career in production

cracktactics · Post by **cracktactics** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:31 pm

Im still at skl and i hate it to be honest. I just wanted to know who here lives completely off music - production/DJing or whatever. All i want to do is music and i need to find a way to do it full time so i dont get stuck in a shit job when im older. So does anyone do it or is it reeally hard?

thesynthesist · Post by **thesynthesist** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:55 pm

you know what, its all about your drive.

I went to a very reputable school in the US, and after graduation, i was working at an apple store. But i found a way to make it music related, in teaching apple's software. It sucked, but i moved up to work at a major music software company very quick from apple.

But if you think that making tracks is gonna pay bills, theres a harsh reality rolling toward you... Its possible, but it takes a lot, and even then, its really best to have some sort of safety net in the music biz to fall back on, if sales drop or times are hard.

Think about this. Major dubstep artists (major in the dubstep world, that is) are selling tracks for $250 flat, regularly. Thats not much, and you'd have to churn out bangers pretty fast to make a rent, much less a living off that type of cash.

Even if you strike a great deal with a bigger company, you will have to recoup all the costs of making your record before you even get paid.

If you want a career in the music business, being multi-talented and open-minded will make things a lot easier... Take it from a smug, closed-minded jerk...

John Locke · Post by **John Locke** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:19 am

its more than really hard. tho i doubt many apparently succesful names would admit just HOW hard it is.

unless yr a manufactured cheesemonger with the word 'timber' somewhere in yr name, the days of making a living out of selling records r over.

or for now at least...unless things shift in new, unforeseen ways.

only possibility is to do other stuff on the side. DJing at least. or working in a studio. or to produce stuff for films/commercials etc, which probably aint what u had in mind, but offers better pay and longer term career prospects (u can keep scoring into your 70s and 80s) than just being a big name DJ in a small scene which will be completely dead within 10 years. i reckon a lot of DnB DJs must struggle for bookings by now. or at least in the uk.

but dont let any of that put u off. it IS all about drive. but also talent. not neccesarily musical talent (tho it helps) but networking talent, marketing talent. and if u got some clever ideas how to sell yr tracks - or at least sell merchandise and other stuff off the back of yr tracks - using the net and new technology or whatever...then yeah, maybe it can work.

but by being a producer perhaps u werent really thinking 2have to become a businessman. cant blame u

Onespark · Post by **Onespark** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 8:14 pm

not that I am the expert, but it is all about diversity and drive like these guys say. I think you have a better shot making rent and food money off DJing gigs, promoting, charging for studio time, etc... I got a real estate license so I can make music. When you put out great music on a consistant basis thats when you start getting known, booked for bigger shows and start having more opportunities to make money through music. Even big famous bands make most of the cream off of touring and licensing, versus record sales. Get involved with promoting a Dub step show in your area, get a radio show, make good music, get known, then you might have a shot. Good luck!

thesynthesist · Post by **thesynthesist** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 8:43 pm

Battle Gong wrote:but by being a producer perhaps u werent really thinking 2have to become a businessman. cant blame u

They go hand in hand.

I have a quote from Stephen King on my monitor, it says...

"Talent is cheaper than table salt. Its hard work that seperates the successful individuals from the talented ones."

Ive had that cut out from a calendar of quotes for over 10 years now, its absolutely accurate. It speaks to the old adage...

"Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity."

John Locke · Post by **John Locke** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:22 pm

thesynthesist wrote:
Battle Gong wrote:but by being a producer perhaps u werent really thinking 2have to become a businessman. cant blame u
They go hand in hand.

I have a quote from Stephen King on my monitor, it says...

"Talent is cheaper than table salt. Its hard work that seperates the successful individuals from the talented ones."

Ive had that cut out from a calendar of quotes for over 10 years now, its absolutely accurate. It speaks to the old adage...

"Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity."

couldnt agree more. but hard work and a talent for marketing r not the same thing. u can work as hard as u like, but if u aint got the knack for selling yrself its still unlikely 2get u far

all depends on what is meant by success too. robbie williams is unarguably "succesful", but i wouldnt want 2 do that with my life

two oh one · Post by **two oh one** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:27 pm

Battle Gong wrote:
thesynthesist wrote:
Battle Gong wrote:but by being a producer perhaps u werent really thinking 2have to become a businessman. cant blame u
They go hand in hand.

I have a quote from Stephen King on my monitor, it says...

"Talent is cheaper than table salt. Its hard work that seperates the successful individuals from the talented ones."

Ive had that cut out from a calendar of quotes for over 10 years now, its absolutely accurate. It speaks to the old adage...

"Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity."

couldnt agree more. but hard work and a talent for marketing r not the same thing. u can work as hard as u like, but if u aint got the knack for selling yrself its still unlikely 2get u far

all depends on what is meant by success too. robbie williams is unarguably "succesful", but i wouldnt want 2 do that with my life

Yep. You have to sell yourself. This is where a lot of talented artists fall down and a lot (A LOT) of hacks become household names. Pride can get in the way. So can integrity.

Get your music into the right hands. Get to know lots and lots and lots of people. Especially those outside the scenes. I'm in a really privileged position because of my locale and who I hang with.
In my other 'serious' musical life, I always have CDs of my work in the boot of my car to give to people. I know a lot of movie producers, directors, actors, photographers and working artists. They all are open to music, or know of people who want it. I've had calls and opportunities simply because I've given a CD to somebody who played it for somebody else. Get shit out there and take every opportunity that comes at you. It's up to you how you want to sell yourself and just how willing you are to compromise your integrity.

And don't forget -Being an invisible electronic producer and keeping yourself in separate boxes with your different (seemingly unconnected) names allows for you to sell out fully on one hand, but still be underground as fuck on the other, integrity intact.

John Locke · Post by **John Locke** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:50 pm

two oh one wrote:
And don't forget -Being an invisible electronic producer and keeping yourself in separate boxes with your different (seemingly unconnected) names allows for you to sell out fully on one hand, but still be underground as fuck on the other, integrity intact.

carefull how much u say on here then if u want2 keep it that way then eh ; )

already worked out what u do for a living long ago. and interesting it must b too.

two oh one · Post by **two oh one** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:59 pm

Battle Gong wrote:
two oh one wrote:
And don't forget -Being an invisible electronic producer and keeping yourself in separate boxes with your different (seemingly unconnected) names allows for you to sell out fully on one hand, but still be underground as fuck on the other, integrity intact.

carefull how much u say on here then if u want2 keep it that way then eh ; )

already worked out what u do for a living long ago. and interesting it must b too.

How is my previous career with Take that going to spoil my Dubstepping?

djake · Post by **djake** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:32 pm

anyone no how u get into make music for film tv ect. ect. ????

John Locke · Post by **John Locke** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:42 pm

two oh one wrote: How is my previous career with Take that going to spoil my Dubstepping?

who cares about dubstep...after being in the greatest group since new kids on the block u should b more concerned with not dirtying yr white armani slacks and making sure yr hair is cut in the 'modern style'

deflax · Post by **deflax** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:26 am

Battle Gong wrote:... and making sure yr hair is cut in the 'modern style'

You mean like... these guys for example? http://www.eparsa.fr/webredactions/imag ... -hotel.jpg

If there is some much commercialism in music... I think it's better to make music just for the fun of it and have a different... much more stable job. I mean.. if you are constantly on stress whether your records will return you enough money then maybe at some point you will not be able to experience the same enjoyable feelings from the process of creation.

thesynthesist · Post by **thesynthesist** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:27 am

djake wrote:anyone no how u get into make music for film tv ect. ect. ????

Step 1- move to LA

Step 2- work as an assistant in a Post-Production studio or for a Film Composer

Step 3- take the work he doesnt have time to do, since getting all those Lord of the Rings movies to score...

Of course, again, having a good school which provides quality placement is key. But when it comes down to it, if no one at your school or in hollywood, for that matter, knows who you are, then you are swimming upstream.

John Locke · Post by **John Locke** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:06 pm

yeah, tokio hotel are terrifying. what gender is that singer? its a guy, yeah? I'm guessing this group havent made it big in either the US or UK, right?

oh, if u r just starting out ,an alternative to moving to LA would be to make as many friends as possible who r at film school and offer to make the soundtrack to their short films. Assuming they r any good, they'll get shown at festivals all over the world and u'll get experience and exposure...and hopefully in 10 yrs these directors will be making features and will give u the gig. maybe.

basically u need a showreel of the work u already done for film to get work in film, so yr biggest problem right now is just getting that first gig. maybe go stick ads up in film schools, or there must be forums on the net. i even seen sum1 on here looking for ppl to score tracks for his short a few months back.

if u r already an accomplished musician with stuff released then maybe u dont want to go giving yr services out for free to student film makers, in which case u might try approaching musicians agents, or film production companies, advertising agencies etc. directly. i'm sure producers are always looking 4 something new, and if they got a creative, low-budget project they might give u a break on it.

tudniillik · Post by **tudniillik** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:12 pm

once i finish my sound system , Ill fire up a webpage with techy breakdowns claiming technical superiority of each component in my chain . So everyone can learn there and hire me as well

I also want to sell custom HW, I oppose everything boutiqe, underline that I'm on budget too!!

cryptic · Post by **cryptic** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:33 pm

Djin is where ya money is at!!!!!

but to be a big dj you gotta be a sick producer!

standard!

djake · Post by **djake** » Thu Jan 10, 2008 12:27 am

Battle Gong wrote:yeah, tokio hotel are terrifying. what gender is that singer? its a guy, yeah? I'm guessing this group havent made it big in either the US or UK, right?

oh, if u r just starting out ,an alternative to moving to LA would be to make as many friends as possible who r at film school and offer to make the soundtrack to their short films. Assuming they r any good, they'll get shown at festivals all over the world and u'll get experience and exposure...and hopefully in 10 yrs these directors will be making features and will give u the gig. maybe.

basically u need a showreel of the work u already done for film to get work in film, so yr biggest problem right now is just getting that first gig. maybe go stick ads up in film schools, or there must be forums on the net. i even seen sum1 on here looking for ppl to score tracks for his short a few months back.

if u r already an accomplished musician with stuff released then maybe u dont want to go giving yr services out for free to student film makers, in which case u might try approaching musicians agents, or film production companies, advertising agencies etc. directly. i'm sure producers are always looking 4 something new, and if they got a creative, low-budget project they might give u a break on it.

cheers

jackquinox · Post by **jackquinox** » Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:01 am

djake wrote:anyone no how u get into make music for film tv ect. ect. ????

I dont know if your at college or University or live near one but the best advice that i know a few people did when i was at university was to advertise your skills to media students and amateur film makers to build up your portfolio just put up a few flyers on the notice boards or chat to them in the editing suites, its good for networking as these are supposedly the "film makers of the future" its good for socialising with others and its fun to. Once you have a portfolio built up, start from the small independant shorts and work your way up, if your good people will want you but the portfolio helps alot thats for sure.

thesynthesist · Post by **thesynthesist** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:05 pm

These guys are right on, working on smaller films is the way to start. Gets you in with the future movers and shakers, allows you more freedom of production, and you'll work on far more interesting work than some disney crap or something.

Indie films are usually better anyway, and there are many ways to get into that world, its like anything else though, full emmersion helps be seen and to really be what you want to do.

two oh one · Post by **two oh one** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:30 pm

Make sure they're actual, financed films, though. With a distro deal.
Not just a bunch of stnuc with a camera and a copy of Premier. So many non-starters and hot air, especially here in LA. I've wasted time on too much shite and wished I hadn't.

career in production

career in production

hmm

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