Sub Bass Trouble

[lojik]

I would never compress a pure sine sub, if you need to even out the dynamics then change the envelope of the patch or the velocity of the bass part, you don't really need to compress synth bass unless you want to 'glue' it to something else.

[Samuel_L_Damnson]

Compressing a dub isn't to even the dynamics tho. Surely it would be to add harmonic content and make the sine "more square"

[lojik]

Compressing means to reduce the dynamic range between the loudest part and the quietest part of an audio signal.

If you used a compressor with a really high ratio like 20:1 or above, then yes you will probably end up clipping the waveform into some sort or squarish shape (actually just square off the top of the sine rather than making it an actual square wave), but my point is that you have so many options with a synth that there are better ways of adding harmonic content than using a compressor which could compromise the sound.

If I wanted to add square wave harmonics to a sub, I'd just blend in a square wave oscillator, meaning I'd get the harmonics I want but also keep the pure sine tone which will sound better than if it was compressed.

EDIT - actually a good idea might be to take the sub, heavily compress it, then blend it back in with the original pure sub, but again I'd probably prefer to just add the content myself because you might get phasing issues this way.

[Samuel_L_Damnson]

Compressing means to reduce the dynamic range between the loudest part and the quietest part of an audio signal.

If you used a compressor with a really high ratio like 20:1 or above, then yes you will probably end up clipping the waveform into some sort or squarish shape (actually just square off the top of the sine rather than making it an actual square wave), but my point is that you have so many options with a synth that there are better ways of adding harmonic content than using a compressor which could compromise the sound.

If I wanted to add square wave harmonics to a sub, I'd just blend in a square wave oscillator, meaning I'd get the harmonics I want but also keep the pure sine tone which will sound better than if it was compressed.

EDIT - actually a good idea might be to take the sub, heavily compress it, then blend it back in with the original pure sub, but again I'd probably prefer to just add the content myself because you might get phasing issues this way.

I do the thing in bold cos it sounds nice

[hellagargoyle]

yo man if the sub is muddy'n your mix just turn it down a biddle, and then it if that doesnt work maybe eq, and if ur still stuck atleast you know changin the volume of that shit bass or eq'n sum nastys freqs out isnt going to get ur dopeassfire mix finished and you can then decide whats next. me personally ide click that lil right arrow next to the preset bank...

[AxeD]

yo man if the sub is muddy'n your mix just turn it down a biddle, and then it if that doesnt work maybe eq, and if ur still stuck atleast you know changin the volume of that shit bass or eq'n sum nastys freqs out isnt going to get ur dopeassfire mix finished and you can then decide whats next. me personally ide click that lil right arrow next to the preset bank...

That's probably how all the reaLtrvp producers do it tbh.

[bennyfroobs]

i really dont see the point in going to loads of effort to get a "pure" sinewave if ur just gonna distort it in the end anyway
and the extra noise generated by massive (and stuff that generates 'inferior' sinewaves compared to say audacity), is literally so negligible that there's no point even bringing it into question. you wont hear it and it wont mess with your frequencies

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


if ur sub is playing a few different notes n u find that ur getting random peaks where the high pitched notes are louder, then u should compress ur sub. probs no point if ur just playing one note though
idk what compressor ur using but start off with a ratio of like 5;1 (ish) , u want a really long release if ur using sustained sub notes i usually just whack it up to like 2500ms , threshhold like -13/-15 or whatever

[cyclopian]

i really dont see the point in going to loads of effort to get a "pure" sinewave if ur just gonna distort it in the end anyway
and the extra noise generated by massive (and stuff that generates 'inferior' sinewaves compared to say audacity), is literally so negligible that there's no point even bringing it into question. you wont hear it and it wont mess with your frequencies

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


if ur sub is playing a few different notes n u find that ur getting random peaks where the high pitched notes are louder, then u should compress ur sub. probs no point if ur just playing one note though
idk what compressor ur using but start off with a ratio of like 5;1 (ish) , u want a really long release if ur using sustained sub notes i usually just whack it up to like 2500ms , threshhold like -13/-15 or whatever

This reminds me, I saw a Claude Von Stroke production Q&A a while back, and while im not the biggest fan of his music he knows what he's doing to an extent.

His technique was that he had each note of his bassline in a different track/channel so he could EQ each one separately. Basically splitting up his 'piano roll' note by note for total control over the peaks etc.

I've not yet tried it myself since it doesnt lend well to the tunes i make, but i could see it being quite powerful with a more melodic bassline.

[bennyfroobs]

yeah ive done that before

like this tune im currently workign on, im using a really specific tiny frequency range of a reese bass to layer over the top of another couple of bass layers, and when it changes note/ptich it needs re-eq'd

even without a properly melodic bassline its still useful

[SonicMurder]

Best sub bass advice I've read is to low cut everything, use a pure sine, have it sit a few DB under the bass. A great trick for getting your sub bass and kick to play well is to use a Low Pass Filter (Steep cut off, -24 or 48db) on your master and listen to what is happening down there. Import some tracks from producers you admire and run their tracks through the same filter to get an idea of how they do it. The sub should (normally) dominate the spectrum with the kick's low thump being clearly audible. Lightly touch your speaker cone, and you should feel the kick punching through the sub.

This filter analyzing trick works wonders throughout the whole spectrum. I like to take a low pass and high pass with -48db cutoffs in alloy and move it around the spectrum isolating ranges. This is invaluable in figuring out what the pros are doing with what frequencies. For example, though the fundamental for the kick and snare reside in the 50-250 hz range (usually for dubstep), if you low pass at 250, you barely hear them. The real volume for the kick and snare is in the 1000-6000k range, with most of the (Audible) meat in the 500-1000 range. Try it out and see for yourself.

That got off track a bit. But, try the low pass on the master. The mids and highs really bury what's happening down there. You should hear none of your synths below 100 hz, and only traces of them between 100-200. Your sub should be running rampant with the below 90hz zone, with the kick coming through. Try rolling off the lows on the kick below 50hz (or whatever your low fundamental is). I almost always side chain compress the sub bass to duck about 3-4 db. I need to get my high mids/highs right, but this approach served my well and my (newer) tracks behave very well in low end, not the same quality as the pros, but with the low pass filter on the master, it sounds very very close.