Core skills to work on, opinions?

[VirtualMark]

Hey, i've been thinking. In the past few months i've literally watched and read every tutorial i could find. Lately it has dawned on me that i just don't have time to learn every last thing about music production. I've read a lot of interviews with different producers and theres varying opinion on things to learn. We're all limited by time, and i just wondered what core skills people consider the most important to getting good at making music fast.

I mean, i could learn reaktor or max for live. Both give a large amount of control to making synths, effects etc. But there are a lot of awesome synths and effects out there already, made by people who are considerably more experienced than me, surely my time would be better spent using these synths? Learning reaktor alone could take months of hard study. Does anyone here know reaktor or max for live really well?

Another one i'm undecided about is learning to play the keyboard. I have no interest in playing a keyboard live, but i am interested in the potential benefits of becoming more musical. How many of you play an instrument, and do you feel it helps your production?

The way i'm approaching it is to have a mixture of learning software(manuals, tutorials), learning core music skills(chords, scales, modes etc), learning sould design(books and vids), learning mixing and putting it all into practice. Sometimes i'll spend a day resampling basses, other times i'll work on beats, other times i'll make a whole tune.

I'd be interested in hearing thoughts/opinions on how you approached learning production, what you consider important etc. also how long you've been producing for, what results you feel you've got.

[wub]

Have been thinking about this a lot recently (last week or so). When I first started out, it was all about getting samples together and arranging them collage style. That period lasted for about 18months. Then I started working more heavily on my sound design, getting it to the stage where I knew how to make sounds myself from the VSTs I had. Then I moved onto improving my workflow, getting my templates setup in FL, so whenever I wanted to do something I could have a project organised & routed correctly ready to load up and drop sounds straight into.

Recently, I've been working heavily on my song structure/programming, as well as speeding up my decision making when I'm working on a project. If an idea isn't working, whereas before I'd spend time trying to make it work (often to the project's detriment), these days I'm learning more when to discard and move onto something else. I'm also working on speeding up how quickly I can lay out a track structure, turning ideas into finished projects quicker.

Once I've sped up my workflow so that I can put together tunes that are well programming and structured together quicly, I'm going to go back and focus on my advanced sound design techniques. That way (at least the way I'd like it to work) I can put out more advanced sounds and place them into a project faster.

In the background, whilst all of this has been going on, I've been looking at my processing techniques, doing a bit of post production mastering work for some of my mates to get a feel for (albeit basic) mastering of other people's tunes, as well as learning more about how to work on my mixdowns etc before the mastering stage.

[VirtualMark]

thats interesting. i've followed a similar path in some ways - i've set up templates, macros and key commands in cubase plus organised my samples library. so now i can set up a track real quickly and know roughly where the samples i need will be.

i definitely need to work on finishing projects. i have tons and tons of projects that are just 8 bar loops. not to say that this is a waste, as i could use sounds from them. but i do tend to move on once i find that something isn't going anywhere. i don't know if this is good practice or not. on one hand, it might be better to discipline myself and work through a project and finish it no matter what. on the other hand as you said, if it isn't working discard it and try something else. i suppose with all these projects kicking around, there will be some sounds and presets which could be used in other tunes.

i don't think i'm going to put a lot of time into reaktor or max for live, as the rewards probably won't justify the time i'll spend. not to say this is the same for everyone. i'm not a preset man by any means, i love the sound design aspect of electronic music. but as for making my own synths, it just seems unnecessary when theres so many good plugins out there. i don't even have time to learn all the synths i'd like to try, i've had to narrow it down to a few choice ones.

still undecided whether to learn the keyboard. i think there are potential benefits but it is a bit of an uphill struggle for me. i don't really enjoy it, but i'd like to be able to play it.

[Zöo Pop]

I just started to learn how to play the piano and I just think its cool, if its ever one of those days, you could just go mad on it, play some old songs, jam on it and maybe even make a lead out of it. I'm sure it'll impress them ladies too

If your into Guitar Hero, this program is just like it but for your comp with a MIDI controller:

http://synthesiagame.com/

[bassinine]

I just started to learn how to play the piano and I just think its cool, if its ever one of those days, you could just go mad on it, play some old songs, jam on it and maybe even make a lead out of it. I'm sure it'll impress them ladies too

If your into Guitar Hero, this program is just like it but for your comp with a MIDI controller:

http://synthesiagame.com/

this looks amazing.. going to play with this tonight i think. going to get my girlfriend to have a go with it, she keeps telling me she wants to learn to play piano.

[press]

one of the biggest jumps in the quality of my tracks was after i started forcing myself to finish things. you can only learn so much from making a buch of loops with sick drumz a few atmos and a lead/bass. the next level comes from getting good at arranging, doing edits, buildups etc. so most of the time it will be worth the time to finish what may be a really shitty song so that you can get better at those things that youll only be doing once your deep into a song.

next was gaining restraint. i make my tunes most of the time starting with a solid stacked 16-32 bar loop, at one time i thought i wanted this loop to be in most of the song cuz it all sounds good together and this is the sick loop i made after all, i would then get into a rut where in order to make the song change or switch up i would want to add somethign on top or slightly change something and this may work good sometimes but i found it was better to make my song build and unbuild into and out of this main sick loop. i needed to reesist the urge to add more and more and use good arranging and automation to make the song move into that big main part i liked so much. less is often more especially in this genre.

[das_raunchy]

i know that i need to work on structuring, fills, and builds. i think even a shit tune can sound good with decent structuring and the right bells and whistles

[eldoogle]

I started December of 2010. I read a lot, mainly about gain staging and I learned Operator. Lately, I can open Operator and construct a new unique sound in minutes. Those were the two main things I've understood.

I need to improve with better drum samples, breakdowns, transitions. I'm having trouble with what comes after the drop has played out.

I think that making melodies that sound good are important. If you can't do that, it isn't listenable.

[legend4ry]

I learned the way I still make music...With just trying stuff out, sure I came on here and made a few threads when I first started but they was mainly threads like.. "I can do this but how I can take it one step further" or. "Does anyone have samples of X.." the rest of the time I was just trying stuff out, studying other music I looked up to and kept grafting till I was a bag-o-knowledge from self teaching.

My one and only tip for anyone not knowing what to work on its...




Work flow.

Core skills are those which you're good at and those what work for you.. Once you've found out how to do enough in your DAW so its natural and know how to make a full length tune with ease you don't really -need- much else (By with ease I mean, if you can 'know' when a group of drums & sounds will work together and sequence them well enough to make a full track without having to think about it).Everything other than that is stuff you could know not should.

You don't even need a good mix down, just have everything sitting in the right place gain-structure wise and tell your ME exactly what you want. You don't need to learn synthesis either - sure I know my way around a FM synth and a subtractive synth but 90% of my sounds are samples or presets and I always get complimented in my sound design because I pick the right sounds for the tune! (going back to my first point..)

I think one of the core skills nearly everyone has and need to get rid of it is they think they need to learn everything before they can make good music.

Learn the basics; How to use your DAW to level where you don't have to look at the manual anymore to do anything (by DAW I mean the actual software not the synths or plugins what come with it..Learn short cuts, how to use the mixer and stuff!). Then work on getting a group of sounds which compliment drums and work on building a relationship between the two to make your track sound like if it was any other way it'll not sound right...Then do it again, then do it again and again! Each time getting it so much more perfect.

Repeat for 3-6 years.

You'll be banging out a beat in every sitting.



On the theory side of things.
You should at least know what a scale sounds like - I learned by playing the same scales over and over again that my brain 'knows' what a C-Minor sounds like by pitch changes and as that progressed my ears was telling my brain to tell my hands "no ledge, its not that key to press on the keyboard, its that one cause it goes up 1 more semi tone..".. But everyone learns different.

[travis_baker]

I need to improve with better drum samples, breakdowns, transitions. I'm having trouble with what comes after the drop has played out.

i find that i get lazy when comes to breakdowns and transitions, so hard to make it sound interesting yet not to powerfull.

[legend4ry]

I need to improve with better drum samples, breakdowns, transitions. I'm having trouble with what comes after the drop has played out.

i find that i get lazy when comes to breakdowns and transitions, so hard to make it sound interesting yet not to powerfull.

I always approach transitions like intros within the drop..

You want to escalate your music (even if its for 1 bar) to ease the tune into the next part. If it comes to sudden it'll not sound right.

I hate using my own music as an example but its the first example what comes to mind.. Skip to the drop then hear how I bring in the transition of the lead then the little beeps..

I bring out everything and just have it fade out while the snares do their thing for the mini drop to bring in the lead then for the beeps I change up the kick patten and bring the crash in.. it makes it sound more natural! Might not be the kind of music you're making but its all relative!

Soundcloud

[travis_baker]

I need to improve with better drum samples, breakdowns, transitions. I'm having trouble with what comes after the drop has played out.

i find that i get lazy when comes to breakdowns and transitions, so hard to make it sound interesting yet not to powerfull.

I always approach transitions like intros within the drop..

You want to escalate your music (even if its for 1 bar) to ease the tune into the next part. If it comes to sudden it'll not sound right.

I hate using my own music as an example but its the first example what comes to mind.. Skip to the drop then hear how I bring in the transition of the lead then the little beeps..

I bring out everything and just have it fade out while the snares do their thing for the mini drop to bring in the lead then for the beeps I change up the kick patten and bring the crash in.. it makes it sound more natural! Might not be the kind of music you're making but its all relative!

Soundcloud

ok, normaly id just put a hi freq filter and mudulate it before the drop... no creativity what so ever.

[wub]

thats interesting. i've followed a similar path in some ways - i've set up templates, macros and key commands in cubase plus organised my samples library. so now i can set up a track real quickly and know roughly where the samples i need will be.

I'm forcing myself to learn all the hot cut keys/shortcuts as well as opposed to clicking on the icons to change between pointer tools etc

i definitely need to work on finishing projects. i have tons and tons of projects that are just 8 bar loops. not to say that this is a waste, as i could use sounds from them. but i do tend to move on once i find that something isn't going anywhere. i don't know if this is good practice or not. on one hand, it might be better to discipline myself and work through a project and finish it no matter what. on the other hand as you said, if it isn't working discard it and try something else. i suppose with all these projects kicking around, there will be some sounds and presets which could be used in other tunes.

The finishing projects thing has been a massive help for me; cranked out another 2 last night and reckon one of them I can develop and use as a basis for a remix of something else.

Learn the basics; How to use your DAW to level where you don't have to look at the manual anymore to do anything (by DAW I mean the actual software not the synths or plugins what come with it..Learn short cuts, how to use the mixer and stuff!). Then work on getting a group of sounds which compliment drums and work on building a relationship between the two to make your track sound like if it was any other way it'll not sound right...Then do it again, then do it again and again! Each time getting it so much more perfect.

Repeat for 3-6 years.

You'll be banging out a beat in every sitting.

As we discussed on IM the other day, this is exactly where I'm heading at right now

one of the biggest jumps in the quality of my tracks was after i started forcing myself to finish things. you can only learn so much from making a buch of loops with sick drumz a few atmos and a lead/bass. the next level comes from getting good at arranging, doing edits, buildups etc. so most of the time it will be worth the time to finish what may be a really shitty song so that you can get better at those things that youll only be doing once your deep into a song.

next was gaining restraint. i make my tunes most of the time starting with a solid stacked 16-32 bar loop, at one time i thought i wanted this loop to be in most of the song cuz it all sounds good together and this is the sick loop i made after all, i would then get into a rut where in order to make the song change or switch up i would want to add somethign on top or slightly change something and this may work good sometimes but i found it was better to make my song build and unbuild into and out of this main sick loop. i needed to reesist the urge to add more and more and use good arranging and automation to make the song move into that big main part i liked so much. less is often more especially in this genre.

I read an article somewhere a while back about alternative approaches to structuring. Basically once you've got your 32 bar loop or whatever, open up the arrangement window and set an end point. This is the point that the track will and must end by.

Then fill up the entire arrangement window until that point with all your elements so you've got the full 32 bar loop playing for the entirety. Then subtract elements where you think they should/shouldn't be.

[serox]

I think working on drums and sound design are a good place to start.

[Electric_Head]

I think working on drums and sound design are a good place to start.

Hell yes

[nowaysj]

Way more important than sound design and all the general production jiggery, I'd recommend learning the keyboard or some type of rhythmic drumming.

Actual production and mixing aren't that hard, they often just seem that way, once you've done it enough, it is pretty easy. Song writing can be hard, but it is much easier if you are working with musical ideas (realized by actual playing on some type of instrumentation) so in some sense, the songs will write themselves.

Past a certain level of production competency (which is really quite low) the only people that care about production quality are nerds. But everyone is looking to hear fresh expressive music and it is much easier to make that if you can use your body to channel music.

Words from my personal experience.

[Anne Droid]

i think people focus too much on sound design without learning real music theory

My ability to make an actual tune and not just a cool sound, has dramatically increased since studying theory

[Alistairr]

Have been thinking about this a lot recently (last week or so). When I first started out, it was all about getting samples together and arranging them collage style. That period lasted for about 18months. Then I started working more heavily on my sound design, getting it to the stage where I knew how to make sounds myself from the VSTs I had. Then I moved onto improving my workflow, getting my templates setup in FL, so whenever I wanted to do something I could have a project organised & routed correctly ready to load up and drop sounds straight into.

Recently, I've been working heavily on my song structure/programming, as well as speeding up my decision making when I'm working on a project. If an idea isn't working, whereas before I'd spend time trying to make it work (often to the project's detriment), these days I'm learning more when to discard and move onto something else. I'm also working on speeding up how quickly I can lay out a track structure, turning ideas into finished projects quicker.

Once I've sped up my workflow so that I can put together tunes that are well programming and structured together quicly, I'm going to go back and focus on my advanced sound design techniques. That way (at least the way I'd like it to work) I can put out more advanced sounds and place them into a project faster.

In the background, whilst all of this has been going on, I've been looking at my processing techniques, doing a bit of post production mastering work for some of my mates to get a feel for (albeit basic) mastering of other people's tunes, as well as learning more about how to work on my mixdowns etc before the mastering stage.

hahah whoaaaaaaaa....expert alert!

im not even cloase to the mastering stage, ive got song structure sorted, melodies and harmonies i understand from being classically trained, but what i struggle is on sound design if u will. workflow is not a problem for me, i jsut use ableton for that and rewire reason.