threads (this), and more chat about Skream and Benga in the DMZ thread.

[plastician]

Thats a more understandable reasoning for disliking it. Respect for that.

I can understand everything you've said too.

I just think its unfair that Skream is on the end of what sounds like a childish backlash from the majority of people on here.

Its definitely not about restricting it either. Who am I to say what is or isn't dubstep anymore? It's all blown into this huge mega movement now I can't even explain what is or isn't dubstep anymore. Its all just bass music now.

[plastician]

People can say whatever they like on this forum. I personally never bother with writing much on here. Clearly there are a lot of people who do talk a lot on here, and it's normal for people to talk about what they liked and didn't like at an event. There's also nothing wrong with that.

My friend who didn't go asked me what it was like. I told him who i really enjoyed and why, but also who i didn't enjoy.

The reason this whole issue has been blown out of proportion is because people can see all the Dj's taking the negative comments REALLY badly on twitter and other sites. Thus creating more threads (this), and more chat about Skream and Benga in the DMZ thread.

When you pour your heart into something you believe in, and somebody pisses all over it like it seems quite a lot of people have with Skream and Benga on this occasion, its totally understandable why they might take comments badly. I'd be exactly the same.

You are all welcome to your negative comments but don't be surprised when the person you're directing them at comes back at you just as hard.

[badger]

OK....

Basically I'm here to throw a cog in the works.

in 2005, every DJ at DMZ was playing music at 140 bpm (70bpm if we are talking the half step stuff). This is without exception. There were slight trends like the grime stuff and the mellow stuff and also a little bit of the early lfo / midrange stuff but it was always at the same tempo.

So, if we're talking about heritage, real dubstep, 'that sound' then why is nobody moaning about all this house / juke / 130 bpm stuff DJ's are playing nowadays?

I think its because a lot of people on this forum are just sheep following trends set by DJ's deemed to be "acceptable" or "cool" on this forum.

Theres a lot of talk about how this new tearout strain of dubstep is so far away from the "original DMZ vibe and sound" and that is your reason to hate it.

But so is everything released on Swamp 81, Night Slugs, and all the other much loved labels on this forum. Yet when people draw for this sound (in my opinion even further away from the "original" sound) there's no problem with it? A lot of this stuff is built at 96bpm / 130 bpm and owes a lot of it's roots more to techno than croydon dubstep.

You lot need to work out a proper reason for disliking hearing this sound at dmz.... because it clearly has nothing to do with it not being "the original sound".

Truth of the matter is simple: music evolves. We aren't all going to like the same forms of this evolution. DMZ has celebrated this evolution for 6 years and embraces it with open arms, and its a breath of fresh air that people can hear the likes of Doctor P and Flux Pavilion alongside names like James Blake and Addison Groove in my opinion.

We all need to accept that the music changes and it's ok if you don't like it all. What nobody on here (other than Mala / Coki / Loefah / Pokes) can do is make assumptions on what is or isn't acceptable music to play at DMZ. If you enjoy the juke stuff or the funky and feel that has a place at DMZ, you should also embrace other forms of the sound - whether u like it or not we all came from the same place and it all has a place within the scene in some form.

Sorry for the rant. I just think people on here need a reality check. You can't knock something for not being true to original dubstep if you're willing to embrace stuff not even made at the same tempo as the sound represented at the first DMZ events.

DMZ is and always will be a place to "meditate on bass weight". It isn't a place to be a snob. I obviously don't represent DMZ with this view, but its always been my perception of the vibe of the night since attending the very first one at 3rd Bass. Some people just like to meditate to different frequencies of bass, this is life - and this is dubstep as we know it.

great points!

the whole argument about the music not being in line with the vibe of dmz is about as bad as the argument in retaliation that people are stuck in 2005. the music has mutated and the two more obvious mutations that you mentioned above arguably have little in common with the original sound but both are very popular amongst different groups - and instead of accepting that this is how dubstep sounds in 2011 both sides have ended up getting involved in pointless internet hate. speaking very generally about this i think it's fair to say that the majority (obviously not all...) of the two camps are coming at dubstep from different angles and this is why there's so much antagonism between the two. neither is necessarily more right but they're after very different things on a night out - and you'd be achieving the impossible if you made both 100% happy

there were two rooms so there's no need for people to stay in room one if they aren't feeling it. just go listen to something else and deal with the fact that there's always things in life that you won't enjoy. if everyone complained like this every time they didn't like something the world would be a very miserable place

[addicted]

So, if we're talking about heritage, real dubstep, 'that sound' then why is nobody moaning about all this house / juke / 130 bpm stuff DJ's are playing nowadays?

I think its because a lot of people on this forum are just sheep following trends set by DJ's deemed to be "acceptable" or "cool" on this forum.

say no fucking more

[LA_Boxers]

a retweet by skream @Caspadubstep forums are for those who apparently know better, can do better & are better but never seem to do anything about it. couldnt be more true

So just because we arent as good, or established we are not allowed opinions?? Some people do use words too freely and say things like ''their set was shit''. Just because stuff was played that they disliked. This doesnt mean their set was shit, it means you disliked it. If people were to think more carefully about their words, and actually explained why they disliked it, surely they should be able to say it??

Personally, I think Loefah, James Blake and Kode 9's sets have been more appreciated and not slated has been the fact the music they are playing has more of the ethos of the original dubstep sounds in the respect that it is more about the sub and music elements than the tear-out stuff that got played. Tbh I'm not overly a fan of Loefahs more jukey stuff. But I wouldnt ever say the music is shit, in the same way I wouldnt say the tear-out stuff I dislike is shit. However, I can appreciate production value and originality.

At the end of the day it is all opinions, and it is not going to change my opinion on Skream or Benga or anybody in the long run. Theyre all dons and will always be dons.

My 2p.

[Icey]

I come from the metal genre(oh I have started so many posts with that one), and I saw the same stuff there too. People trying new stuff, evolving their music. Because, lets face it, you can't keep on doing the EXACT same thing for years. Music evolves, and sometimes every one isn't happy about it. We have our "moshf'ggots", "emokids" and "angst-y-teenagers" in metal too! There is always people who don't like the new sounds and there is always people who find new genres/styles thanks to those changes!

Also, there is so many other genres infused into dubstep, that you just can't go on with one sound.

I hope this makes any sense.

[wilson]

a retweet by skream @Caspadubstep forums are for those who apparently know better, can do better & are better but never seem to do anything about it. couldnt be more true

Some people do use words to freely and say things like ''their set was shit''. Just because stuff was played that they disliked. This doesnt mean their set was shit, it means you disliked it. If people were to think more carefully about their words, and actually explained why they disliked it, surely they should be able to say it??

That is the root of the disagreements happening atm. And tbh the root of arguments on forums in general. It's very hard to put your true views across in this format, and it just leads to misunderstandings and internet flare-ups that would just not happen in real life!