The Official Growl Bass Thread

[mromgwtf]

Just keep it simple

[enjarcher]

Just keep it simple

Actually, I think this is really good stuff. If we can learn the workings behind this stuff then we can start to build sounds much more methodically and not just mess around with the parameters and take wild stabs in the dark.

[neonmansion]

wow! mromgwtf actually made a quote by me his sig!!

this guy really is SUCH a FUCKING ASSHOLE!! i mean dude.. get laid or something//

I think i should just put your music in my sig from now on because that would be the best way of putting you down. Everyone being able to hear your contrived pseudo production would be THE best way to put you in your place!!!

you are so y

[mromgwtf]

wow! mromgwtf actually made a quote by me his sig!!

this guy really is SUCH a FUCKING ASSHOLE!! i mean dude.. get laid or something//

I think i should just put your music in my sig from now on because that would be the best way of putting you down. Everyone being able to hear your contrived pseudo production would be THE best way to put you in your place!!!

you are so y

what

[PhotonOfficial]

help

[Eskimo]

He's 15 today



Anyway stop going off topic :<
...Someone made a thread about izotope trash 2, excellent plugin to beef up basses peeps

[PhotonOfficial]

He's 15 today



Anyway stop going off topic :<
...Someone made a thread about izotope trash 2, excellent plugin to beef up basses peeps

I'm fifteen everyday!:D

Until my next birthday.

[neonmansion]

Check it out! Back with some new bass sounds.

I've been doing other things for a while but lately I have been working on bass sounds again. This time I tried a technique that let me do a lot more with less. All I am doing hear (and each different sound is a variation on the same technique) is I am using fm8 and guitar rig. I am using very minimal stuff in fm8 but using the envelopes to create movement. Then I am using the envelopes in guitar rig to morph filters, ring mods and flangers to add yet more movement. One of them I use lfo's instead of envelopes but Lfo's can easily be found and used in guitar rig.

Let me know what you think!


Soundcloud

[Kongret]

Soundcloud
Check my new growl sound at 0:45. I made it in massive using arctic, b-pulse and phased modern talking.

Mad props to mromgwtf for his posts here.

[mthrfnk]

@Neon: Shits sounding clean, maybe so more info?
@Kongret: Nice sounds man, try adding some more stereo width on the growl tho

[neonmansion]

Wow! A positive response from Mthrfnk? Maybe your not so horrible after all.

A lot times people here say I over complicate things or whatever but if you think the bass sounds decent or clean thats exactly why. I try to design my own methods. So those sounds are a result of a marriage between fm8 and guitar rig. Both have excellent envelopes, in fact the best envelopes in all NI i'd say.

So basically I have fm8 with some overdrive effects (tone close to full, drive full) and the cabinet effect with size all the down, and maybe some added bass and treble. That pretty does it for effects because it adds some need grit. Then the operators are pretty simple. Although you can make it as complicated as you want. I just feed one operator (typically something weird like a formant or 1+6 or something) into a sine waves. I then fuck around with the envelope of the modulating operator. (the formant/1+6) whatever. I set the envelope to grid and plot out about 4 beats of rhythmic motion. So by then it will sound something like waaahhh wwwwomp rruuhhhh weeeeee .. which might go to the beat like 1(wah) 2womp 3 ruhhhh 4 weee...

So as you can see you can get some pretty interesting sounds just with fm8 and some clever use of the envelope. (btw you can simply write in a midi note and trigger all this mayhem.. sorta like massive)

Then the magic comes in with Guitar Rig. GTR also has some cool grid based envelopes. So you insert an envelope and learn the midi note from fm8 to trigger it. (you must create a secondary midi track in live,, and you must be using the vst instance of guitar rig because au doesn't have extended midi capabilities)... Now when you hit a note it triggers the envelopes of fm8 and guitar rig in unison. Write in some envelope data that compliments the one in fm8. Now assign that envelope to a couple filters in guitar rig. Maybe a formant and a peak filter. Just like with fm8 you can go crazy and add ring mods and phasers but for now keep it simple.

Add some distortion and multiband compression and vuala... the growl/bass plays perfectly everytime you hit a note.. No need for automating shit!

[mthrfnk]

Wow! A positive response from Mthrfnk? Maybe your not so horrible after all.

A lot times people here say I over complicate things or whatever but if you think the bass sounds decent or clean thats exactly why. I try to design my own methods. So those sounds are a result of a marriage between fm8 and guitar rig. Both have excellent envelopes, in fact the best envelopes in all NI i'd say.

So basically I have fm8 with some overdrive effects (tone close to full, drive full) and the cabinet effect with size all the down, and maybe some added bass and treble. That pretty does it for effects because it adds some need grit. Then the operators are pretty simple. Although you can make it as complicated as you want. I just feed one operator (typically something weird like a formant or 1+6 or something) into a sine waves. I then fuck around with the envelope of the modulating operator. (the formant/1+6) whatever. I set the envelope to grid and plot out about 4 beats of rhythmic motion. So by then it will sound something like waaahhh wwwwomp rruuhhhh weeeeee .. which might go to the beat like 1(wah) 2womp 3 ruhhhh 4 weee...

So as you can see you can get some pretty interesting sounds just with fm8 and some clever use of the envelope. (btw you can simply write in a midi note and trigger all this mayhem.. sorta like massive)

Then the magic comes in with Guitar Rig. GTR also has some cool grid based envelopes. So you insert an envelope and learn the midi note from fm8 to trigger it. (you must create a secondary midi track in live,, and you must be using the vst instance of guitar rig because au doesn't have extended midi capabilities)... Now when you hit a note it triggers the envelopes of fm8 and guitar rig in unison. Write in some envelope data that compliments the one in fm8. Now assign that envelope to a couple filters in guitar rig. Maybe a formant and a peak filter. Just like with fm8 you can go crazy and add ring mods and phasers but for now keep it simple.

Add some distortion and multiband compression and vuala... the growl/bass plays perfectly everytime you hit a note.. No need for automating shit!

Man I'm not horrible, I can just be pretty critical to quote:

i give him one thing though he made mthrfnk, one of the nicest guys on dsf, a bit angry

The thing I like most about the sound is the "ya ya yuh" phrasing for want of a better way to describe it. It sounds nice and thick - similar to some stuff I've heard Skrillex and others do before, but whenever most people to recreate it they use Massive and end up with a "yoi yoi" sound instead.

I'll have another play in FM8, been a while since I used it.

[neonmansion]

that is because 99% of people attempting to make quick modulated sounds are using massive because well.. that makes sense. However you are stuck using massives bit reduction.. massives filters.. shit, your stuck using the particular shape of its lfo's

when you use envelopes to control effects.. you can do anythin really.. ex.. adjusting the second breakpoint curve thats morphing a 3rd party ringmod at 27%

all those little parameters to change all add little elements

[OfficialDAPT]

Soundcloud

Let me know if you want more info although I made this using a vocoder so you're most likely not going to be able to replicate it exactly.

[Maxxan]

Neon, nice growls, I particularly like the first one.

Drop the butthurt attitude though man. We get it, DSF's been harsh on ya but you need to get over that or no one will ever get off your tits lol.

Anyway, I've been trying to use Guitar Rig to beef up some of my growls using the amp and cab simulations but whenever I do I get this boxed in muddy sound that just sounds completely shit. I really cant figure out why it does that, it drowns the sound out completely. Did you just use it for the filters or did you use the amp/cabinet modules as well?

[neonmansion]

Neon, nice growls, I particularly like the first one.

Drop the butthurt attitude though man. We get it, DSF's been harsh on ya but you need to get over that or no one will ever get off your tits lol.

Anyway, I've been trying to use Guitar Rig to beef up some of my growls using the amp and cab simulations but whenever I do I get this boxed in muddy sound that just sounds completely shit. I really cant figure out why it does that, it drowns the sound out completely. Did you just use it for the filters or did you use the amp/cabinet modules as well?

i get more annoyed when DSF ppl get on my balls but don't address my questions. Alot times I get treated like noob when I have legit questions. BUT w/e its a new day and i'm in a good mood

BTW, i'm listening to the track in your sig and its badass. You own growls 10x as much as me.. How did you make them?? theres a lot of processing and stuff.. is that all automation written in?? are you automating the synth more.. or filters and stuff

but the way i make growls is different from most ppl so i think it can do more things and make more different sounds I just have to refine it... Like i'm not just using gtr rig for amp effects.. im using a lot of the traktor effects being mmoduulated by the internal envelopes. Only thing is NI fucked up with the envelopes because they don't really trigger very well unless you map them to midi.. which is a bitch to do

[Maxxan]

Thanks a lot man, glad you like it. I do my growling in massive but it's not so much about wavetable automation, that way you get the shitty generic growls everyone's got. I just use massive to get a beefy timbre and then most growling is done in post-processing. Pitch automation inside massive, and also some wavetable automation just to mix up the character. All automation is done by hand in automation clips that I try to match to get different talking sounds, there's no formula to it, I just listen and then try to find different phrasings that go well together. The main bulk of the talking comes from EQ automation, semi-wide band in the 300-500 hz region. Scoop out a bit just above that to get a more throaty sound when you sweep that region. Also put in some peaks here and there to simulate a formant to get it even more vocally, dont have to automate them though, just put one ore two in the mids for some character.

Usually I'll also automate a bandreject, mostly before but sometimes after the EQ. Pretty wide with almost no resonance but that's to taste. This gives you movement but not talking, so you can get different variations of the same phrases with the EQ if you get me. Same goes for light wavetable automation, just for some added character on one or two oscilattors. Split the bands, send the mids and maybe highs through a vocoder with wide bands to give it more character, distort, flanger and the usual stuff. Then some different distortions on different bands, not any real thought to this just different signal chains to make it fatter when you throw them all together again in the end. I think I may be forgetting a few things but that's the main idea of it. You might automate a scream filter in massive as well, think I did that for some places in the song. Easy on the scream and reso though, you want the talking coming after the filter, that's just for even more character.

And here's the best part mate. No resampling.

I gotta start using guitar rig more, I'm sure that you can get insane beefy growls with some guitar amp distortion but I just haven't been able to set it up correctly. Someday I gotta try routing it through my guitar amp, if I can bother to dust that old bugger off.

[dblaze]

what vocoder do you use? i use logic and the vocoder in there is shit

[Maxxan]

Vocodex, straight up. It's pretty sweet for basses, it gives them this sorta round-ish low end that I like. It also has some kind of gain curve where you can adjust for lost highs etc, and some cool voicing and formant parameters you can tweak. It's good, check it out. My one beef with it is that it's really hard to set the dry/wet if you're not using a carrier/modulator setup. Then it just brings up the volume if you turn up the wet knob, which can be a bit of a hassle. You can always just split the signal though, it's just a minor annoyance.

[OfficialDAPT]

Vocodex, straight up. It's pretty sweet for basses, it gives them this sorta round-ish low end that I like. It also has some kind of gain curve where you can adjust for lost highs etc, and some cool voicing and formant parameters you can tweak. It's good, check it out. My one beef with it is that it's really hard to set the dry/wet if you're not using a carrier/modulator setup. Then it just brings up the volume if you turn up the wet knob, which can be a bit of a hassle. You can always just split the signal though, it's just a minor annoyance.

The ableton stock vocoder seems to work pretty well although I don't have anything to compare it to.