Clipping Drums

[Xrossfade]

Hey guys, recently I have found success with huge sounding drums and sub by clipping. I know clipping is obviously a noob technique, but I am wondering why as it seems to work very well with this current track (right below). For the drums what I did was floor the EQs at their proper freqs, compressed the shit out of that but didn't bus anything, then for the sub I did the usual EQ cut 35-90, and then compressed that and bussed it to my sub return. Basically, the drums are clipping at anywhere from 0 to 7 dbfs, while everything else but the drums is sitting at the standard -3 to -6. Then In ozone I do my standard mastering setup.I am wondering if this is an accepted practice?

Soundcloud

[Today]

dude no1 cares what an accepted practice is. if its working for you then do it

[Reversed]

^this
But to contribute:
Why not, I did similarly in this track:
Soundcloud
But instead of just regularly clipping it, i used a saturator with an algorithm that achieves the same sound as clipping. Works great and doesn't destroy your mixdown (though it seemed to confuse the meters in FL a bit)

[Xrossfade]

^^ ya @Reversed your drums pop pretty nicely that sounds awesome. what saturator did you use?

[titchbit]

I like to clip an 808 kick drum to get that classic distortiony sound. But I wouldn't really think about clipping snares or hi-hats or anything else, and I wouldn't suggest it to anyone else.

Also, I'd like to add that I've been trying to figure out a way to clip my kicks without going over 0 db and ruining the entire mix. Basically I have the volume of the kick's track exceeding 0 db, but then I route it through a bus track, which is at a much lower volume, so the output level of the bus is around where I want it to be, but it still has the clipping sound. It works for me but I'm sure there are easier ways. Should you use a limiter and crank up the gain? Any other suggestions?

[Triphosphate]

I like to clip an 808 kick drum to get that classic distortiony sound. But I wouldn't really think about clipping snares or hi-hats or anything else, and I wouldn't suggest it to anyone else.

Also, I'd like to add that I've been trying to figure out a way to clip my kicks without going over 0 db and ruining the entire mix.

Could be mistaken, but can't you just "clip" them with a fast attack brickwall? I "clipped" the kick and the snare like that on the track currently in my sig. I mean, it's not really clipping if you don't pass 0, but it can be made to sound like it's clipping with a properly configured limiter? right?

[Xrossfade]

I like to clip an 808 kick drum to get that classic distortiony sound. But I wouldn't really think about clipping snares or hi-hats or anything else, and I wouldn't suggest it to anyone else.

Also, I'd like to add that I've been trying to figure out a way to clip my kicks without going over 0 db and ruining the entire mix. Basically I have the volume of the kick's track exceeding 0 db, but then I route it through a bus track, which is at a much lower volume, so the output level of the bus is around where I want it to be, but it still has the clipping sound. It works for me but I'm sure there are easier ways. Should you use a limiter and crank up the gain? Any other suggestions?

Interesting, i have heard people limiting their sub, but I have tried it and I think EQ/compression is the best route for that. But as for limiting drums, I guess the point i'm getting at is that I think if you EQ your snare perfectly within your mix (depending on its transients) you can amplify various parts of the snare substantially if you clip it. For example I clipped the upper end of my snare so that the 175-200 hz range is peaking at 0 db, and mostly everything else is clipping over that, while the rest of the mix sits at the -3 -6 range. seems to make it slap, but the high end attack is still there, so basically I'm limiting the snare through the master, especially when looking at the mixdown waveform.

Awhile back Rob swire was blasting people on twitter that endorse clipping, even professionals (in this case it was ZEDD), saying if you think clipping is ok then you should quit producing music haha.

[titchbit]

Oh yeah I forgot to add I wouldn't clip your sub bass. I mean I won't say "never" ever clip it, but....

Could be mistaken, but can't you just "clip" them with a fast attack brickwall? I "clipped" the kick and the snare like that on the track currently in my sig. I mean, it's not really clipping if you don't pass 0, but it can be made to sound like it's clipping with a properly configured limiter? right?

Yeah this is what I was getting at. I'm in the same boat as you. I'm not 100% positive that brick wall limiting gain reduction and clipping make the same sound, but I think they do.... It makes sense to me based on the function of a limiter, but I can't say for sure.

[gαммα]

clipping is fine, even softclipping your whole mix.

just dont overdo it.

Mr Carmack is amazing at this

Soundcloud

but imo you shouldn't do it with dubstep, it only sounds good in tunes with not many elements

[Reversed]

^^ ya @Reversed your drums pop pretty nicely that sounds awesome. what saturator did you use?

meldaproductions multibandsaturator, it's pretty nice.

Interesting, i have heard people limiting their sub, but I have tried it and I think EQ/compression is the best route for that. But as for limiting drums, I guess the point i'm getting at is that I think if you EQ your snare perfectly within your mix (depending on its transients) you can amplify various parts of the snare substantially if you clip it. For example I clipped the upper end of my snare so that the 175-200 hz range is peaking at 0 db, and mostly everything else is clipping over that, while the rest of the mix sits at the -3 -6 range. seems to make it slap, but the high end attack is still there

that was also my thought process when actually making that track

[mthrfnk]

I don't think the drums in the original track sound that great at all tbh... they're just louder than the rest of the track. The mix itself is quite full of noise and lacks clarity. The snare imo is too noisey vs. tonal punch.

Also you're saying the drums are at +7dB but then you say you're using Ozone on the master, so presumably you're limiting the track to below 0dB? In which case you're not really clipping the drums: limiting decreases the difference between the quietest and loudest parts of a song by making the loud bits quieter and vice versa, so by pumping the clipped signal into your master you're forcing your limiter to bring down the level anyway thus negating the point of you pumping in the hot signal. Ozone's limiter specifically has a few different look ahead functions, so in your case it's going be seeing a +7dB peak incoming and lower/compress the whole mix to make up for that, bring the level back to 0dB. In your case it just sounds like the drums are pushing everything else out of the mix and the final track sounds overly compressed.

You don't need to clip (specifically digitally clip) or brickwall elements to make them loud in the mix. What are you producing on (setup wise) btw? Because if you truly are clipping everything in your mix so much - it should be noticeable to you and imo overly clipped stuff (especially a lot of elements within a track) doesn't sound great, I'm not saying clipping is bad and not to do it... but there are other ways to get your mix louder/punchier and retain full clarity. The fact is all you're really doing is overloading your master buss and forcing Ozone to bring your track back below 0dB to avoid true clipping.

[Icetickle]

I don't know what did you exactly do but your kick and snare sound fuckin' DOPE!

[Xrossfade]

I don't think the drums in the original track sound that great at all tbh... they're just louder than the rest of the track. The mix itself is quite full of noise and lacks clarity. The snare imo is too noisey vs. tonal punch.

Also you're saying the drums are at +7dB but then you say you're using Ozone on the master, so presumably you're limiting the track to below 0dB? In which case you're not really clipping the drums: limiting decreases the difference between the quietest and loudest parts of a song by making the loud bits quieter and vice versa, so by pumping the clipped signal into your master you're forcing your limiter to bring down the level anyway thus negating the point of you pumping in the hot signal. Ozone's limiter specifically has a few different look ahead functions, so in your case it's going be seeing a +7dB peak incoming and lower/compress the whole mix to make up for that, bring the level back to 0dB. In your case it just sounds like the drums are pushing everything else out of the mix and the final track sounds overly compressed.

You don't need to clip (specifically digitally clip) or brickwall elements to make them loud in the mix. What are you producing on (setup wise) btw? Because if you truly are clipping everything in your mix so much - it should be noticeable to you and imo overly clipped stuff (especially a lot of elements within a track) doesn't sound great, I'm not saying clipping is bad and not to do it... but there are other ways to get your mix louder/punchier and retain full clarity. The fact is all you're really doing is overloading your master buss and forcing Ozone to bring your track back below 0dB to avoid true clipping.

That's what I was wondering, if it sounded over compressed in the final mix, because In my head it doesnt sound too bad but I needed an outside opinion on this whole thing. Im producing in ableton. So in the mixdown the bass drum is in the red at around 2db, snare around 7db, while everything else is sitting in the standard -3 to -6 range. Take the mixdown into ozone, add some harmonic excitement / parametric eq / imaging / loudness. In terms of clarity, what would you personally recommend to do?

[Triphosphate]

Why don't you limit the kick and snare on their own premaster inserts to like -.2 db? That way you still get the same effect without making the ozone pump so hard. Just a thought.

[Xrossfade]

Why don't you limit the kick and snare on their own premaster inserts to like -.2 db? That way you still get the same effect without making the ozone pump so hard. Just a thought.

good idea will try!!

[Xrossfade]

clipping is fine, even softclipping your whole mix.

just dont overdo it.

Mr Carmack is amazing at this

Soundcloud

but imo you shouldn't do it with dubstep, it only sounds good in tunes with not many elements

Bare seems to be good at it, and he is dubstep/trap (esp. with this track below), don't know if you have heard. I just don't get how he gets his sub so damn loud, and his snare still slaps, blows my mind.

Soundcloud

[gαммα]

bares tunes are shit (imo) and he is a complete tnuc. (fact)

also the sub in that tune isnt even that loud haha, sounds to me like the tune is clipping in a bad way



^thats a loud sub

just mix your tune well and you can turn the sub as loud as you want

[mthrfnk]

In terms of clarity, what would you personally recommend to do?

Use sidechained/automated EQ's to control frequency clashes.
Mix with nothing clipping to at least -3dB.
Bounce the file.
Master in a seperate session.

[titchbit]

Use filters on just about everything. Of course there are exceptions and this is not true 100% of the time, but you will usually want to high pass everything besides sub bass and maybe kick and mid-range bass. You'll also want to low-pass stuff too. The idea is to chop out as much unnecessary noise as possible. For me, it is blatantly obvious when a mix is under-EQ'd. You will get interference and clashing and just overall too much noise. It will sound like a mess.

[Xrossfade]

bares tunes are shit (imo) and he is a complete tnuc. (fact)

also the sub in that tune isnt even that loud haha, sounds to me like the tune is clipping in a bad way



^thats a loud sub

just mix your tune well and you can turn the sub as loud as you want

pretty sick tune. how come bare is a tnuc, do you have personal experience?