Using sends

[MaZa1]

I use FL ( but why not in other DAWs too) and I've been wondering here that if I have lets say snare on mixer channel 1, and i use send channel lets say for reverb, I'm now sending the signal from channel 1 to master channel and to the send channel that sends the signal to the master channel too, so the snare is sent from 2 channels to the master channel now. But should i take off the signal sending from channel 1 to master channel and just use the separate send channel to play throught the master channel?

Hope someone understands what i'm trying to say

[jrisreal]

I guess you can if you want, but the idea of using a reverb on a send is so you only send part of the signal to the reverb and combine it with the dry signal.

[nowaysj]

You should do this:

Take the snare off of the master, send it to a channel that you name drum buss. Also send it to a rev send. That can be a specific snare verb, if that is the case, take that send off the master, and send it to the drum buss. That reverb should be 100% wet. Or you could send the snare to a drum buss reverb, which would be receiving all of the drums that need reverb. Send whatever amount from each sound/channel to the drum rev buss, then take that drum rev buss off the master, and send that to the drum buss.

OR, send the snare to mix level reverb, which is receiving various amounts of signal from different voices/channels/busses in the mix. This is basically your main reverb.

Send your drum buss and or your mix level reverb not to the master, but to a track called premaster. Premaster will receive everything, and send it to the master. Only thing going to master out is premaster. Don't ask my why all this premaster bizznus, just thank me in 1-3 years.

[MaZa1]

Thanks for your replies, nowaysj you got me thinking in a new way

[nowaysj]

One other thing, forgot to mention, you could also resample your snare with the reverb, to simplify all this bussing (though honestly, I keep everything live at least until I print (or likely resample) the drum buss, but that is just me, but if you've got the same huge snare smash every time, why not resample it?).

To resample your snare send it to an empty channel, and send it also to a channel with the reverb (which is 100% wet). You may want an eq before/and or after the reverb. I like it before because it pulls information out of the reverb algorithm, so the algorithm can run more cleanly on what you want it to. Still if their are unwanted frequencies after the reverb, an eq can help with that. Now send the reverb to the same empty channel that you're sending the snare to. Hit ctrl E on that empty channel. This calls up Edison, edison is your best friend, might treat you better than your moms. Get with Edison. Edison is like a tape machine, it will record input. Read help on edison. Hit record on edison, and likely click little button that says, "on play". Hit play on fl's transport. The snare will play and go to edison and the rev channel which will also go to edison. Hit stop, unarm the rec in edison. Zoom into the start of the snare, zoom way in, until you see little circles for samples. Click and drag where last circle that is on the center line before the waveform goes up. Zoom out and shift click where the snare reverb tail return to the center line. Make sure. Hit ctrl delete. You're left with your sample. You can save it into a snare folder in your sample library, and then you can drag it right into your playlist or into the step sequencer, or just about any other place you need to drag it. The drag button is in the row of buttons in the upper right side of edison. Forget what it looks like, I just do it.

Don't forget to clean up your mixer when you are done.

Also of note, the number keys 1,2,3 and 4 set the various snap's for edison. Can't recall, as it is automatic, but I think 4 is snap to zero crossing, this will help you find the points where the sample returns to the center line. 3 I think turns snapping off, which is also sometimes helpful. I might have 3 and 4 reversed there, I just do it w/ my fingers. 1 snaps to grid, but more on that later. The grid is a hidden feature, for whatever reason.

[MaZa1]

So I linked things like this:
Drums to drum buss, took it off from master.
Snare and cymbals also linked to drums rev buss-> linked to drum buss and took off from master.
Drum buss and all the other channels, except drum rev buss, linked to premaster channel-> linked to master channel.

Is this correct or did I understand something wrong?

[nowaysj]

Yep, sounds right. Can you play your track and mute the drum buss and hear no drums? If so you've probably got it set up correctly.

Now, as you are mixing you can process your drum buss as one unit. Maybe a little eq, compression, and light limiting? You can now also parallel process your whole drum buss.

There are a lot of threads about drum buss processing.

[MaZa1]

Yep, I need to check that out next
Also this helped me to keep my master level in better control. It peaked at -3 sometimes even -2db but now i can turn the premaster level down a notch so theres like 3-4db headroom. Thank you very much!

[nowaysj]

I would go further back upstream. Turn your drum buss down. And then turn down other channels/busses to match. Then turn up your audio interface. You should never worry about peaking the master. If you are worried, you've let your gain staging slip.

[nowaysj]

Drum buss and all the other channels, except drum rev buss, linked to premaster channel-> linked to master channel.?

Wait, where is drm rev bus going?

[mthrfnk]

Quick question: Why do you use a premaster channel?

[nowaysj]

It is just handy to have one last option before the master, have one more path to master that potentially avoids full mix processing.

It is one of those things that you might not do/figure out on your own, but likely will come in handy at various times.

[MaZa1]

Drum buss and all the other channels, except drum rev buss, linked to premaster channel-> linked to master channel.?

Wait, where is drm rev bus going?

To drum bus?
"Send whatever amount from each sound/channel to the drum rev buss, then take that drum rev buss off the master, and send that to the drum buss. "

[nowaysj]

Sounds good?

[MaZa1]

Well i can't hear any difference if it's going to drum bus or going to premaster.
But if thats wrong please tell me

[nowaysj]

Haha was supposed to be an exclamation mark, not a question mark!

[MaZa1]

Haha

[MaZa1]

Got to ask this, should i make my kick peak round -8, -10db, snare round -11,-12db etc, or should i turn them up like -3db etc and turn my drum bus to peak round -8,-10b?

Also, i didnt find any good tutorial/thread about drum bus processing, so could someone please give me a link to one or just give some advices?

[nowaysj]

First off, try to keep your mixer faders at 0db default untill the end when you really get to final mixing. So control your sound's volume from the source.

I build songs around my kick, and then snare. So I set my relative volumes off of those. The highest ill set my kick is -12 db. But usually more like -16db. This may sound low to you, but I can very nearly guarantee you'll get better results.

If it sounds low turn up your audio interface until it is entry loud.

Now in regards to the relative volumes of all other elements in the mix, honestly only your taste ears and exeperience can say. Once you get used to monitoring at a consistent level, based around your core element you'll get much better at making these types of mix decisions.

As far as drum buss processing, more later!

And read the money shot thread.

[nowaysj]

Okay, so there are threads about drum p (okay, having trouble typing, have been shot in the head, am in the hospital, think I can get through this ifyou can get through this). about drum buss processing. And one lately. so definitely start searching out reading, and bumping thoise if you have questions. For what I do, I basically master each buss then put them together, then mix them. Kinda backwards hehe. And not really but a little, actuallly. So drum buss. The whole question with drums is how hard do they hit, how is their feel in time, and then al always, just how clean are they, texture. To give the drums just some weight a slow attack middleish threshold pretty short release on like an ssl comp, or a clone. Antares do one of those? Bootsy just did one, know. Supposedly knucked the glue? Anyway that will just thicking up your buss. You can that release dialed in, and it can really start to bounce in a good way. Okay but to deal with that compression, you're going to have peaks which make it through the slow attack compression. Take out your hatchet, ie limiter, and cut the heads off. YOu don't need to nuke these either, just a little, just take little nips off the highest hits, which prolly gonna be snares, tbh, maybe the kick. But just take, 1,2,3 db off the top. Get to know you limiter. If you want to be a superhero, that is like your cape. Learn it. Okay, so then onto eq for the buss. If ou are going to lowpass the drum buss, just play with a variety of filter types, curves, and slopes. And check your peak levels as you do this. No point in chopping sub sub only to lose 3 db of headroom, what? yeah! Figure out that low end, figure out what is right, should it be linear phase, or minimal phase, listen, check those peak meters, you got phantom in your house? Maybe use a bell shapped curve, and sweep it all the way down, and play with the gain reduction and q. How is the phantom now? This part has been technical, but for the actual bass range, figure it out, how tight do you want it. How much can in breath? What is the tenstion level of the track. Something to think about. More tense, more compressed in my book. Just more large monotony pressing your ears. Your snare, where is it in the spectrum, 200-900 is a hell of a drug. Really got clean this, and maybe not even at teh buss level but previously, but at the buss, did is all still build up a little bit? If so maybe a wide shallow dip like 200-600 centered on 4oo would do. More elements an eq is working, the shallower your adjustments should be. Individual elements, steep kuts, buss level, shallow, master level, just s shade. Tired of talking about eq of the drum buss, but it is more of the same, just specifically looking at important areas of the psectrum, and seeing what is happeing there. How to fix the problem, make little surgical cut, if sibilance, and find the second harmonic of the cut and boost, oh maybe now there is that high zingyness without the razor edge to it, or maybe it is worse, he? Okay, personally I'm an eq, comp, limit kind of guy, that's generally the order I roll with. We're already thickened things up with the gooey beaffy comp. and chopped peaks with the lmiter so we'll have a large heavy clear rms fest.

On top of that, you can you know take the next step. Maybe work some saturation plugins in there. Maybe they can reduce your peaks by a db or two, and do it in a pleasant way, maybe it'll smooth over some sibilance blaosts in the hats rids, whatever. Maybe Vintag Warmer here, or many of the other saturators. Search here you will find many. Ferric, bootsy, oh yeah thrillseaker LA from boots.

Sorry man, brain fell apart on that one. I think maybe tomorrow morning, I can sort throuh that into one decently written paragraph. I really don't know what I've written.