How to make my kicks have more punch?

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:42 pm

Hi Guys,

I am still a newbie and juts recently got into producing so forgive me for my lack of terminology. I have been trying to recreate some old school dubstep, however my kicks just lack that dubstep punch to them.I have been using ableton's kick 808 (the one that comes with it) . Can anyone help me out or provide me with some kick's that have that kinda feel? So far, my kicks just sound boring.

I wanna try and make a kick similar to this;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_mtLjUm ... uffle=7820

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOttZSnz ... uffle=7820

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DXkIKi4 ... uffle=7820

SunkLo · Post by **SunkLo** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:59 pm

You gotta train hard kid. While other kicks are in bed sleeping, your kicks gotta be in the gym hitting the heavy bag. While other kicks are indulging in an unhealthy lifestyle, your kicks have to stay focused. While other kicks are giving up, your kicks have to run it again and again until it's flawless. While other kicks are slipping throwing sloppy haymakers, your kicks gotta be putting holes in bags with jabs. But on game day when other kicks are making excuses, your kicks will have their glove in the air saying "We made it mama."

I ain't ever said it's gonna be easy. But don't ever let anyone take it from you. Quitters do that and that ain't you.

Also layering. You can increase a kick's punch without having to fuck with compression by duplicating it, dropping the sustain and release, tightening up the decay time, and increasing the attack time from 0 until the oomph is hitting in the right place. Then just layer it under the dry kick so it beefs up the amount of punch after the transient.

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:02 pm

Thanks coach for the prep speech! Man, i am even more determined!!

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:53 pm

sorry dude, is layering basically doubling the kick? I am not too sure what layering is..:/

SunkLo · Post by **SunkLo** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:58 pm

Yep. If you're using Ableton, just duplicate the sample in your drum rack so you have two copies. Then just adjust the ADSR of the second one like I said and set it's volume so it just adds a little extra pow.

ineffable · Post by **ineffable** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:28 pm

SunkLo wrote:Yep. If you're using Ableton, just duplicate the sample in your drum rack so you have two copies. Then just adjust the ADSR of the second one like I said and set it's volume so it just adds a little extra pow.

Guess you fully switched from Reaper?

SunkLo · Post by **SunkLo** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:41 pm

Yeah at least for the midi side of things. Can't beat it for editing and mixing audio.

It's also more likely that he's using Ableton vs Reaper so that's why I mentioned it. Haven't used FL in a while so I forget how it's done there.

forbidden · Post by **forbidden** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:01 pm

SunkLo wrote:Yeah at least for the midi side of things. Can't beat it for editing and mixing audio.

It's also more likely that he's using Ableton vs Reaper so that's why I mentioned it. Haven't used FL in a while so I forget how it's done there.

glad someone as learned as yourself is on ableton now, looking forward to your posts on it.

another thing to keep in mind when layering samples is make sure they are both in tune.

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:21 pm

How long do you guys mostly spend on your kick drum/drum patterns when making a song?

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:23 pm

I think i maybe spending toooo much time on mine...

webstarr · Post by **webstarr** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:25 pm

Decent 808 layered with a decent 909, eq to taste.

Aufnahmewindwuschel · Post by **Aufnahmewindwuschel** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:27 pm

just get a wav or sth from the drum you want and steal it done

bennyfroobs · Post by **bennyfroobs** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:31 pm

depends on the type of song you're doing. if you're doing a tune when you wanna have a nice percussive rhytmh going then spend loads of time on the percussion. there isnt really a right or wrong time to spend on things when ur just starting off, cos its all practice, everything u make will pretty much be wack anyway. so just go for it! move them kick drums around until ur happy with them

fragments · Post by **fragments** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:35 pm

Layering is all good...but is no one going to mention arrangement and mix to get punch out of the kick? Frequency masking can ay hell w a good sounding kick...and sometimes just a avoiding masking w creative arrangement can help loads. Also side chain EQ is you wanna get fancy.

bassbum · Post by **bassbum** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:24 pm

EQing is also important. A kick is just a sound quickly pitching from high to low. So if you boost in the higher bass region you will get more punch at the beginning of the kick and if you boost in the lower bass region you will get more punch at the end of the kick. Its already been said but envelope and limiting really help.

Dustwyrm · Post by **Dustwyrm** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:41 pm

boosts mids of the kick, high pass it at 71hz, use a sine under it to retain the bass.

Low pass the sine at 70 or whatever u deem necessary so it sits directly under the kick.

ultimately get a nice kick sample without lots of movement in the high end.

PS: notch eq synths getting in its way

SunkLo · Post by **SunkLo** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:10 pm

Why would you lowpass a sine if it's just gonna be a static note?

Dustwyrm · Post by **Dustwyrm** » Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:14 pm

True, i guess i meant if he chooses a bass type synth to layer beneath then low pass it.

if he's choosing a straight up sine sub bass, then by all means dont low pass it. but if you have a synth thats got mid activity then just low pass it til it meshes well with the kick, doesnt necessarily need to be at 70hz, just using that as reference.

thats what i meant lol

Ataxia · Post by **Ataxia** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 1:42 am

Everything SunkLo said is solid advice. Mess with layering kicks, combine a nice low 808 kick with a punchy kick from a sample pack. Experiment with different combinations.
Mess with the amplitude envelopes (I really can't stress how helpful that advice was when I first learned it) it can literally transform your kicks from shit to the shit.
If you're gonna layer you might wanna add slight glue compression (very slight, you don't want to kill the transients [unless you mean to]).
Then you can bounce your finished kick, put it back into your drum rack, EQ it, maybe scoop some of the mid-lo range if you want it to sound more "wood"-y.

There is no time limit on experimenting. Just keep it going. Eventually you'll come up with something you like.

One more thing actually. Emulating another producer is fine. Trying to learn how to make sounds from your favourite songs is great. It's how you learn.
But try to avoid comparing your sounds to your favourite tunes while you're just starting out. I did that too much when I started and I found it really discouraged me.
"A-B"ing songs is another story, though.

cloud90 · Post by **cloud90** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:16 am

Thanks guys for the advice! Much appreciated, really!

I have one more question. How do i make my own dubstep drum patterns? Like how do i work out where the drrums should be and all that? Up until now, i have kinda been just been emulating other artists drum patterns but now i want to make my own

Thanks

How to make my kicks have more punch?

How to make my kicks have more punch?

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