Being More Efficient In Coming Up With Ideas?

[Egan]

So, a couple of minutes ago I responded to a post that was asking an open question the message bord about how we go about coming up with ideas for songs and it provoked thought in my mind. I've recently felt like I have a relatively effective method of coming up with ideas. I listen to artists that I would like to sound similar to with the intention of using them as inspiration for a song, take a break for an incubation period for my ideas, go to work, take a break, go to work again etc., constantly taking breaks to let my mind refuel ideas and prevent myself from burning out. Though in that thread someone mentioned the 10 000 hours that someone needs to put in before they can truly be a master of their craft. That made me wonder, is there a more effective way that I can go about working so that I can constantly be working but still consistently be productive? Because right now, my work style is relatively efficient, as when I hit a block, I take a break and search for inspiration so that I'm able to come back with fresh ideas.

My question for you is should I continue to work the same way I do now, or is there any other method of working that you would recommend that would allow me to work more for longer periods of time while still being productive?

[ljk32]

I'd say if it works now, continue doing it. You don't want to be producing without ideas(which is me). I literally have 0 ideas when producing, I can't think ahead and picture what should or will happen, which generally gets me stuck at a point where only a little section is complete. This is the most annoying problem, I think it's just a lack or creativity, but I can never picture how anything can progress. Anyway, I guess staying on topic, I'd just love some methods to be able to come up with ideas.

[Efrafa11]

I mean just having music as a hobby beyond production helps.
Reading mags/articles, learning instruments, learning theory, drooling over hardware & software
all are some worth while things to do if you can't produce and help get idea's flowing.
Working on old song mixes and just tweaking old songs is cool.
Music busy work pretty much...
Otherwise, you sound pretty happy with your set up now and as long as
it's keeping you content producing I see no reason to force yourself to work.

[Barka]

Your method seems fine, and if it works for you, there's no need to change it. My tip is, get out of your comfort zone in life regularly, do shit you're afraid to do, go out for a walk at 3:50 every once in a while, do a crazy 3 days rave session, whatever, just make sure you live outside of your daily habits, and you'll get inspired. If you do the same shit every day, don't expect inspiration to just come to you!

[Egan]

I appreciate your input guys. Sometimes it's hard to find serious and well thought out answers to questions like this haha.
I'm not so much stuck in coming up with ideas, I can do that, it's that I want to take my ability to be creative and work to the next level.
I want to push myself to become better and more efficient. Efficient is the key word for me here.
And I actually do play various instruments and have basic knowledge of theory. I play guitar and the trombone (lol), and as long as I've been interested in performing music and making music I've been into prog/technical death metal, as well as alternative rock and a bit more recently hip hop from the golden age specifically, so having a variety of musical experiences isn't a concern for me, but I've been looking forward to finding a way to incorporate those experiences into my electronic music productions. Making that combination sound good will without a doubt be putting me outside of my comfort zone.

[Maxxan]

Do you people think that inspiration is an actual thing? I know the concept is vague to begin with but I've always felt that for me there is nothing but hard work and practive. Sometimes I'll be inspired as in having an idea for how I want the track to sound, but this usually has more to do with me hearing some old blues track and thinking I want to make something that sounds like that, rather than sitting on a bench gazing out across a sunset and then suddenly having a whole tune in my head. It's not inspiration so much as just a general sense of what I want to do. From that point onwards it's just about going to work, trying melodies, scrapping a lot, trying again and eventually finding something I'm happy with, after a lot of hours.

Is it like that for everyone or are there people who have a 'gift', as in hearing the track before it's done and then just getting it down?

If so, I'm fucking bummed lol.

[ljk32]

Do you people think that inspiration is an actual thing? I know the concept is vague to begin with but I've always felt that for me there is nothing but hard work and practive. Sometimes I'll be inspired as in having an idea for how I want the track to sound, but this usually has more to do with me hearing some old blues track and thinking I want to make something that sounds like that, rather than sitting on a bench gazing out across a sunset and then suddenly having a whole tune in my head. It's not inspiration so much as just a general sense of what I want to do. From that point onwards it's just about going to work, trying melodies, scrapping a lot, trying again and eventually finding something I'm happy with, after a lot of hours.

Is it like that for everyone or are there people who have a 'gift', as in hearing the track before it's done and then just getting it down?

If so, I'm fucking bummed lol.

I'm exactly like you man, can never picture a track beforehand. Also, I lack creativity.

[crunkedxup]

Do you people think that inspiration is an actual thing? I know the concept is vague to begin with but I've always felt that for me there is nothing but hard work and practive. Sometimes I'll be inspired as in having an idea for how I want the track to sound, but this usually has more to do with me hearing some old blues track and thinking I want to make something that sounds like that, rather than sitting on a bench gazing out across a sunset and then suddenly having a whole tune in my head. It's not inspiration so much as just a general sense of what I want to do. From that point onwards it's just about going to work, trying melodies, scrapping a lot, trying again and eventually finding something I'm happy with, after a lot of hours.

Is it like that for everyone or are there people who have a 'gift', as in hearing the track before it's done and then just getting it down?

It sounds like that is actually inspiration, to me inspiration is anything that gets you doing something. it's the precursor to the hard work and practice that you are talking about.

I got into the habit of imagining tracks in my head before doing them after i became scared that banging keys on my keyboard and coming up with a good tune was a "fluke" and that other musicians would see it that way. My attitude has changed since, ive realised it doesn't really matter how you get there just as long as you get there.

the way i see it, if you can think up a track in your head beforehand, then that increases the amount of things you can draw inspiration from. I remember seeing an interview with the producer Baths where he said that after hearing new music, seeing art or seeing a film that particularly touched him, he'd meditate on it (in the bath. i'm not even joking) and that's how he came up with his tunes (and his name). Something about that, having a thought process behind your music, seems very genuine. almost as if the results can't be bad.

I will say thinking of ideas beforehand was extremely hard to start out with (for me), but it gets easier as you and your mind kind of "sync up" and you become more in tune with the things that inspire you.

I'm exactly like you man, can never picture a track beforehand. Also, I lack creativity.

Look at creativity as a muscle. It can be used and made stronger.

http://www.realsimple.com/health/mind-m ... 000079583/

i thought this article was alright, before i read it i never made the connection between being childlike and creativity.

[Maxxan]

I've thought a lot about whether or not I 'lack' creativity as well. I'm not sure that you can. On one hand, I see some of my friends who'll just sit down in front of a computer and instantly have an idea for a track, but then again these are all classicaly trained musicians. I've also seen a lot of improvement on my own tunes, more and more I'm thinking there is no such thing, it's all just commitment and persistence.

Good post Crunked. I've been making some changes in my life, been considering some kind of meditation or something as well. That's really interesting, would be cool if you could learn to focus your mind on thinking up melodies and stuff, rather than playing them out at random. There's always this element of chaos in my tunes, and while interesting, sometimes it feels like I'd like a bit more control. Really cool stuff, will try that for sure.

[crunkedxup]

been considering some kind of meditation or something as well.

good idea, always helps. if not for music you should do it anyway, I'd recommend it to anyone who gets a bit overwhelmed by the world like i do all the time haha.

[ljk32]

Hey crunked, thanks a lot for the reply, and I did read the article, but I think my problem is pretty bad and is gonna take a lot more than that to fix it. How did you start to be able to produce creatively? Like the guy above said, I have also improved significantly, and I can honestly say I am a decent producer. But, still have never finished a track, nor have I ever pictured a track beforehand. I just make stuff on the spot. Even if I have a melody playing, I can't imagine an ideal sound to play with the melody. It's only lucky that I come up with something that works. But yeah, I really appreciate the response.

[Maxxan]

Hey crunked, thanks a lot for the reply, and I did read the article, but I think my problem is pretty bad and is gonna take a lot more than that to fix it. How did you start to be able to produce creatively? Like the guy above said, I have also improved significantly, and I can honestly say I am a decent producer. But, still have never finished a track, nor have I ever pictured a track beforehand. I just make stuff on the spot. Even if I have a melody playing, I can't imagine an ideal sound to play with the melody. It's only lucky that I come up with something that works. But yeah, I really appreciate the response.

Don't worry about that man. A lot of my finished tracks have like 40-60 hours put into them, it takes time. I also used to approach a project with trying to craft the ideal sounds etc, but I think that's wrong. Sometimes it works, but a lot of the time you won't nail that one sound you're looking for. But, trying to you'll come up with another one that sounds different but cool. Use that instead, nevermind if it's not what you imagined. Also sometimes it's cool to just load up nexus and scroll through presets. Don't try to hard. I used to do that. Use loops, use samples, use presets. Just with taste, you know.

And yeah, meditation is awesome. It sounds cheesy but it's insane how LITTLE time you spend thinking about stuff these days. You have so much to entertain you, iPods, TV, video games, computers, booze, drugs, women. You never stop and think, you're always passively being entertained by something. I can feel it hampering my creativity a lot since I graduated and no longer have to think analytically. I think I've grown stupider.

[crunkedxup]

Hey crunked, thanks a lot for the reply, and I did read the article, but I think my problem is pretty bad and is gonna take a lot more than that to fix it. How did you start to be able to produce creatively? Like the guy above said, I have also improved significantly, and I can honestly say I am a decent producer. But, still have never finished a track, nor have I ever pictured a track beforehand. I just make stuff on the spot. Even if I have a melody playing, I can't imagine an ideal sound to play with the melody. It's only lucky that I come up with something that works. But yeah, I really appreciate the response.

I know exactly how you feel, it's just a matter of keeping at it and training your mind to be creative on cue. Most of us without musical/artistic upbringings are discouraged from being creative from an early age by school and society in general, which is terrible because when you're at that age you are in your most unfiltered, pure stage of creative thought where critique and outside influence barely affect you, obviously you won't be painting Nighthawks but you'll take more risks and create simply for the sake of creating to make yourself happy (e.g children draw pictures of things they like, their parents, pets etc., for no gain other than to do it and be happy they did it).

To me, the key to being creative is getting back to this mindset. I believe artists in every field since the beginning of time have spent their whole lives trying to get back to this point.

I started with writing in a notebook. I just used to write a lot about my (and other people's) music, when Rustie - Afterlight dropped i wrote a second-by-second breakdown of what happens in the song in the hope that i could understand why it was so powerful (it didn't work haha). i'd write down names for tracks, i'd write down words to describe the elements of certain songs that i liked, i'd even plan my tracks out and list what I aimed for my final product to be. it's easier to think when you have a goal. have you tried anything like that?

but obviously the most important thing is just to keep making music!

Don't try to hard.

exactly this

[crunkedxup]

**

[Sharmaji]

document your ideas. leave yourself voicemails. get a moleskine and write down every idea that comes to mind. open up garageband and write down your melodic ideas superfast, no mix, no production.

one of the things i see alot in younger producers is that the germ of an idea happens, and then the producer bogs it down with details. the song idea never gets realized, the audio gets over-mixed and over produced, and the listen is left with something that kinda sounds right, but isn't much to listen to.

ideas first, production later. you can always mix, you can always find a better-sounding lead/snare/verb patch, but if you loose focus of your idea-- your song is fucked.

[ljk32]

Thanks a lot to all of you, will definitely try writing down stuff.

[Egan]

In response to what crunkedxup initially said about having inspiration, yes, I do believe in inspiration, but it isn't staring into the sunset and miraculously coming up with an idea. I hear a song I really like, and then know that I want to do something similar to that, but often times I'm not sure if the liking of that song will directly translate into my own song with similar elements. It just happens. But once it happens and I can see those elements in a song that I've done it's easy for me to recognize where that inspiration came from. That's how I would describe my experiences with inspiration.

[alphacat]

Be flexible while still maintaining at least the same level of effort. If you find one aspect of your process stagnating, move on to something else. This is something I picked up from someone here (whoever you are, thanks!) a while back and it's totally been helping. When I'm working on a song structure and get bogged down or lose focus, go work on sound design and loops or musical phrases that might suit the piece or find samples from a movie. Just keep moving. Eventually your focus re-aligns and you get back to the big picture.

[Maxxan]

Be flexible while still maintaining at least the same level of effort. If you find one aspect of your process stagnating, move on to something else. This is something I picked up from someone here (whoever you are, thanks!) a while back and it's totally been helping. When I'm working on a song structure and get bogged down or lose focus, go work on sound design and loops or musical phrases that might suit the piece or find samples from a movie. Just keep moving. Eventually your focus re-aligns and you get back to the big picture.

To some extent this is true for me but if I struggle with composition and dig into sound design, that's a hole I can hardly ever climb out of. Arrangement and composition is the one thing I pretty much have to do in one go. I can come back to it later and eventually get there but it takes longer and doesn't turn out as good.

[StratosFear]

I want to add to the whole inspiration thing.

Absolutely inspiration exists, in my opinion. I can hear a song, or see something in nature, or talk to somebody, and just automatically be inspired to make a song. However, that totally can be hampered by an inability to make the sounds you hear in your head...and then the inspiration goes away. So getting sound design down (or at least some presets so you have a vaguely similar sound to what you want) keeps that inspiration fueled.

Also, I think that trying some new technique when you're making a song keeps it fresh and interesting, not just stagnating in the same techniques over and over. For example, I just started experimenting with timestretching samples and that gave me completely fresh inspiration. And that made me come up with a LOT more tunes. So I think that helps.