Layering Samples for DnB

[aspen1135]

Hey whatsup guys

I recently invested in a new pair of headphones (audio tech ATH-M50's) and I've started experimenting with layering some samples. I wanted to make a real punchy DnB track eventually but I don't have much experience with the genre. I've EQ'd a deeper kick drum by boosting around the low 100hz range as well as suppressing the mids and highs a bit to make room for an acoustic kick that I've layered on top. I then layered an acoustic kick that's been EQ'd with a high shelf around 120hz to give space for the other kick, and I've slightly boosted the gain to make it stand out a bit more this layer adds this high end punch to it. It sounds alright but I believe it could be better. Am I missing any steps in the layering process or is it a matter of trying different samples and trial and error?

Also what order do you use your limiters and compressors? Do you compress then use a limiter? or limit then compress? I would think that you put the limiter on after the compressor or else it would fuck up with the compressors input settings anytime you change anything on the limiter, but I'm not entirely sure.

Like I said before, I'm shooting to make some DnB loops, and the hi hats are giving me some trouble as well. More-so than the kicks and snares actually. I cant find any hats that rest well within the mix for DnB. I've used a sampler for the h-hats and made this kind of rise/fall pattern by using midi for variation. I've also randomized the velocities to give it more of a human and less quantized feel.

Tips? Suggestions? lets hear em'

[mthrfnk]

Why are you using a compressor and limiter?

[cyclopian]

Also make sure the transients of both kick samples are lining up perfectly. If they dont line up they phase out and sound flabby.

[aspen1135]

Why are you using a compressor and limiter?

why wouldn't I use a compressor and limiter? the compressor makes the samples blend a little more naturally after u do the fine tuning and the limiter makes it more punchy and stand out more. I have the layered tracks grouped in ableton and I throw the compressor and limiter on the group as a whole. But I don't have too much experience with layering so IDK. Should I not be using these?

[mthrfnk]

Well you were asking how/what order etc to use them in - if you know why you're using them then you should know how they should be set up in the mix... i.e. you know what you want to achieve by using them, and you're not just using them unneccesarily.

Just a tip, make sure you retain your transients if you're limiting the drums - the transients give you your punch.

[R3b_Official]

Also make sure the transients of both kick samples are lining up perfectly. If they dont line up they phase out and sound flabby.

This, you can use this to get cleaner kicks or if you slightly phase the kicks you can get different sounding ones. I'll do a tutorial in the next week or so how to edit wave forms in ableton so you can 1) get variety out of your samples and 2) get cleaner kicks. Its pretty simple, its basically using warp markers to stretch out certain parts of the waves to aline with other samples.

Also mess with transient shaping, making sure your kicks are in tune with one and another, pitching will help, parallel processing like adding reverb,distortion, panning to your drums will fill them out more. Slight saturation with clipping works also.
90% of getting good kicks is sample choice, get like a couple packs of 909's and 808s for the subby part of the kick then use the normal vengeance kick as your click sound to it and if you want you can sample some live drums or look for acoustic samples to layer underneath.

[aspen1135]

Awesome. Thanks everyone for providing some feedback! I'm going to mess with the transients and see what I can come up with. I've tried using post-processing things like saturation a little bit but haven't really committed to this as I think it can easily distort it too much (or at least for the samples I'm using).

If I remember correctly, there's a setting somewhere in ableton's preferences to turn off an automated fade-in at the front and end of clips. IDK how to explain it, I just remember stumbling into the option when watching a youtube video once.

Any trick to get the hi-hats sounding good?

Here's what I've got so far (I threw in a piano to make it more interesting):Soundcloud

[mthrfnk]

Awesome. Thanks everyone for providing some feedback! I'm going to mess with the transients and see what I can come up with. I've tried using post-processing things like saturation a little bit but haven't really committed to this as I think it can easily distort it too much (or at least for the samples I'm using).

If I remember correctly, there's a setting somewhere in ableton's preferences to turn off an automated fade-in at the front and end of clips. IDK how to explain it, I just remember stumbling into the option when watching a youtube video once.

Any trick to get the hi-hats sounding good?

Here's what I've got so far (I threw in a piano to make it more interesting):Soundcloud

All the hats sound very mono, try spreading them in the stereo field. Adding some airy reverb can also add to the splashy wide sound you hear in a lot of "more chill" dnb. Also compressing the upper end of the high band a lot can help you reign in the tone to stop them sounding so harsh.

[aspen1135]

Sweet thanks man I'll try that next. I just started using Izotope's Ozone suite and their multiband compressor's the shit! I'll play around with stereo imaging and reverb and try to get those hats nice and smooth.

[Think_Dubstep]

in my experience a shorter thud kick with just enough lowend but not too much is what most drum and bass works with. You dont need very thick lowend, or your kick will mudden up your initial subbass.