How do you start each track off?

JamesHanvey · Post by **JamesHanvey** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:45 pm

I suppose it's just a matter of preference. Assuming you start with drums i assume, where abouts in the song do you start? Or do you just try and drop in an idea ASAP? Personally, I'm all over the place. Mostly i just mess around with massive until something sounds good...

wub · Post by **wub** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 5:55 am

Got my main template already set up with several different buses, routing etc etc. I'll usually start with messing around with something. Whatever that something is changes every time I start. Sometimes a vocal sample, a crazy ass effect I've been working on, some synth patterning with modulation, instrument loop from a dusty old 50s record I've sampled, whatever.

I'll play around with that for a bit, loop different bits, chop it up, add effects, bounce & reimport, create some basic patterns etc, find out what works and what doesn't. Once I've got a nice little pattern looping for about 16 bars or so that won't drive me crazy on listening to it hour after hour, I'll start to construct the tune around it. Place the drums where the sample dictates they should be placed, or apply the bassline so that it evolves organically around the sound.

Generally once I've got that done, will work on tidying up the drum programming a bit more, making a few variations of the patterns, spread them out over the course of the tune. Same with the bassline, add some variations, plenty of automation to give it some movement. The tune programming should be evolving organically at this point, as it becomes apparent when listening where the necessary elements should change or drop in/out of proceedings.

I'll usually add a few bells & whistles at this point, incidental sounds, echoey bits, heavily reverbed hi passed sirens, vocal snippets (nb; I mean spoken word samples in this case, not actual vocals), maybe some white noise sweeps etc etc, extra layer of ambience, stretched our snare sample over 64bars to give some background grit, working it into the arrangement to keep things interesting.

Once I've got a rough arrangement of how the overall tune is going to be, I'll bounce out a rough copy, burn onto CD then go whack it on the main system in my lounge. Get myself a cup of tea, sit down on the sofa with a notebook and listen to the track on repeat. I'll make notes as to what I like/don't like, what needs working on etc, then I'll go back to my studio machine and make the necessary changes.

Then it'll just be a case of doing a basic mastering job (not too fussed about mixdowns, these generally get done as I'm working through the tune), and jobs a good 'un.

Basically, starting with the drums is IMO boring as hell. If I start a tune with drums, the tune will be dictated by those drums and anything I add to it after the fact will be added to and around the drums. FUCK. THAT. I'd much rather get some fun stuff going on, samples/pads/synth loops/melodic bits etc, get them looping the way I like then construct the drums around them.

I never listen to a track for the drums. If I'm trying to tell someone what a tune is like, I won't bang my desk to give an idea of the drum programming. Course not, I'll hum the melody, sing a poor version of the vocal, whatever. The fun bits of the tune, basically. And it's for this reason that I'll start with those bits, as those are the bits I want my tunes to be identified for.

That way I'm changing the emphasis of the track from the drums to the more interesting bit. Like thinking of a tune as a sandwich. The drums are the bread and hey, you can't have a sandwich without bread (this isn't an excuse to correct me on sandwich preparation techniques nor is it an excuse to give examples of great sandwiches that don't involve bread so don't bother), but at the end of the day I'm not eating a sandwich for the bread, I'm eating it for the filling.

xtcvsmistycold · Post by **xtcvsmistycold** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:12 am

I wonder how many of these threads there've been

i start by writing an idea for a track down in a notebook

zosomagik · Post by **zosomagik** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:43 am

sco wrote:I wonder how many of these threads there've been

I know

I usually always start with a few synths. I usually lay down chords first, then maybe layer different voicings of the chords on top with another sound. Then the melody, and again, maybe layer it with some harmonies. Second is usually some percussion, but not the kick and snare, just something to get a defined groove going. Third is usually some weird shit, maybe vocal chops, most of the time just some sort of off kilter sample. Then the kick and snare, and then arrangement. After arrangement I usually have had a couple more ideas and just keep adding shit on.

jaydot · Post by **jaydot** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:44 pm

Usually some pads and a kick

karmacazee · Post by **karmacazee** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:20 pm

I teleport 5 months into the future and listen to the beatport charts, and then steal those tunes.

Or sometimes I go back in time and visit a garage club in the early 00's, and nick a few bootleg vinyls that never got repressed from the DJ, and just rip them straight onto soundcloud.

Or sometimes I put a kick on the 1 and go from there... Always start with the main hook though.

wub · Post by **wub** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:23 pm

Look to ten years in the past. Exactly why "riddim" Dubstep is starting to gain traction. Its a revisit of what once was a decade ago.

xtcvsmistycold · Post by **xtcvsmistycold** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:54 pm

riddim dubstep fuck

wub · Post by **wub** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:56 pm

Yeah, not the biggest fan of the term but what can you do.

fragments · Post by **fragments** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 9:44 pm

I always start in Maschine stand alone. I tend to load up some kind of simple bass patch and start playing around looking for something to hold down the melody and rhythm. Usually after I get something going that sounds good on its own, I'll lay down a really quick skeleton of a beat, really sparse, but something more inspiring than a metronome! Then work out a melody for the lead instrument, then usually try to work in some chords but maybe not, don't always like to use 'em. If I feel like the tune is too sparse I'll start designing some incidental or pad elements to fill things out. Usually working on a 16 bar loop...at some point I'll start working on sound design...earlier on if I'm working on a tune with synthesizers, later on and more in the mixing phase if I'm using Kontakt for "traditional instruments" or whatever you want to call them.

At some point I bonce all the audio and load things up in FL Studio for a full arrangement. If I need to I'll load the Maschine project into FL Studio to work out new instrument parts etc.

audiowaves · Post by **audiowaves** » Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:05 am

wub wrote: .....
Basically, starting with the drums is IMO boring as hell. If I start a tune with drums, the tune will be dictated by those drums and anything I add to it after the fact will be added to and around the drums. FUCK. THAT. I'd much rather get some fun stuff going on, samples/pads/synth loops/melodic bits etc, get them looping the way I like then construct the drums around them.
....

do you feel the same even if it's just a basic beat, like a kick on 1,3 snare 2,4 (or half time) ?

wub · Post by **wub** » Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:25 am

manudiao wrote:
wub wrote: .....
Basically, starting with the drums is IMO boring as hell. If I start a tune with drums, the tune will be dictated by those drums and anything I add to it after the fact will be added to and around the drums. FUCK. THAT. I'd much rather get some fun stuff going on, samples/pads/synth loops/melodic bits etc, get them looping the way I like then construct the drums around them.
....

do you feel the same even if it's just a basic beat, like a kick on 1,3 snare 2,4 (or half time) ?

Yes.

If I get the musical elements right of a track first, then the drums will fall into position easily anyway.

TheIntrospectionist · Post by **TheIntrospectionist** » Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:25 pm

I also usually start out with my own custom-made template which I've set up, parts of which are based on some of the knowledge and tips I've got from here and elsewhere over the years - so, for example, i have have certain levels for each mixer channel which only need minor adjustments once I've started (saves a lot of time fucking around and tinkering with things that could have been done in advance, especially when it comes to labeling channels and adjusting the aesthetic things like coloring the mixer and playlist channels).

Beyond that, I just have a blank ni battery loaded and generally start with the drums then loading a synth, picking a scale, and fucking around with my midi controller until something sounds good. A lot of the time I start by building a beat in battery with standard drum sounds and then adding another to build on the beat with glitchy sounds and other sound samples (I actually really enjoy playing around with weird percussive samples) and then maybe a third for some standard hand percussion to bring in at some point. I then just start to build on it with other synths, pads etc.

More often than not, I open up a new project intending to work at a particular tempo and aim towards a particular sound but wind up fiddling around with things until I'm doing something at a completely different tempo of a completely different sound. I find that I get better results when i'm flexible in that sense and don't confine myself to prior expectations when I am able to go somewhere completely unexpected by experimenting (I used to get fed up way too easily and, even if what I had at the time didn't sound bad at all, close it thinking "isn't what I was going for" and ultimately accumulating a mega-fuckload of abandoned project files). I always leave things like vocal samples, speech samples, sound effect samples, cymbal and other fx transitions etc. until last along with much of the processing of sounds already in my project (filters and such).

This, by the way, is just what I do and is in no way intended as advice for how to go about starting a project - for all I know I could be violating every bit of common wisdom about how to go about building a track.

nowaysj · Post by **nowaysj** » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:09 am

Hey intro, you're producing a lot of quality work, have you ever considered joining the TUNA!, a group of producers down in the production contests subforum who each produce a track a week. I collate and post up really late Saturday or Early Sunday Pacific. So very quality people down there. With the quick pace, the work is a bit sketchy, but people use the feedback and reiterate over time, bringing songs along. Many people have found it very rewarding. I've definitely found it so.

Check it out, dude.

Samuel_L_Damnson · Post by **Samuel_L_Damnson** » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:30 am

I feel awful cos I just can't commit to the tuna. I work over 12 hours a day these days for no pay(placement). All i ca. Do when I get in is to go to sleep.

nowaysj · Post by **nowaysj** » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:32 am

Welcome to the rest of your life.

Samuel_L_Damnson · Post by **Samuel_L_Damnson** » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:53 am

I probs won't work from 10am til 12 pm like I often do here. One night I was in til 1 am and apparently it gets later sometimes. If I was doing 9-5 again i would have pleantly of time. I haven't managed to even open a daw since moving here

.

Samuel_L_Damnson · Post by **Samuel_L_Damnson** » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:54 am

/moaning

TheIntrospectionist · Post by **TheIntrospectionist** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:46 pm

nowaysj wrote:Hey intro, you're producing a lot of quality work, have you ever considered joining the TUNA!, a group of producers down in the production contests subforum who each produce a track a week. I collate and post up really late Saturday or Early Sunday Pacific. So very quality people down there. With the quick pace, the work is a bit sketchy, but people use the feedback and reiterate over time, bringing songs along. Many people have found it very rewarding. I've definitely found it so.

Check it out, dude.

Cheers! Thanks for the recommendation. Will definitely check that out. I've only just started up again after a long hiatus but the inspiration from listening to a lot of the stuff coming from Auxiliary has definitely helped develop my sound more as well as helping to cultivate that side of me that just wants to experiment more as opposed to constantly worrying about adhering to the constraints of a particular genre and building conventional drum patterns for a given style etc. Still, sounds like I would benefit a lot from that as I often find my self a bit short on feedback and abandoning projects that, while I feel have potential, I'm lost with in terms of direction.

CreamLord · Post by **CreamLord** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 4:35 pm

Personally I love percussion so I usually start with that, just create a basic pattern that I like then start working around that and changing/editing the drums as I go along.

Saying all that I almost always end up completely deviating from what I started with as I will end up hearing a sample or create a bassline and it doesn't fit in with what I wanted but it sounds better

How do you start each track off?

How do you start each track off?

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