VST Drum Machines - (Battery 3) What's the point?

[Dreadfunk]

I've been looking into reworking how I do drums (currently it's a hodgepodge of Live Drum Racks, audio loops, and simplers). I tend to hear good things about Battery3, and as a fan of NI's other instruments, I thought I'd look into it a bit further.

I've been fiddling with the demo... and I'm just not seeing the benefit of it. What is the point of drum VSTs anyways? It doesn't have a step sequencer, so I can't use it like a drum machine. Isn't it just a sampler? I mean, what's the work flow benefit of using it? The included sound banks don't seem that hot, except for maybe the percussion stuff, and it's definitely not worth it just for some nice perc banks.

So I can load my own samples into the banks, and trigger them with midi. But first I need to figure out which samples are on each note. Not hard, but it's one more step that takes away from time I could be making beats.

So what makes Battery more than just a VST sampler? Am I missing something? What does everyone else use for drums? Are there any VSTs out there with a decent sequencer, or should I stick to sequencing in Live with drum racks?

[fatadub]

same problem here, i checked out battery 3 aswell and just didnt see the advantage. still usin live drums n samples and building from there.


there must be a better way

[Ldizzy]

look into its humanizing / programming functions...

i like working with it a lot...

[RandoRando]

Am wondering this as well as for me. I just drag my drum samples from my browser on the left In FL into my step sequencer. FLs piano roll has a humanize function. Don't see the advantage of battery besides more drum sounds

[JBE]

I don't use them. FL has the FPC which I use from time to time but definitely not my first choice. Does battery not rename the midi notes to the sample names so you can find them easily? Lately I've just been doing all my beats right in the playlist with the raw audio files and I'm liking it quite a bit. I feel like I can be a bit more impulsive with it.

If you want a sequencer you could pick up the low end version of fl for like 30-40 dollars and it's basically just the sequencer.

[Dreadfunk]

I don't use them. FL has the FPC which I use from time to time but definitely not my first choice. Does battery not rename the midi notes to the sample names so you can find them easily? Lately I've just been doing all my beats right in the playlist with the raw audio files and I'm liking it quite a bit. I feel like I can be a bit more impulsive with it.

If you want a sequencer you could pick up the low end version of fl for like 30-40 dollars and it's basically just the sequencer.

Doesn't seem to be renaming the midi notes for me in live.

The only thing I miss when I'm working with straight audio is envelopes and velocity. You can approximate it with volume automation, but it's a little clunky compared to using a sampler with Attack and Release. So I tend to use drum racks in Ableton, which is OK, but I don't like how much you have to mess with the samplers to get it sounding right. The volumes always seem to be all wonky, and it doesn't have any automatic settings for velocity, so there's a lot of tinkering getting everything situated.

I like to lay beats down fast, and then go back and edit everything in more detail once I have a groove going. I'm looking for a way to make my workflow more conducive to creativity.

I use Ableton Live, and I don't really want to do my beats externally with FL, though the step sequencer in FL is really fun to use.

[JBE]

I use Ableton Live, and I don't really want to do my beats externally with FL, though the step sequencer in FL is really fun to use.

I'm pretty sure you can load it into ableton as a VST. Then it's just a matter of setting up your beat, then render it down for use in ableton. You'll never actually have to leave your ableton window. Just a suggestion though.

[virks]

point is that u can edit all your drum samples separtly...think how u edit 20 samples in 20 audio tracks...it
is tool to make things quikcer i think

[martello]

I use Cubase 5 and I cant imagine to build beats without B3. Yes, it's just a sampler but very comfortable.
-I need only one midi channel and all my drums are in one place, very easy to build patterns, no need to jump from one channel to another and I can see and edit all the stuff in one place.
-Every drumpad has an audio output, so you can apply effects separately, then route them together again or whatever.
-Browsing through my drum sample library is so easy and quick. For ex, when i'm looking for the right kick drum and i have to go through 300 kick samples, i dont have to drag'n drop samples, it is possible just by one mouse click in Battery.

[hasezwei]

the inbuilt fx (mainly compressor, envelope and pitching) are essential for me to get good drum sounds. i can turn one or two weak samples into a snappy cracking snare with just a few tweaks in battery. then i can route them to the same output channel to further process them, or resample them and load into battery again.
that and being able to have all my drums written in one midi channel.

[Depone]

The ability to layer velocity layers of samples, trigger voice groups (like when a closed hihat stops an opened one) . My main benefit is to be able to add vol envelopes to any sample... pitch it up/down or whatever with just a few clicks. the drum articulations are amazing, and once you delve deeper into it you will realize its true potential. fuck, you can even have pitch envelopes for some weird eskmo type things.

[silkpantsman]

for live set up the drum rack is wat you want but for making tracks batterys articulation is awesome the envelopes are better the effects are nice enough too and sound different to your daw which is always a gud thing the sample library comes in handy and its NI which means they will keep pushing the capabilities of the vst more so than say ableton will with the drum racks. If you just program your tracks then u prob wont c much of an advantage but if you enjoy playing your tunes then you ll have more fun with vst's.

[Dreadfunk]

Thanks for the replies. I'll delve a little more into it before I decide if it's worth my while.

[jaws]

the sound library alone is almost worth buying it. it's huge and filled with great sounds

[mta7388]

samples alone are worth it and really deep intuitive sample editing and fx.

love it, but no step sequencer makes me a little sad

[hasezwei]

love it, but no step sequencer makes me a little sad

this. i'd love to have a drum sequencer working with patterns, if it's got swing templates even better.
then i'd do my drums in battery, play them with my midi controller into the step/pattern sequencer, fix them afterwards because i can't stay in time (i blame latency) and then after i have a couple of patterns trigger them with my launchpad or so.

[daft cunt]

I use Cubase 5 and I cant imagine to build beats without B3. Yes, it's just a sampler but very comfortable.
-I need only one midi channel and all my drums are in one place, very easy to build patterns, no need to jump from one channel to another and I can see and edit all the stuff in one place.
-Every drumpad has an audio output, so you can apply effects separately, then route them together again or whatever.
-Browsing through my drum sample library is so easy and quick. For ex, when i'm looking for the right kick drum and i have to go through 300 kick samples, i dont have to drag'n drop samples, it is possible just by one mouse click in Battery.

The ability to layer velocity layers of samples, trigger voice groups (like when a closed hihat stops an opened one) . My main benefit is to be able to add vol envelopes to any sample... pitch it up/down or whatever with just a few clicks. the drum articulations are amazing, and once you delve deeper into it you will realize its true potential. fuck, you can even have pitch envelopes for some weird eskmo type things.

the sound library alone is almost worth buying it. it's huge and filled with great sounds

Very much all that and also the fact that you can save your drum kits, which is particularly useful when you're working on a tune that's going nowhere but has good drums. Much better than resampling and ending up with just a break.

Battery can be a bit confusing at first but it quickly becomes very addictive.

[factory presets]

I sort of fell into using Battery coz it came with Komplete. It's got some good sounds in the library and all the fx and envelopes are a lot of fun. But even after using it for years I still don't find it very intuitive. And it is next to useless for working with breaks.

So now I use Geist from FXpansion. Its got built in beat slicers and sequencers, and handles layering much tidier than Battery. The internal sequencers are limited to 16 velocities, but you can play 128 velocity steps if you play the hits from your DAW. The Midi patterns from sliced breaks can be dragged straight into the midi lanes on a DAW and keep all the subtle timing variations. And you can use it as a mini DAW in standalone mode, which makes it useful for working on ideas away from the studio.

On the downside, its not as pretty as Battery, or, in my experience, as stable. I still find it uesful, but its better to save on the regular. It is still on version 1 so expect stability to get a lot better, quickly. Whether its better than fruity loops is a harder question to answer. Its more expensive and not as fully featured. Although a lot of the content is a bit higher quality. But it is designed to work inside a DAW instead of trying to be one. If you are already using FL, its probably not worth it. If your not happy with you current drum trools, the demo might be worth a download.

[Electric_Head]

I use Cubase 5 and I cant imagine to build beats without B3. Yes, it's just a sampler but very comfortable.
-Browsing through my drum sample library is so easy and quick. For ex, when i'm looking for the right kick drum and i have to go through 300 kick samples, i dont have to drag'n drop samples, it is possible just by one mouse click in Battery.

This is a Cubase flaw causing you to use Battery.
Not trying to change the topic but imo Reaper has taken the useage of samples to the next level.
Media browser allows you to audition samples by just selecting the sample.
I use a combination of Battery and straight Reaper drag n drop functionality.

[jaws]

I do kind of the same thing, except I use this:http://www.icedaudio.com

originally got it so I could meta-tag all my samples and keep them organized (works really well, saves a lot of time digging for sounds and I have well over 1,000,0000 samples and loops on my samples drive)

I use pro tools, which almost noone else on here does, but battery gives me a functionality (drag and drop samples into a mpc style matrix) that helps a lot with programming