How to add variation to your track

[Brad1]

(structure wise not sound design wise)

This is really important. Sound design and structure really are the same thing, but you can change their sort of balance as you are working. Getting the skeleton of a song done FIRST, and then focusing on the sound design can be really effective as once you see w/in the song where things need to happen, you'll then have something TO design. You'll know this sound will have to build, or release, or create suspense or whatever. Just working on sound design is great for learning, but too much time there, and you'll miss the plot that your sounds need to be embodying the movement/flow of energy within your song.

Also, if you are posting and getting a lot of rude replies in return, you may want to consider that there is something in the way that you are communicating that is generating that kind of response. A lot of times people around here are just fucking around with their attitude, and a thicker skin would serve you well, other times you may be putting out a bad vibe and not realize it.

When saying sound design do you mean sound design as in making all of the sounds and then the structure as the placement? If so alright thank you I will try and focus on this, I think I might have messed up because if I understand correct I might have messed up on sound design, spending too much time in that more than the structure. Because I can get a pretty sick bassline going but then to keep it going or entertain the listener is where I struggle at by adding variations.

Hmm, I understand the joking once and a while but when I'm looking for help and just constantly getting negativity it gets annoying. Like I completely understand I was an asshole in most of these posts on this thread, but in the original post if someone could tell me how I was being an ass I'd be glad to change it because I don't see it. Also, whenever I post a new thread I'm never rude in the posts, and always polite but I get the same feedback so that's when I become a dick. When I'm also replying to what someone has posted I try to give an answer or feedback on what I think but always being polite and things like that. Whatever though, gonna be the last thread I post on this forum. Getting more angry than enjoying reading, helping, learning, etc. Thanks to those who helped

[Hertz]

Seriously, no one can tell you how to be creative, either you "hear" it in your head or you don't. It'ss about trying to make the sounds that you imagine in your head come to life. Then turning that into a story, or song.

[nowaysj]

When saying sound design do you mean sound design as in making all of the sounds and then the structure as the placement?

Yeah. We all like music for different reasons, but do you like songs where its like for one bar the bass in interesting? I bet not. It is the motion, the pauses, all the transformations that happen as the song unfolds that make music interesting, imo. So focusing on that movement should be of paramount importance (song writing). Once you do that, then you can see the way the sounds need to behave to carry out the movement of the song. I know I'm saying the same thing as I said earlier, but it is a little subtle while being very important in my opinion.

[Brad1]

When saying sound design do you mean sound design as in making all of the sounds and then the structure as the placement?

Yeah. We all like music for different reasons, but do you like songs where its like for one bar the bass in interesting? I bet not. It is the motion, the pauses, all the transformations that happen as the song unfolds that make music interesting, imo. So focusing on that movement should be of paramount importance (song writing). Once you do that, then you can see the way the sounds need to behave to carry out the movement of the song. I know I'm saying the same thing as I said earlier, but it is a little subtle while being very important in my opinion.

Oh I agree with you completely, and its not that that I'm having trouble with hmm.. hard to explain. It seems my song so far is great (not being cocky at all) but I put in so many hours to make it so much better than my old songs. I have a really nice melody in my opinion along with a pretty sick drum rack, I'm getting a singer I know to do a few vocals for me, so to that point it feels like it is good and it sounds alot shorter explaining and even the buildup seems pretty good, best one I've done. I've got about 20 seconds into the actually drop though which I made a pretty nice wobble, and then I have one synth where I actually fit it in pretty nicely but other sounds I try adding to spice the song up and keep the listener entertained aren't going so well. For example: Whats popular in Knife Partys music (using this example because it seems like everyone on the forum hates Skrillex lol) but Knife Party is pretty well known for using that high pitch laser sound. So example on what I think could go from okay to much better: A song where when the bass drops it goes on and yes the wobbles notes changes but its mostly the same wobble the whole song. Making it better would be like adding in that laser sound once and a while to spice it up. It seems like this was the best way of explaining it but what people aren't understanding is that I'm NOT asking for someone to hold my hand here or for someone to be creative for me or whatever the case may be. All I was asking was for maybe a few tips and tricks/pointers. What I found after what you said was a great informative video which I'm still watching so I don't know if it will answer my question but its still learning: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFZTe-o7tYA goes along with the song design and structure.

[Brad1]

When saying sound design do you mean sound design as in making all of the sounds and then the structure as the placement?

Yeah. We all like music for different reasons, but do you like songs where its like for one bar the bass in interesting? I bet not. It is the motion, the pauses, all the transformations that happen as the song unfolds that make music interesting, imo. So focusing on that movement should be of paramount importance (song writing). Once you do that, then you can see the way the sounds need to behave to carry out the movement of the song. I know I'm saying the same thing as I said earlier, but it is a little subtle while being very important in my opinion.

Oh I agree with you completely, and its not that that I'm having trouble with hmm.. hard to explain. It seems my song so far is great (not being cocky at all) but I put in so many hours to make it so much better than my old songs. I have a really nice melody in my opinion along with a pretty sick drum rack, I'm getting a singer I know to do a few vocals for me, so to that point it feels like it is good and it sounds alot shorter explaining and even the buildup seems pretty good, best one I've done. I've got about 20 seconds into the actually drop though which I made a pretty nice wobble, and then I have one synth where I actually fit it in pretty nicely but other sounds I try adding to spice the song up and keep the listener entertained aren't going so well. For example: Whats popular in Knife Partys music (using this example because it seems like everyone on the forum hates Skrillex lol) but Knife Party is pretty well known for using that high pitch laser sound. So example on what I think could go from okay to much better: A song where when the bass drops it goes on and yes the wobbles notes changes but its mostly the same wobble the whole song. Making it better would be like adding in that laser sound once and a while to spice it up. It seems like this was the best way of explaining it but what people aren't understanding is that I'm NOT asking for someone to hold my hand here or for someone to be creative for me or whatever the case may be. All I was asking was for maybe a few tips and tricks/pointers. What I found after what you said was a great informative video which I'm still watching so I don't know if it will answer my question but its still learning: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFZTe-o7tYA goes along with the song design and structure.

[Sonika]

Something I've noticed with a lot of my favorite tunes is that after the drop comes in, it follows a fairly basic structure of beat, bass, chords sequence etc. This will switch up from time to time but mainly (and this is a generalization) it will stay the same. The factors that keep the track interesting are percussive accidentals, melodic hits, occasional (and tasteful) fx, that sort of thing.

[dubesteppe]

Something I've noticed with a lot of my favorite tunes is that after the drop comes in, it follows a fairly basic structure of beat, bass, chords sequence etc. This will switch up from time to time but mainly (and this is a generalization) it will stay the same. The factors that keep the track interesting are percussive accidentals, melodic hits, occasional (and tasteful) fx, that sort of thing.

otherwise you end up sounding like helicopter showdown

[Sonika]

Pretty much

[nowaysj]

All I was asking was for maybe a few tips and tricks/pointers.

Keep it the same, but make it different seriously is the most important thing in songwriting, and SO SO hard. I feel you on this one. It really is super important. My advice is make more changes than you'd think, make them more subtle than you'd think. Change two things at the same time. Make your degrees of change relative to the time of the change. So smaller/more subtle change ups happen very frequently like every bar, or two bars, moderate change ups happen every 4 bars, major change ups happen every 16 bars, when looping 16 bars, don't loop the same 16 w/the same change ups. Create different change ups, or switch out a four bar section in the second 16bar section for something different but the same.

Whatever man! It is madness, I'm still learning this, and am really focused on this right now. Getting a sound to sit just right in the mix is so damn subtle, but creating a little variation or switch up sound is equally as subtle (and prolly more important).

Honestly, just REALLY break down a lot of tracks that you like. Like one at a time, bring those tracks into your daw, tempo match them, and just study how that producer creates movement/change. Check how big the change is, where/when they occur, how much is loop and how much is variation on the loop. It is so instructive. Honestly, just write notes down (on paper) as you go. As you do this, be looking at the waveform, so you can pick up on stuff that I guarantee you didn't hear when you were just casually (or even analytically) listening. Guarantee more is changing than you think.

Do this for a few tracks in the same style, you'll have a bunch of notes, and then you can pick and chose which technique works in each particular situation, and what works right for you, but you'll never be at a loss for potential ideas on how to keep it moving. You have to still actually carry it out, like creating a subtle woosh or something, it's not like you can just snap your fingers and you've got it done. It might require a few types of noise with various curved envelopes, going into a flanger, a delay, a reverb, a stereo widener, and eq, with automation... just for one beats worth of sound at -20dbs... and you've got to do it just right... haha. This production/engineering/sound design shit is crazy!!!!!

[karmacazee]

Put a drum roll/different pattern at the end of every four bars. Resample your basses with different settings on the fx that you're processing them with, if you're talking about skrillex style bass switchups.

When you have a new section come in, drop out some of the instruments/sounds from the previous section just before it ends and replace them with white noise/fx buildups.

Works for a lot of producers.