GETTING THE VIBES BACK - [Forum Suggestion]

[Echoi]

I have been on here since roughly 2008 when I was under the name Dark Matter. And this section of the forum used to be a thriving little hotbed of feedback for everyone from experienced producers to newcomers.

Spent a while away from production and internet, now I am trying to dedicate more time to both and I am quite saddened to see that there are now only a handful of people here are willing to put something back and keep it going.

Theoretically this *should* be among, if not the busiest part of the board seeing as the vast majority here actually produce.

Yet it has become what I can only compare to a room full of people talking over each other wanting to be heard rather than listen and wait their turn, so to speak.

Needless to say there are so many threads here with quality music just being completely overlooked, bit of a shame really.

I tend to believe feedback inspires feedback, as that's the kind of thing I have witnessed here and on SC, you comment on someones work, then they see a thread of yours and most likely stop by, listen and comment, that's all this section needs in order for people to get what they came here for, plays and comments.

Lets put some effort in and get this board back to its former glory days.

Preach over

[fiveone]

whilst i may have not been an angel myself in terms of giving others feedback when i should of, i completely agree with your post. i put forward a suggestion to wub to disallow people starting their own topics unless they've given x amount of feedback, and to implement a character minimum. i know some people will be pretty pissed about having this new system, but are those the kind of people you want posting their dubs up here anyways? congrats, you can have my first big up ha

[forbidden]

i put forward a suggestion to wub to disallow people starting their own topics unless they've given x amount of feedback, and to implement a character minimum.

this would require someone moderating what is deemed "feedback" or not, but another idea (albeit a little extreme) is have a minimum post count before the feedback forum even appears for you. i think 25 is a good round number. if you've been lurking here for any amount of time you know that the general forums aren't kind to spam. i think the regulars/mods would see peeps trying to post to boost their count and cut them down to size, if that situation arises..

that said i really hate forums with post count limitations as a new user on any forum, but it's an idea.

..i would be more steady posting feedback here but as OP stated, it seems like it just gets lost in a flood of bs from shitposting nobodies.

[wub]

I've had this been brought up several times in the past, so to reiterate my standpoint on things;

I hear what you're saying in regards to not letting new users makes threads in Dubs, but even if we forced people to give feedback a certain number of times before they could post their own work, it wouldn't necessarily lead to people posting anything worthwhile...if they're not posting feedback now, then they could just go through the motions and put single word responses like "good" or "sick" just to fulfil some criteria before they could post their own stuff again.

I understand that it is frustrating to post a tune and not see any feedback, my only advice would be to lead by example. If you want to give feedback on other's tunes then by all means do so. If enough people did that then people might start taking the hint and adding their own.


If we had a character limit/new users not allowed to make threads etc, this would a) require more moderation and b) people would still find a way to get round it. It's simply not practical to read every single post just to see if people aren't artificially inflating their post/character quota by copy pasting gibberish.


Personally, I think a better method is to lead by example. I try and give feedback on as many tunes as possible whenever I can, and I see Echoi has started doing the same.

However, a lot of the time people who are posting their tunes for feedback aren't even coming back into the thread to acknowledge the feedback that has been left, so this is a two way street as much as anything else.

EDIT - to demonstrate this last point, take a look a few pages back in the forum like page 5 or 6 of posts. The number of threads with one reply and a very low (<6) number of views...this would suggest the tune has been posted, someone has left feedback and the owner hasn't even come back to check the thread.

If people aren't even giving love back to what feedback is being left, what's the incentive for the people leaving it to continue?

[Echoi]

^^ I hadn't even realised people were posting up stuff and not returning, sorry state of affairs if that's whats happening.

Have seen a load of one time, two time poster's in here though, not so sure that introducing a 10, 20 post in Dub's is the answer though, that was brought up here a long time ago.

Just hope we can get this place back to something like what it used to be.

[wub]

But there isn't anything to stop people posting 10/20 posts of rubbish to get their count up.

[Echoi]

I know. IDM Forum has a minimum of 10 post's for the listening booth, I'm sure it does help *some* people to get into the habit of helping other's out. And the listening booth does seem fairly more healthy than our's atm. But at the end of the day, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. People will if they want to, and won't if they don't I guess.

A lot of the previous main contributor's to Dub's don't seem to be here anymore it seem's.

[pete_bubonic]

Yeah I'm behind the minimum post threshold idea, have been for a while, but it has as many cons as it does pros.

[TerraRiddim]

At least someones raised the point publicly. Maybe at least some people will start giving proper feedback again.

I used to always make a point to drop legitimate feedback on a few tunes for every personal tune I've posted, but over the years I'll admit I've all but stopped.

Ups on the post Dark Matter

[Lib3rtine]

I have been on here since roughly 2008 when I was under the name Dark Matter. And this section of the forum used to be a thriving little hotbed of feedback for everyone from experienced producers to newcomers.

Dude, it has nothing to do with this forum...it's ALL forums, and it's a recent trend over the last couple years. I run socom5.com and same thing happened there. People slowly exit and just stick with the big dogs... Twitter / Facebook, etc. All the recent gov spying crap gets people that way too...all paranoid and not wanting to post anywhere. Thx NSA for killing off community engagement....everywhere.

Plus, even Google's latest search engine algorithms favor the bigger companies.

rich = richer. poor = poorer.

Not much we could do, but sit back and watch.

Easier to monitor everybody when their all on just 1 or 2 sites... :-/

[Echoi]

I'm fully aware that it's a trend on all forum's, but I think a few reminder's of forum etiquette pushed about in the right place's/manner can only be a good thing. If it work's, great, if not, then at least we gave it a go.

[Be-1ne]

I think youll find the main motivation to post has changed, and thats something you / we cant change. before people were trying to push a sound and had to go to a bit more effort to upload tunes for people to check out. Now its very easy to upload and just spam.

its generally, not to generalise mind, kids! kids who have never been to a club or event, who dont have anything to do but sit online spamming the crap out of their stuff. This has lead to a total over saturation of good and bad music to the people people cant be arsed to listen.

rant over. was it a rant?

[Nickelwound]

At the ultimate guitar forum they use a C4C system. Like it says, you post, critique, and whoever posts with a link to their song you'll have to post and critique, and this is a pretty good system to me.

[Too Severe]

[mod edit]
I fail to believe you posted that whingy begging soliloquy exactly highlighting the very attitude that all of us are fucked off with.

I predict you're not going to last on this forum.

[/mod edit]

This is replying to the "MOD EDIT". i am sorry, i dont know how to reply to you in a different way.

Wtf is this all about? talking about my attitude? I actually joined this forum because i am learning things here. i enjoy reading things here. even though i have only recently found out about this forum.
first fucking day i post something, it gets moddified and the mod ed says my attitude towards the forum is wrong/bad?
This isnt a very good introduction of this forum to me. this is the first forum i have actually payed attention to and it treats me this way.

[mod edit]

You submitted a long post describing how you're new and thanking everyone to take the time to listen and give feedback to your music. Obviously including a link. In a thread discussing what the best way to STOP people doing that very thing. Regardless of the forum guide, regardless the formatting of this forum, the stickies in this sub forum AND the obvious content of this specific thread. You still post links to your music.

[/mod edit]

[JAZZZA]

Thanks you, Echoi, for these thoughts. Im totally agree with you that new musicians should support each other. It's a question of communication - today we have great opportunities via internet. But most people waste their time and don't see that the easiest way to become better as MUSICIAN is to communicate with newcoming artists. We learn together. We are the same popularity-level. Most great artists were supported by somebody. And it's not promotion - it's just good relationships which they could convert to popularity. We are the flow. We are the new generation so let's help each other to become better.

[pete_bubonic]

**nice things**

Agree completely. most of the time it's not even direct feedback I'm looking for, but to engage in conversation about different approaches, sound design and styles when I post up my own music. Looking for new ideas for the next one, have a pair of ears listen to it that haven't heard it a million times (like mine have).

I'm certainly not angling for releases or internet fame or whatever, though I appreciate the efforts of those who are all the same. Just as the OP says, bringing vibes.

@Too Severe - It was me who edited your post (and again just now). If you weren't just putting up a link to your music (which you were, but anyway), then my humble apologies.

[Too Severe]

I must apologize if I came over that way. I really do come in peace, and I really do not wish to be annoying on this forum. Like I said before, I came here to learn something, which I already have achieved on a small scale within these two, three days I have read this forum again I am sorry. I won't post links to my music if it fucks you guys off, I am only looking for feedback

<3

[bennyfroobs]

theres a feedback thread for feed back in the production forum (-:

[koncide]

I think a lot of this is down to over-saturation. This sub-forum gets something like 20-25 new topics a day. A lot of this is in essence very poor quality work, and I have heard some absolute howlers since the time I've been lurking and posting here. Not just tunes that are good but are lacking polish, but tunes where the drums disappear when the sub drops, or where the master bus compressor is driven to -20db gain reduction all over the mix. Not saying my work is perfect or anything, but I think a lot of people get tired of going into new topics and listening to the same old shit time-after-time.

In this way I think quality control is a big issue, not just a minimum post count. Fair enough very new producers want feedback, but I think a lot of people get a bit too excited with themselves prematurely, which is why the vast majority of topics on this forum get next to no replies and views.

I'd actually like to see two separate sub-forums for dubs and feedback, one for very new or inexperienced producers, and one for people who have made more of a name for themselves and who's quality is consistent. I'm not sure what the criteria would be based on, but tweaked in the right way it would create a separate community which would draw traffic not just from fellow producers, but from DJs looking for exclusives to play out. and also general fans/listeners who know next to nothing about production except knowing what sounds poor, and who just want to hear some music from people they're not heard of before. This would also give the newbies something to work towards and perhaps encourage more quality control on their part.

Large ups the people putting in the effort and trying to give this place a come back though, it would be nice to see more community vibes in here

[Echoi]

Thanks you, Echoi, for these thoughts. Im totally agree with you that new musicians should support each other. It's a question of communication - today we have great opportunities via internet. But most people waste their time and don't see that the easiest way to become better as MUSICIAN is to communicate with newcoming artists. We learn together. We are the same popularity-level. Most great artists were supported by somebody. And it's not promotion - it's just good relationships which they could convert to popularity. We are the flow. We are the new generation so let's help each other to become better.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell really.

And what Pete said too. When I used to use AIM a lot talking to people from here, those are the exact thing's I/we took from sharing our music with each other. That's what it's all about.

Christ, I was *producing* (said in the loosest way possible) for about 2-3 years before I even dared post anything online, and even then it was garbage.

It just makes sense to get involved, really listening to other's work who are at roughly the same stage as yourself, or just behind or further ahead, and figuring out what can be improved with their music can only serve to benefit yourselves and other's. I know for me, once I got involved with Dubs thing's improved for me no end.