Do some retailers hang on to ltd 12"s to sell later on

[olly]

nobody is stopping you.

Nah I believe its common courtesy that is.
quote]

[chamclowder]

nobody is stopping you.

Nah I believe its common courtesy that is.
And as for the whole DMZ point you just made...

When it comes down to it, who is a bigger piece of shit... the guy who buys 10 records and pays for shipping to the stateside(you wouldn't know eh) or the asshole who downloads and pays nothing? I bet if you ask the labels, the distro and the producer, it's the guy downloading tunes. My way gives money to those who deserve it... the other way doesn't.

Common courtesy is quite uncommon, yes?

Frankly I can't be bothered to care all that much. Get a job or get faster at buying tunes. Everyone with an internet connection has an equal opportunity to buy tunes as everyone else... some are faster.

My friend, in the wild, you'd be eaten with you attitude and I'd have 10 dead Zebra that I'm not even going to eat... I'll sell you one... cmon, you know you're hungry!

[the wiggle baron]

nobody is stopping you.

Nah I believe its common courtesy that is.
And as for the whole DMZ point you just made...

When it comes down to it, who is a bigger piece of shit... the guy who buys 10 records and pays for shipping to the stateside(you wouldn't know eh) or the asshole who downloads and pays nothing? I bet if you ask the labels, the distro and the producer, it's the guy downloading tunes. My way gives money to those who deserve it... the other way doesn't.

Common courtesy is quite uncommon, yes?

lol jesus christ, I was hoping for a half decent reply from you that I could just leave but theres all sorts of bollocks there. First off, I got no idea where the whole downloading thing came from. I agree, but its unrelated...completely

My argument is this. To buy multiple copies of records with the sole purpose of selling them on later in order to profit from them shows a complete lack of respect for others. That double you pick up literally means someone else who wanted to buy it can't, and just so you profit from it later? I would love to know how that is morally justifiable? Do not try and bring in how the distro's/artists would prefer you to buy them, because we are talking here about releases that will go on to be valuable, which are releases which well sell out completely.

And if you think common courtesy is uncommon I do not envy the world you live in.

[oddfellow]

From the distros point of view. I dont think they care who gets what and in whatever number, as long as it sells.

[nitrous_mcbread]

My argument is this. To buy multiple copies of records with the sole purpose of selling them on later in order to profit from them shows a complete lack of respect for others. That double you pick up literally means someone else who wanted to buy it can't, and just so you profit from it later? I would love to know how that is morally justifiable?

When one of Van Gogh's paintings is sold to another Japanese businessman for silly money, do you whinge about 'the real art fans' missing out?

[frebentos]

When one of Van Gogh's paintings is sold to another Japanese businessman for silly money, do you whinge about 'the real art fans' missing out?

van gough's paintings dont have doubles, their one of a kind.

[chamclowder]

To buy multiple copies of records with the sole purpose of selling them on later in order to profit from them shows a complete lack of respect for others.

I can live with that.

That double you pick up literally means someone else who wanted to buy it can't, and just so you profit from it later? I would love to know how that is morally justifiable?

Is it morally reprehensible that some rich motherfucker buys up all the brilliant art in the world, when there are millions of dirt poor art lovers out there that can't afford it? Tough shit then. There's only one of each painting, thus making it valuable. How do you know that I wouldn't give it to a friend maybe, or give it away as swag at a show or something... You don't know and you're judging based upon the possibility.

Also, nobody knows what tunes will be valued and which ones won't. It's not like when he bought 3 copies of DMZ 003, he knew it would be as valued as it is today. Most you'd maybe think is it would double... oh no... now it's 10 pounds instead of 6.99. BLAH BLAH.

Do not try and bring in how the distro's/artists would prefer you to buy them, because we are talking here about releases that will go on to be valuable, which are releases which well sell out completely.

And if you think common courtesy is uncommon I do not envy the world you live in.

Same world you live in buddy, I just don't have my head up my ass and the town I live in isn't called the "Land of Make Believe" mmkay? Again... how we spend our money is none of your business... had I not told you about our buying habits, you'd have been none the wiser.

If it wasn't me, it'd be someone else. Don't forget it. If it's you making 150 pounds for a record or me, it's me. All day all night.

[chamclowder]

When one of Van Gogh's paintings is sold to another Japanese businessman for silly money, do you whinge about 'the real art fans' missing out?

van gough's paintings dont have doubles, their one of a kind.

So is an unplayed copy of Twisup VIP blood.

[frebentos]

When one of Van Gogh's paintings is sold to another Japanese businessman for silly money, do you whinge about 'the real art fans' missing out?

van gough's paintings dont have doubles, their one of a kind.

So is an unplayed copy of Twisup VIP blood.

again, if youl care to actually read, that comment was made in reply to the fact that baron said this;

"My argument is this. To buy multiple copies of records with the sole purpose of selling them on later in order to profit from them shows a complete lack of respect for others. That double you pick up literally means someone else who wanted to buy it can't, and just so you profit from it later? I would love to know how that is morally justifiable? "

Their is a massive difference between buying two copies of a record and keeping one mint to make profit later and already having, or finding a genuine Van Gough that you can sell for a massive profit.

The two are completely different.
Van Gough done ONE painting.
Loads of records are produced for sale.

[chamclowder]

And I got to them first. Had I not, someone else would have. If you didn't get it, it wasn't because you tried really hard the second it came out and it disappeared in 15 seconds. If you are reloading the page on the day the shit drops, you will have a copy of the tune you want... otherwise, it's still pretty fucking cheap until it becomes an Anthem... try ebay before it becomes 5 years old and maybe it wouldn't be as much. THE END.



That said... first person with legit screenshots of the inside of the Bash forum and cache dumps of all coversations gets a free copy of Ancient Memories OG/AM skream rmx on Vinyl... unplayed.

[bob crunkhouse]

lol, no one would buy multiple copies of every record in the WAR series for anything other than to sell on they're awful.

haha, definitely!

[the wiggle baron]

To buy multiple copies of records with the sole purpose of selling them on later in order to profit from them shows a complete lack of respect for others.

I can live with that.

That double you pick up literally means someone else who wanted to buy it can't, and just so you profit from it later? I would love to know how that is morally justifiable?

Is it morally reprehensible that some rich motherfucker buys up all the brilliant art in the world, when there are millions of dirt poor art lovers out there that can't afford it? Tough shit then. There's only one of each painting, thus making it valuable. How do you know that I wouldn't give it to a friend maybe, or give it away as swag at a show or something... You don't know and you're judging based upon the possibility.

Also, nobody knows what tunes will be valued and which ones won't. It's not like when he bought 3 copies of DMZ 003, he knew it would be as valued as it is today. Most you'd maybe think is it would double... oh no... now it's 10 pounds instead of 6.99. BLAH BLAH.

Do not try and bring in how the distro's/artists would prefer you to buy them, because we are talking here about releases that will go on to be valuable, which are releases which well sell out completely.

And if you think common courtesy is uncommon I do not envy the world you live in.

Same world you live in buddy, I just don't have my head up my ass and the town I live in isn't called the "Land of Make Believe" mmkay? Again... how we spend our money is none of your business... had I not told you about our buying habits, you'd have been none the wiser.

If it wasn't me, it'd be someone else. Don't forget it. If it's you making 150 pounds for a record or me, it's me. All day all night.

Boy oh boy...

1) The difference is the people who are selling their expensive art pieces have only that copy. If someone has one copy of a record, of COURSE its alright to sell it. Its how the world works. But again you're getting completely unrelated. My point is that if someone is buying MULTIPLE copies of a record, in order to sell their spares on at a later date to profit from them, its wrong.

2) That whole "I might give it away" thing is yet another unrelated point.

3) Of course you can tell which records will be valuable and which won't. Of course not perfectly (represses etc.) but again, my point is that if you are buying these records in order to sell them on again later, knowing that they will go for alot, that is wrong.

4) I obviously don't live in the same world as you. The world I live in is a civilized society, not the suburban equivalent of a fucking jungle.

5) You made how you spend your money my business by putting it up for critique on a public forum. If you didn't want people commenting on it you shouldn't have said anything.

6) The "if i didn't do it, someone else would" argument is so flawed I can barely bring myself to touch it.

[chamclowder]

My point is that if someone is buying MULTIPLE copies of a record, in order to sell their spares on at a later date to profit from them, its wrong.

2) That whole "I might give it away" thing is yet another unrelated point.

3) Of course you can tell which records will be valuable and which won't. Of course not perfectly (represses etc.) but again, my point is that if you are buying these records in order to sell them on again later, knowing that they will go for alot, that is wrong.

4) I obviously don't live in the same world as you. The world I live in is a civilized society, not the suburban equivalent of a fucking jungle.

5) You made how you spend your money my business by putting it up for critique on a public forum. If you didn't want people commenting on it you shouldn't have said anything.

6) The "if i didn't do it, someone else would" argument is so flawed I can barely bring myself to touch it.

Buying multiple copies to sell for profit isn't wrong bro... it's called owning a record shop... what is the difference?

I live in America, and until you have paid overseas shipping for EVERY FUCKING TUNE YOU OWN, you don't say shit to anyone about having to buy an extra copy just to afford your first copy EVENTUALLY. We can't(most of us) walk into a shop and pick up whatever we want. We have to order it online or we don't get it. You have an advantage that we don't and I can see why you'd be sad that we eliminate it by being smarter, richer and faster than you UK LOT... trust me, for a while there, I didn't know how my boyfriend was collecting tunes like he was. Now that I know, I don't really care as long as he keeps getting all the hot shit for me to listen to on demand.

My heart is really aching for all of you who have access to FWD and DMZ and live in the fucking epicenter of the scene that we get scraps of. Frankly I can't be bothered to care.

Again... who is hurt in the end?

Your copy is more valuable because we did what we did. Ours is more valuable... everyone else who got it, they have a more valuable record because of us... the labels got paid, the artists got paid, the distro got paid, the producer becomes ever more storied for their ability to "sell" 1000 copies of a tune, etc...

Again, I'm playing the worlds smallest violin for you...

/me rubs fingers together in a "show me the money" manner

[the wiggle baron]

For a start, I just did a random check and clicked buy for 4 random records on chemical, and the postage came to £2.20 more for the USA. If you really think that you cannot afford that extra, then I dont think you should be buying records.

But yeah, its good to see that youve finally given up arguing the point that its morally justifiable to buy multiple records to profiteer from, and have backed down to "I know its wrong, but I do it anyway". (oh, unless you actually think your record shop comment was worth saying )

Nice.

P.S. And the direct answer to "who is hurt in the end?" is the person who cannot buy the copy of the tune that you bought in order to sell it on at a later date.

[struggle]

lol, no one would buy multiple copies of every record in the WAR series for anything other than to sell on they're awful.

haha, definitely!

no shit! really funny how most of these sought after tunes are rubbish(to me at least). it would be interesting to see what some of these are worth in a few years time after the hype has worn thin.

[chamclowder]

For a start, I just did a random check and clicked buy for 4 random records on chemical, and the postage came to £2.20 more for the USA. If you really think that you cannot afford that extra, then I dont think you should be buying records.

But yeah, its good to see that youve finally given up arguing the point that its morally justifiable to buy multiple records to profiteer from, and have backed down to "I know its wrong, but I do it anyway".

Nice.

I didn't back down. You're the one who is wrong here. I spend my fucking money how I want to. That's not wrong. Telling someone else how to live their life is wrong.

Yea, an extra 4 dollars... when a domestic record is going for $6.99, that's ridiculous. And there's never been an order less than 10 records to this house, because it's not worth it with the shipping. Once you drop 200 dollars every other week on records, you don't have that extra money to drop on shipping... even if you did have the money to drop on shipping, 200 dollars every other week wears down on you--no matter how much you make. He doesn't just buy Dubstep bro. And he also collects hard to find shit...

What about baseball cards... is it wrong to collect more than one of them because they will be valuable... I mean after all, some kid can't bend them up and ruin them if I buy them all up.

When it comes down to it, these records will be even more valuable than those that are already played, becoming more sought after. When you finally come looking for that special tune, not only do I have it--it's still sealed.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it. Once you have mellowed out, consider that someone is going to be excited as all hell when they connect with that tune. Like the scene from Fight Club when Brad Pitt holds the gun to the store clerks head, and then he says

"Tomorrow when he wakes up, he's going to eat the best meal he's ever eaten, because he's alive."

Same thing. When they finally find that tune, it's like an explosive orgasm. I guess you just don't collect them? It might really chap your ass then to know that after he gets them, he rips them to WAV and doesn't even play HIS copy, because he doesn't want to fuck it up.

[frebentos]

do you actaully buy any of these records or is it all your b/f's hard earned cash that goes on it?

[nitrous_mcbread]

Chamclowder, you exude a thrillingly intelligent amorality which makes me think your boyfriend's a very fortunate fella.

[chamclowder]

do you actaully buy any of these records or is it all your b/f's hard earned cash that goes on it?

We both have jobs. He invests his money in the tunes he wants for himself and I invest my money in the tunes I want him to have so he can play for me. Sometimes they collide and we end up with extras, then we hold on to them. We don't like get together and collude to buy up tunes that will be huge 3 years from now.

Good music is timeless. That said, just because something is good, timeless or sells out, doesn't mean that it will be worth any more than we paid to begin with. It's all luck. We're not conspiring to cut everyone out, but we don't feel bad if they are. We've all been there. Quit Crying. Chin Up.

It's fucking music. You're sad because you didn't get there first. We get it and we know what that is like--and FYI, if you scroll up, you'll note that we've paid out the ass for certain releases ourselves. We weren't cursing the guy who burned us--but praising them for having what we needed when we wanted it. I'm not about to feel bad because I spent money that I earned on something and it happened to become worth more than we spent.

I have a whole stack of his old records that were hot hot hot at the time, and now neither he, nor anyone else play them.

On the other hand, he owns the Tempa, DMZ, Mu, etc catalogues, and people are playing and collecting them. Don't hate us because we have the gift of both taste, as well as forsight.

Chamclowder, you exude a thrillingly intelligent amorality which makes me think your boyfriend's a very fortunate fella.

I don't pirate tunes. I do my part to help the scene. I don't even own turntables myself, and he doesn't really keep his tables at my house either. It's not like I see the vinyl being played, because he rips it to digital so the vinyl is still playable after 3 years of battering. People are acting like we never miss out on tunes. We miss them all the time. That is why we really feel for people when they miss out. And we'll be glad to help you out when we finally get the time to post them up for sale. More often than not, it's not on ebay, because we know someone personally who needs to have the tune.

Sometimes, it's because he doesn't want the locals playing the same tunes as him, so he cleans the shelf.

Why doesn't Mala repress old DMZ? Because if he did, the they would be completely worthless.

[the wiggle baron]

lol, Ive completely lost count of the number of unrelated points you have made now cham. Are you a politician?

ALL im trying to comment on, is the morals of buying an extra copy of something, so that you deny another person the chance of owning a piece of music they love, in order to sell it on at a later date (possibly to that person! who knows?) for alot more money.

For a start, if youre getting records for $6.99 thats a FUCK lot cheaper than I am!! I pay I would say on average £5.99 per 12". Thats what, $12? So im really not sure where that argument (which doesn't even justify a thing) is coming from.

And by the way, I could give any less of a shit how your boyfriend spends his money. If hes profiting from other people to buy more records, or more crack, I couldnt care less. Doesn't change the morals of the situation.

Again, another unrelated point from you with the baseball cards thing. If someone bought 10 copies of WAR001 because they had always wanted to own 10 copies of it and hang them around their room, all power to them. Its buying them with the intent to sell thats wrong. If you collect something you keep it, not sell it on for profit.

And that whole "ill have it still sealed" is also irrelevant (youre good at this). Yes, the person who buys it from you will get it sealed, but so would they have if you had left them that copy in the shop (and without the ridiculous price tag).

I dont know what your ripping to MP3 thing is about. Im struggling to think of anything i could care much less about