Medicinal Drugs: Is Psychedelic Therapy the Future?

[topmo3]

Its easy mate just listen to white noise with earphones and put halved ping pong balls covering your eyes then set up a red lihht directly in front of you trust me it worls

[Genevieve]

There's also massive downsides to this, but they may not have much to do with the drug. A bad therapist can be pretty disastrous to a patient as it is, and that only gets worse when you put a patient in the room with one when they're in such an emotionally vulnerable state. And from personal experience, I can tell that a lot of therapists really don't know what they're dealing with when it comes to patients and their emotions.

[d-T-r]

Its easy mate just listen to white noise with earphones and put halved ping pong balls covering your eyes then set up a red lihht directly in front of you trust me it worls

don't forget the butter!!!!!

** edit only just realized i had heard something about this technique before seems like a lot of hassle to me personally but if it works

[d-T-r]

There's also massive downsides to this, but they may not have much to do with the drug. A bad therapist can be pretty disastrous to a patient as it is, and that only gets worse when you put a patient in the room with one when they're in such an emotionally vulnerable state. And from personal experience, I can tell that a lot of therapists really don't know what they're dealing with when it comes to patients and their emotions.

This is true, but most of the ones who are doing this kind of thing, seem a bit more....humanistic than your average joe therapist .they choose to go down this route of tproviding this kind of treatment as apposed to it being something the health services provide for them to just prescribe etc.

I guess each case and person and set of circumstances will be different anyway.

[Genevieve]

But if psychedelic treatment ever becomes greenlit as a standard practice(big if), then it'll be used by more psychiatrists, including the bad ones.

It could also be overused like other treatments. The way that too many people get perscribed serious anti-psychotics just to give them a good night of sleep, disregarding their potentially serious side effects.

I'm not discrediting psychedelics as decent tools to treat mental health, but any tool is only as good as the person wielding it. And with something as POWERFUL as MDMA or LSD, they better be careful >.>

[test_recordings]

The thing is that because they are so strong though, people won't take it lightly.

I suppose that could bring some of it's own problems (over-thinking the effects, maybe), but they will most likely to be found to do almost 0 damage in comparison to conventional medication.

[Sonika]

I'd say have normal therapists/psychiatrists and then psychedelic therapists/psychiatrists who are different and are licensed to use it but they only use it in circumstances where it's appropriate so it doesn't become overprescribed like, say, ADHD meds

[test_recordings]

Yeah, I don't think anyone's recommending replacing conventional therapy, just making it available. There is a lot of evidence showing that people get better faster when they choose their own treatment and have an active part in managing it so having options is probably more important.

[d-T-r]

There is a lot of evidence showing that people get better faster when they choose their own treatment and have an active part in managing it so having options is probably more important.

Yeah this is key. In the age of information, people should be encouraged to be more active when considering the available health options and choices to take. Many people will go entirely by the word of the doctor/physicican/hospital and wouldn't even consider looking up alternative treatments if they hadn't been mentioned to them.

You only have to look online to find testimonies and reports of people recovering from minor, serious and sometimes terminal illnesses using unconventional methods. I'm just glad that the science is speaking louder than the politics of it all at this stage.

Marijuana is an especially good example. To think we have progressed from the 'Reefer Madness' to medicinal herb and oils shows what nature is capable of reminding us.

[lovelydivot]

I am a thorough believer in the positive psychotropic properties of LSD in all it's forms.

I myself have experience clear, more balanced thinking - and physical benefits such as decreased nervous energy...
...for up to 2 or 3 weeks after a trip.

The only issue I see is in the fact that you are pretty nutty during the trip itself...

I've had numerous friends - experienced trippers - loose their shit and end up in hospital for the 78 days
- or whatever - course of rehab

I had a friend that did over 30K worth of damage to another friends beach house
before running down the street naked and getting psych-penned and relocted afterwards..
That was a bad year right?!

Knew of a girl that went bonkers on her first trip -
- didn't adjust very well back down and ended up in a long term care facility...

One of my friends had to deal with a girl randomly sprinting out into traffic on a panic attack...


It can be unpredictable...

I'm not as supportive of Marijuana - BUT who am I to say what is or isn't helpful to another person.

[lovelydivot]

The recent Penguin edition of "Confessions of an English Opium Eater" -
features an essay about Victorian attitudes towards "drug addiction" - that is completely interesting...

All of the stigmas towards addiction that we have today just simply didn't exist back then...
In fact - it was completely normal for a person to be convalescing from the"Laudanum"...
which is the name of the opium ticture that they would commonly get addicted to...

Back then Medicine was not as advanced - was enormously expensive - no insurance, no nationalized health
and mostly reserved for the wealthy...

So people would manage their own illness and pain - by purchasing unregulated medicines from the "corner store"..
This is before pharmacies even - pharmacies came about later - as the medical field was trying to regulate drug use.

It wasn't that people weren't concerned about addiction - but it wasn't stigmatized like it is today.
And it was just one of those things that people went through as a course of living.

[test_recordings]

You're not taking enough to trip out you know, just loosen the conventional 'my conscious is all-powerful and cannot be wrong' attitude most people have.

[Sonika]

don't you have to trip pretty hard to get into that state of mind though? like ego death shit

[Genevieve]

don't you have to trip pretty hard to get into that state of mind though? like ego death shit

That's not what this is for. It's not about 'enlightening' people, but treating their conditions in a controlled environment. People with psychological conditions are often also very sensitive to drugs like that and in large doses they can do more harm than good. MDMA makes me anxious these days and shrooms scare the crap outta me now (and I did both together recently YAY), while years ago they were both awesome to me and I'm an experienced user. The purpose of this is to break people's thinking cycle and give them a 'different perspective' of things with the guidance of a professional to keep them from going bad.

The thing is that because they are so strong though, people won't take it lightly.

SSRIs? Antipsychotics? Stimulant treatment for people with ADHD? All types of frequently perscribed sleeping medication can be lethal too.

Careless therapists will always be careless. When they're taught that 'small doses of MDMA' can help someone it could turn into their treatment of choice. Even a small dose of it can trigger mania and psychosis in someone who is predisposed to it like with borderline or something in the mood-psychotic spectrum and it can culminate as much as a week later.

The hippy idea that psychedelics are handed down by mother nature to widen our perspective works in a drumcircle and they're not so dangerous to most people if used sensibly, but we're talking about therapy and some VERY sensitive people. It'll def work for some people, I'm not denying that and I'm not saying it shouldn't be introduced. But I just wouldn't be so enthusiastic about it. You gotta look at psychedelic treatments in the realm of modern psychotherapy, NOT in the utopic world we'd LIKE to see.

[cosmic_surgeon]

Have used them to fix myself. Incredible potential I am completely convinced. Me and a mate are gonna try and get tickets to that Breaking Convention.

[Sonika]

I'm on concerta

It helps but I'm grumpy as fuck when I dont have it now

which is kinda worrying

[test_recordings]

Actually, there are two ways of administering these drugs:

1) Full-blown mind blast (previous American therapuetic method)
2) Subtle, gentle, guided conversation (previous European method)

Multiple methods of use makes them even more potentially useful.

@Genevieve about the lethal aspect:

I was talking about the general perception of the currently illegal drugs. The ones you mention are potent but are portrayed as pretty harmless by drug companies and the media generally. If you told a person they were going to be taking LSD as an adjunct to therapy they might take it more seriously rather than just being handed a prescription to take because a doctor says so...

[d-T-r]

Just came across this site. Lots of links to papers and research all compiled in one place.



http://psychonautdocs.com/

[test_recordings]

Cool, didn't know that one! Ta love

[d-T-r]

Growing Calls In US For Legalised Marijuana:



> http://news.sky.com/story/1074650/growi ... 4.facebook

A new poll finds 52% of Americans are now in favour of legalising the drug as producers say it creates jobs.

A study by the Pew Research Centre found 52% of people thought the use of the drug should be made legal, with people aged 18 to 32 most in favour.

Even opponents of moves to legalise the drug nationwide - something compared to the end of prohibition of alcohol in the 1930s - admit it is probably now inevitable.

Colorado and Washington state voted to legalise the drug last November but it remains illegal at the federal level, prompting a debate about how police should treat producers and users.

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Only a matter of time. When it happens, they need to Up the education and research about the herbs so everyone is informed responsibly.