Thinking out loud...

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nowaysj
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by nowaysj » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:08 pm

Re Gbites, I really don't know in this day an age! But dude, I FIRMLY recommend NVIDIA. Nvidia is Intel, AMD is AMD.
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wub
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:18 pm

nowaysj wrote:Re Gbites, I really don't know in this day an age! But dude, I FIRMLY recommend NVIDIA. Nvidia is Intel, AMD is AMD.

Ok, well an NVIDIA 1Gb GE Force GT 640 (sounds like a fucking race car) only adds another 80€ to the build for a total of 1254€, so not worth quibbling over. So that's;

i7 3.5Ghz
ASUS Z87M Plus
16Gb Kingston RAM
120Gb Kingston SSD
2 x 1Tb Caviar Black SATAs
Corsair 750w RM Ultra Quiet PSU
NVIDIA 1Gb GE Force GT 640 GSU

@ 1254€ inc. VAT, 3yr warranty and delivery to Spain


Next question is do I need further CPU cooling? Standard is 'Intel Standard CPU cooler', the only option they have which isn't water cooling is something called a SuperQuiet 22DBA;

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Is that basically a mini air con unit, is that what that is?

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nowaysj
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by nowaysj » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:22 pm

I don't think so. Ac's work on compression and decompression of gases. These are just thermally conductive metals smashed really hard against your cpu with a blowing over the blades. Mine was OKAY quiet, and about four times the size of that one. Literally just barely fits in the case. Good cpu cooling is essential. Well, I don't know with chips these days, maybe their thermal efficiency is better, but for my generation pre i's, it is essential. Especially if you live in Spain. You're probably going to be seeing 50c summers in the future. :lol:
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Simulant
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by Simulant » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:28 pm

wub wrote:
nowaysj wrote:Next question is do I need further CPU cooling? Standard is 'Intel Standard CPU cooler', the only option they have which isn't water cooling is something called a SuperQuiet 22DBA;
You only need better cooling if you're planning on overclocking your CPU. If not, the stock cooler should be fine.
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:29 pm

Simulant wrote:
wub wrote:
nowaysj wrote:Next question is do I need further CPU cooling? Standard is 'Intel Standard CPU cooler', the only option they have which isn't water cooling is something called a SuperQuiet 22DBA;
You only need better cooling if you're planning on overclocking your CPU. If not, the stock cooler should be fine.
Not planning to do that, thanks :Q:


However, would the fact I'm in a hot country be an issue? That Superquiet one I've listed above is only 24€...


(have edited the thread, we'll have no unpleasantness in here :) )

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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by Simulant » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:03 pm

wub wrote:
Simulant wrote:
wub wrote:
nowaysj wrote:Next question is do I need further CPU cooling? Standard is 'Intel Standard CPU cooler', the only option they have which isn't water cooling is something called a SuperQuiet 22DBA;
You only need better cooling if you're planning on overclocking your CPU. If not, the stock cooler should be fine.
Not planning to do that, thanks :Q:


However, would the fact I'm in a hot country be an issue? That Superquiet one I've listed above is only 24€...
Yeah it should be fine at stock speeds. They're designed to run in normal living temperatures, if they weren't then Intel would have loads fail under warranty in hot countries.

If it worries you and you want to keep tabs on your temperatures, you can download a handy app called hardware monitor. It's free and allows you to check the temperatures of all sorts of things: http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor.html
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by nowaysj » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:08 pm

Having a very large, effective cooler allows you to run your fans at the lowest speeds, producing the lowest noise. You can get close to passive cooling which is the quietest.
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by SunkLo » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:35 pm

Not to mention they're relatively cheap. It's a pain in the ass to reseat a heatsink down the road so you might want to just get a nice one now and not have to worry about it.
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by Toolman4 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:42 pm

OK I can definitely weigh in here b/c I'm a gamer...I read that anything beyond 2gb isn't going to be utilized unless you're using dual monitors or video editing...Most of what's going to be available for new buyers is 4g but if you're looking to cut cost somewhere and don't need to play video games, 2gb is plenty for what noways is talking about. And you can find one for under 200 USD that'll def get the job done...And trust me wub, when making a PC investment, consideration of 'long term' is going to pay off in the end, especially now since more people have home computer access than ever...Make the plunge and you'll be glad you did. Upgrading a near top of the line computer over the course of 4-5 years is much more cost effective than purchasing 2 new computers over that course of time...and generally you stay ahead of the curve until you're ready to enter a new generation..

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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by Toolman4 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:45 pm

I would add that nvidia is much better in my experience. And noways is right again. If you're overall objective (besides performance) is audible noise reduction, cooling is paramount.

At some point creating a diagram of pros and cons of what you might gain vs sacrificing for overall objective really helps with technology. 'Generally' you get what you pay for in most cases so building one to your end objective helps deciding which components to buy.

Also, placing the tower in an open area, where air flow can move efficiently through the case makes the biggest difference for where I live. I live in the desert (Las Vegas, NV) , and dust/heat is a major factor. Keeping it clean and ventilated, even when OC'd for gaming, I never have heat spikes.

And I've also found that heat sinks where applicable (CPU,GPU) work much better than fans alone, and of course fans on top of heat sinks work the best, but again consider how many fans you're going to have and how much noise they might make.

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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by Simulant » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:06 pm

There's little point in just upgrading the CPU fan if you want it to be quiet. Case fans make a lot of noise too, and you can't always slow them down(I think they need to have the 4-pin header if I remember correctly). So if you're looking for quiet, it's an idea to upgrade the case fans to larger slower ones too.

As others have said, it'll make your system more reliable and potentially last a bit longer. Although this is offset by the modern design of Intel CPUs, as they use the available thermal headroom to run in turbo mode. You may find that with a better cooler it will actually increase your performance, as it'll be able to stay in turbo mode for longer.
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:16 am

Ok, so taking all of the above into account we're up to;

i7 3.5Ghz
ASUS Z87M Plus
16Gb Kingston RAM
120Gb Kingston SSD
2 x 1Tb Caviar Black SATAs
Corsair 750w RM Ultra Quiet PSU
NVIDIA 2Gb GE Force GTX 660 GSU
SuperQuiet 22DBA CPU Cooler

Apparently I need a non-standard case for the cooler to fit, then just select monitor etc.

Windows 8 discussion - http://www.dubstepforum.com/forum/viewt ... 7&t=284289
32 bit vs 64 bit - RAM usage - http://www.dubstepforum.com/forum/viewt ... 8&t=284258

Note; need to be Professional edition.

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nowaysj
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by nowaysj » Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:19 am

Yeah, I clear my case by about 1/4 inch. That is defo tightest fit.

But where are the hydraulics?

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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:06 pm


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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:22 pm

ASC - AMA on Reddit - http://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduction/c ... tions_ama/
I'm using the Machinedrum to do the majority of my beats these days. As I said earlier, I'm hardware based these days.

I'll always start by trying to create a vibe with atmospherics and FX first. Beats are always secondary. I know a lot of people prefer to lay down their drums first and then see where that takes them, but I've learnt over the years that I get my best results working this way.

I can see me writing more techno and ambient alongside the 170 stuff I do. I'm very much into techno and even more so recently.

I'm fortunate enough to do this for a living. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's a real struggle to pay rent and bills, but ultimately it's my love of creation that keeps me strong and sane.
Is this track going anywhere? How can I fix it if it isn't? I started out by doing A/B comparisons with other producers I rated. Seeing where their switches happened, where they introduced elements, where they would put a breakdown. After I got a feel for it, then I started to experiment with my own template I'd created. I do think this is a tough thing still though and something I don't like to get too comfortable with. I feel when you start getting rigid in your structures, that's when complacency sets in. You can probably think of certain producers who's tracks will all do what you expect them to do at a given time in the track. Tough one.
I'm not ashamed to admit that I've suffered with many forms of depression during my entire adult life. At times, it can be crippling. Very crippling. Without music, I don't know where I'd be, as it really is my therapy. The old cliche rings true about it being a form of expression and in many ways, it allows me to function. I'm fortunate to have a very supportive family and friends that often help me through the really low points and it makes me appreciate life when everything feels great.
More often than not in the past, a failed idea would often form the springboard for another idea, whether this was due to my own limitations as a producer or not having the right instruments at my disposal. I'd love to be able to sing on some of my music, but I'm just not confident enough about hearing myself recorded and then letting everyone else hear it. That's a big stumbling block in that aspect. I may overcome it one day, I may not. We'll see!
I started with NoiseTracker, a four channel lo-fi effort on the Atari ST way back in 1995-1996. I then got serious with Cubase on the Atari ST. I then gravitated towards the PC and got into FastTracker 2, for which I wrote the majority of my early releases on, believe it or not! I then had brief dalliances with Logic 5, Cubase SX and Ableton, before settling on Renoise. I've followed it through ever since.

I haven't bothered with the Renoise 3 beta yet, as I just don't have the time to sink in yet. I'm very much looking forward to the finished product, whenever that will be.
I've uploaded a gallery of pics so you can all see my studio and workspace.

http://imgur.com/a/NKwGN#0
I'm pretty much all hardware based these days, not to say I don't do some processing on the computer, but I tend to do as much as I can outside the box, so to speak. Reverb wise, other than the stock Renoise DSP, I use the Eventide Space a LOT. Other reverbs I use are the Fostex 3180 Spring and the BOSS reissue of the Roland RE-201 Space Echo.
Beats are a very organic thing for me. I'm always beatboxing without realising it, coming up with rhythms and ideas for sound. It drives my wife crazy. So I guess as soon as I lay a marker down, I'm already thinking in terms of how it's going to evolve and I just run with that. It's difficult to explain further than that really!

I run the Machinedrum live in the track and usually 'commit' to it, by rendering to audio as soon as I'm happy with it. From there on, I'll chop and retrigger if needed.

I'd say hardware based setups are all about being at one with the machines. Haha that sounds a bit cheesy, but it really comes from loving that hands on approach and twiddling knobs and sliders and pressing buttons to get your results. It's more long winded than just using software for sure, but I find it ultimately more rewarding. Having said that, I'm not one of these people that would say one way of working is right or better than the other, having done both. So whatever works for you!
I usually get up early afternoon and work until 4-5am in the studio. I get most of my work done when the world around me has gone to sleep. That way, it's just me and the music - no distractions unless you create them yourself.

Typically, I'd say I spend about 5-7 days on a track. Sometimes it's longer, but if I nail the vibe and get in that zone, then that's usually when I get the bulk of the track done.
Always been a fan of the sample retrigger - 0SXX.

When I was more software based, I had messed with Ableton a bit and was considering switching at one time, but now with the hardware being used mainly, it's not so important anymore.
I'm not too sure how some of the hardware sequencers are without not having used them myself. I particularly like Elektron gear, as they sound great and have a unique workflow to any other synths. Choosing your first piece of kit is kinda daunting, in that you will more than likely keep spending and adding if you continue down that road. I would go for something that's a good all rounder to start with, but that also depends on the type of music you want to make!
I usually see a track through to the end, then give it a listen over a few weeks, send it out to my friends, label owners I work with and see what the reaction is. I have a LOT of tracks that will never come out, simply because I went off them, or had better tracks to choose from, but they are all equally as important. There are tracks I've done that haven't lead to anything, but were important because during the writing phase of that track, I had the idea for a better track and that formed instead.
I was just trying to write the music I liked and trying to gain acceptance from my peers at the time. That's all that mattered when I was starting out. Up until the Autonomic boom, things were always a struggle in trying to get my ideas heard. I'd wrote a full LP of stuff that was 'Autonomic before it was Autonomic' if you know what I mean. Nobody wanted to know and distributors wouldn't give me the chance, so I was grateful to Instra:mental for giving me the platform and to them and dBridge for playing my music to the masses. That propelled me forward a lot more than I could have imagined.
I'm using Renoise as my DAW. It's a lesser known sequencer, but it's something I've stuck with over the years, as I know it well now. I love the workflow the most. Even using hardware, I can get ideas down really quick and that's important for me.
Here's some that are pretty much always in rotation:

808 State - 90 FSOL - Lifeforms The Prodigy - Experience Voices From The Lake - Voices From The Lake Donato Dozzy - K Convextion - Convextion Global Communication - 76:14 Autechre - Incunabula Biosphere - Substrata Helios - Eingya Locust - Weathered Well Telefon Tel Aviv - Map Of What Is Effortless Ulrich Schnauss - A Strangely Isolated Place T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth Of An Intuitive Mind Sandwell District - Feed Forward Fluxion - Vibrant Forms II Deepchord presents Echospace - The Coldest Season

Probably a bunch more, but that's a good chunk of LP's that I love
I was using a Tascam TM-D1000 digital/analog hybrid, with a MOTU 2408 MkII linked via TDIF (lol, I know outdated) to provide the 8 digital channels from 9-16 on the Tascam. I decided to start mixing more in the computer and switched to an Ashly LX-308B line mixer to run all my gear through. One of the most amazing sounding and quiet mixers I've ever heard. I love it.
I was a late adopter to the internet and never got involved in the demoscene. There were a bunch of us at high school that got into trackers when we were about 13/14. Everyone had Amiga's and used ProTracker, except me who had an Atari STE and used NoiseTracker. ProTracker definitely sounded better, to me anyway, but it was all pretty much the same back then.

The film I'm working on right now is a sci-fi piece about a love triangle involving two friends who build a time machine in their garage. Similar premise to Primer, kinda. There's another one I'm yet to start work on, as the director has been having trouble with funding, which is about a young couple who visit a town in the desert of New Mexico and then things take a turn for the worse. It's very Lynch/Hitchcock inspired, which suits me. I'm hoping I'll gain more work off the back of both of those and can keep 'climbing the ladder' so to speak.

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SunkLo
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by SunkLo » Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:22 pm

wub wrote:Funktion One impulse responses - https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/960 ... ne-IRs.zip
Why?
Blaze it -4.20dB
nowaysj wrote:Raising a girl in this jizz filled world is not the easiest thing.
Phigure wrote:I haven't heard such a beautiful thing since that time Jesus sang Untrue
If I ever get banned I'll come back as SpunkLo, just you mark my words.

wub
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:38 pm

SunkLo wrote:
wub wrote:Funktion One impulse responses - https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/960 ... ne-IRs.zip
Why?
Full article here - http://www.balancemastering.com/blog/fr ... nvolution/


wub
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Wed Apr 09, 2014 3:06 pm


wub
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Re: Thinking out loud...

Post by wub » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:57 am

Not often I curse where I live, but godamnit if I'm not in the wrong city from time to time;
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