The 60s sound

future producer · Post by **future producer** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:54 pm

I like to listen to some Beetles and Jimmi Hendrix and the kick drums seem a little muddy at the bottom and the whole mix sounds kinda hollow, I've also been looking for some info on the type of reverb and compression used in the 60s.

Any ideas?

drwurst · Post by **drwurst** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:03 pm

recording to tape?

[mr_Â§nowman] · Post by **[mr_Â§nowman]** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:07 pm

analog
ribbon mics
spring reverbs

Sharmaji · Post by **Sharmaji** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:07 pm

tape, very little compression if any, really excellently made gear, plate reverbs or reverb chambers.

oh yeah, and fucking stellar musicians in excellent studios.

djake · Post by **djake** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:51 pm

ohhh 60's music how i love you so much

jimi hendrix is the man! his guitar was an extension of his arm!

had to get that outta my system!

dem ones · Post by **dem ones** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 7:27 pm

try psp vintage warmer

tempest · Post by **tempest** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:32 pm

think they used to just room mic the drums, if you listen to led zepplin theres really not much bottom end at all in bonhams kick drum.....

don't think i'm much help here... But i must say i think the way they recorded drums was crap, but its a nice lo-fi crunchy result and indeed some amazing, boundry pushing musicians round that era...

dj acto · Post by **dj acto** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:06 pm

record the output of a valve amplifier if u can get one

auan · Post by **auan** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:09 pm

Yeah drums were not the rock engineer's priority in those days. To be fair, with guitarists like Hendrix around, who can blame them. If you listen to something like the Doors, the drum recordings are piss-poor. I think that changed round about the time of Bonham with late-period Zepplin (check the Levee Breaks intro, that's not what I'd call thin kicks) and Keith Moon from The Who and others, when rock drummers tyhemselves started to come into their own.

Having said that, the 60s is when a shitload of the classic breaks were recorded...

tempest · Post by **tempest** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:46 pm

oh yer indeed the when the levee breaks break is great, should have said their earlier stuff

tempest · Post by **tempest** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:47 pm

and yer what the fark... i forgot about all the brilliant funk drummers, they seemed to have the drum recording much tighter than rock of that time

auan · Post by **auan** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:16 pm

It's all about what the engineer prioritised, when he had:
* limited tape usage - you can only play a recording back so many times before it starts to degrade. Also 'important' tracks have to get put in the centre tracks as you get the best magnetic field there. And the edge tracks are prone to damage. Not like digital where everything is crystal clear and almost invulnerable.
* limited effects - you might only have 4 good compressors, and 4 average ones in the studio. Not like digital where owning a plugin means you can have almost limitless use of multiple instances of it all over the mix.
* limited money - being recorded in black America in the 60s, the old funk records didn't exactly have cash ladeled on. Not like digital where you can download a perfectly useable compressor for nowt.

So the funk engineer prioritises the drums and bass, which is the driving force of a funk record. Check the Amen tune. The bass and the drums are obviously tight as fuck, but the horn section ain't up to much, and the guitar has the wibbliest, most annoying tone possible. Full credit to the engineer, the mix is awesome. Some of the elements on their own, are not.

And the rock engineer hears Hendrix warming up and realises he's going to be pushing the guitar forward instead. A real shame because Jimi always had a tight backing band with him.

Then by the time Zepplin come to record their fourth album, the record company is literally throwing money at the project, and everything from the wailing vocals to 2-bar drum intro to the esoteric string section gets the shit recorded out of it.

Now we get (from a recent SoS) 200+ tracks mixed down and compressed to death in ProTools for none other than My Chemical Romance.

djake · Post by **djake** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:02 am

Auan wrote:
Now we get (from a recent SoS) 200+ tracks mixed down and compressed to death in ProTools for none other than My Chemical Romance.

FSTZ · Post by **FSTZ** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:06 am

tempest wrote:think they used to just room mic the drums, if you listen to led zepplin theres really not much bottom end at all in bonhams kick drum.....

I was about to mention the room micing technique

the bigger the room the better

auan · Post by **auan** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:48 am

unklefesta wrote:
tempest wrote:think they used to just room mic the drums, if you listen to led zepplin theres really not much bottom end at all in bonhams kick drum.....

I was about to mention the room micing technique

the bigger the room the better

Martin Hannett when he was producing Joy Division's Closer famously took the drum kit out of the recording room and set it up in the studio's toilet to capture the tight, claustrophobic echoes. And it worked, too.

dougd · Post by **dougd** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:44 am

I love that 60's sound... since I work in Logic I use the spring reverb in Guitar Amp Pro to get some of that.

future producer · Post by **future producer** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:22 pm

Forgot bout this. Nice and cheers for the advice, I am gonna have aplay with some demo plugs and see what I can come up with.

overcast radio · Post by **overcast radio** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:46 pm

UAD-1 cards have the best plug-ins around! The plate 140, LA2A, Neve stuff is all sick. If you don't have the cash for that (start saving), but there's a bundle out there called Modern Plug-ins, made by Antress...go here.

http://www.modernplugins.in-tw.com/

These things have to be clones, or rip-offs, b/c they're free and they sound good! PC only though, I think. 60's drums sounds? Yeah I agree, room micing (close micing on drums is just out-dated, not really needed.) Use drums that are from the era too! Gotta use Ludwigs or the like...no way yr gonna make a Yamaha, or like them sound old. Impossible. Great stereo mic right in front of the kick or so...compress a little and hit the whole kit with some plate...and I think Sharmaj said great players, pres, and rooms too! No silver bullet here. But using vintage kits is a must.

overcast radio · Post by **overcast radio** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:46 pm

UAD-1 cards have the best plug-ins around! The plate 140, LA2A, Neve stuff is all sick. If you don't have the cash for that (start saving), but there's a bundle out there called Modern Plug-ins, made by Antress...go here.

http://www.modernplugins.in-tw.com/

These things have to be clones, or rip-offs, b/c they're free and they sound good! PC only though, I think. 60's drums sounds? Yeah I agree, room micing (close micing on drums is just out-dated, not really needed.) Use drums that are from the era too! Gotta use Ludwigs or the like...no way yr gonna make a Yamaha, or like them sound old. Impossible. Great stereo mic right in front of the kick or so...compress a little and hit the whole kit with some plate...and I think Sharmaj said great players, pres, and rooms too! No silver bullet here. But using vintage kits is a must.

overcast radio · Post by **overcast radio** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:49 pm

Sorry for double-posting.

The 60s sound

The 60s sound

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