TUTORIAL : Stereo image / panning + neg. sampledelay plugins

[Ldizzy]

EDIT : SCROLL DOWN 3 POSTS FOR A TUTORIAL

Howdy yall..

First: i have a question about the existence of some ideal plugin... ive been searching for days with no success..

Second : i will use this thread to post some of the stereo imagery experiments im currently conducting.. and some of the techniques im learning (bob katz's books help me a lot with this)... i will do that later on.. but for now the plugin question :

Plugin question
Lately, ive been digging a lot of info on one of the most daunting subject for an ex newyork90'srapbeatmaker like me... the stereo image...

i used to feel very bad about panning stuff from the center, which kept me from finishing my beats.. and then i thought about the vast array of possibilities one could benefit from, in order to take advantage of the entire field when mixing...

Ive been playing a lot with sample delay to add width (and i know about its drawbacks)... and i sometimes need to drag a sample backwards, instead of delaying it from a couple samples..

My question :

Logic's stock sample delay plugin allows u to delay a side of the image by a certain amount of samples..

-it doesnt display milisecond values, and while i know i could do the math, i still think itd be interesting...
-it doesnt allow you to drag the values early... like -2 samples (earlier then the rest of the piece)...

about the ''earlier'' values
since there's a lookahead function on some plugins, i thought it might be theoretically possible that there would be such a unit... but im not quite sure

is there a plugin that does that? (i kno i could bounce to audio and shift a couple samples earlier, but im lookin for an actual plugin if possible)!

thx

[Ldizzy]

BLAAAAM

Ditto

Found a wonderful little tool that works in both vst and au :

Airwindow sampledelay :



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

EDIT : WOW IM SO HAPPY OMFGWTFROFLBFFWTHLMFAOBBQ XD

[Hoborg]

^I checked out that plugin and the site has a ton of free audio unit plugins, if that interests anyone

http://www.airwindows.com/

[Ldizzy]

THE TUTORIAL

here is a new technique im experimenting with...

Bare sample delay on one side gives width to any sound... problem is its hardly mono compatible...

here is an example for anyone who never experienced it...

4 bar loops from a sample pack.

1-Original naked Loop (slight stereo in the loop)
2-Loop in mono (doesnt loose much power)
3-Original naked Loop (so you could rinse your ears)
4-Loop with stereo delay of around 99 samples.. which is a lot, i overexagerated the effect, but i shouldntve..
5-Loop, after sample delay, in mono... = LOSES POWER + WEIRD COMB FILTERING EFFECT...

Soundcloud

the drum itself doesnt loose that much power amplitudewise if u want my opinion and is still, loudly punching thru.. but its spectrum is pretty much wrecked... and i feel there is some kind of weird comb filtering occuring... it kills the sense of power in the drum track.. and is badly annoying...

There, you c why ur synths/vocals/breaks/tunes/basslines if widened with no caution, can fall apart thru a mono setup (eg : most of my small towns clubs)

I experimented with sample delay recently, and i was directed towards a technique used extensively with pads and strings... ive seen this one on pensado's place, last week. Dave talked about techniques to clear the center of mixes... i didnt use it in that perspective, and my way of tweaking it is not as nearly as good as his. (i have succeeded by biting his settings but im slowly understanding that there is a LOT to do with such a concept)... pensado made me do it

i dont master this technique.. at all... ive been experimenting with it for 3 days.. and i still use my ugly coby earplugs to do it... but still... i applied it to a very ugly patch... not as exagerated... and managed to keep all the power when switched to mono...


Here are two examples : one more recent, and under ull find an older one (like an hour older)...

HERE IS THE NEW EXAMPLE :

as posted below

when u compare it to the very first example posted above (with the same stock loop)...

1) loop itself
2) mega wide with the technique
3) mono compatibility check = there is a loss of power... considerable.. but the effect was exagerated, and on drums...

it loses a bit of power... but it doesnt experience that very ugly comb filtering that makes it sound so bad.

keep in mind its on a drum loop and i wouldnt use it with such extreme settings, especially on drums..

Soundcloud

cool idnit?

THE PRINCIPLE

so how ? : bussing your original sound to two busses, each with its own delay plugin... delay one forward, the other backwards a couple ms... or samples... until its wide...

and pan one hard left and the other hard right..

So far, the sound should be wide, but not mono compatible.. (try it; its actually why i dislike the widening functions of certain softsynths eg: massive)

Now, buss them to a 3rd bus... which has autopanning.

Ive used automation to autopan... its doable... but i got tired and purchased a plugin... I now use panman, which is not free.... but it has two fun settings :

-width (some kind of ratio value of how far the plugin is gonna push the sounds far left and far right)...
-and rate (determines how fast itll toggle)...

its basically just an autopan plugin... and it is mos def achievable in ur host daw... but panman does it easily.

Now here's the interesting part :

With a low rate, so a slow panning between left and right, u see what the effect truly is... its just automated panning between two differently delayed versions of the sound... a little more complex then just panning.. but still.. your brain feels there is some kind of traveling from a to b.. and the patch itself is still very unidimensional...

But With a very very fast autopanning rate... your brain kinda computes the left right pannings as some kind of widening, altho focus is just toggling from left to right to left to right. You kinda get the feel that its wide... and very abstractly placed...

the faster the rate, the most seemeless it is and the most u can ajust the width parameter.. The width can't be pushed too far, and i feel there is some kind of breakpoint, after which the effect sounds like stuttering...

the really cool part about all of that is that its a concept. and there is a lot to explore around it.. like eq each side differently, pan the resulting sound... it results in a somewhat abstractly placed sound... but still..

[Ldizzy]

i realize i shouldve exagerated the example in the second clip as well... i dont have the ugly file anymore.. ill try to do soemthing about it

[Ldizzy]

edit : integrated to tutorial.

[hasezwei]

dude just reading this sounds interesting, i'll give it a go when i have my headphones back tomorrow. have only one speaker left on my stereo

[Ldizzy]

EDIT : integrated to tutorial.

[Ldizzy]

Im waiting for friends to come over