Post your unpopular opinions.

[Harkat]

It sounds better IMO actually. I don't have numbers but I swear it does. And I'm not even a massive vinyl junkie.

I remember playing Distance - Free Me on my parents speakers in the living room and the drop just punches you in your chest, but even on my sick monitors the tune off spotify doesn't have the same feel

[hubb]

yeah

to both of you ^

[jrkhnds]

most of digital dubstep releases sound shit because all the "mastering" on it was done by the artist in Ozone with some 100 quid Yamaha "reference speakers", while the vinyl has been mastered by professional engineers. that is probably the largest difference you'll hear. I won't deny that vinyl's natural distortion adds character and an organic feel to the sound... and a Spotify stream isn't really a reference.

still prefer vinyl, play it out. feels better, looks better. still unsure if it really sounds better... don't think I've ever played on a system where the WAV would've been the weakest link, and I doubt a lot of you guys have, either.

[antipode]

most of digital dubstep releases sound shit because all the "mastering" on it was done by the artist in Ozone with some 100 quid Yamaha "reference speakers", while the vinyl has been mastered by professional engineers.

I don't listen to that stuff, that's a given. I'm talking about a label like Deep Medi that would have professional mastering for both digital and vinyl for the same release.

don't think I've ever played on a system where the WAV would've been the weakest link, and I doubt a lot of you guys have, either.

It comes down to what the system is tuned for, but generally I'd be cutting the his on the mixer a fair bit when playing digital because the hi end is harsher at louder levels.

But lets be real - people are usually too drunk to notice the difference anyway

[garethom]

It comes down to what the system is tuned for, but generally I'd be cutting the his on the mixer a fair bit when playing digital because the hi end is harsher at louder levels.

But lets be real - people are usually too drunk to notice the difference anyway

As someone that doesn't play out much, so correct me if I'm wrong, but won't most places' set ups nowadays lean towards digital anyway?

[RKM]

sixs i wasn't trying to suggest digital is better than vinyl because i have a half arsed set up, i was just saying why i enjoy records even though i'm not hung up about sound

[antipode]

It comes down to what the system is tuned for, but generally I'd be cutting the his on the mixer a fair bit when playing digital because the hi end is harsher at louder levels.

But lets be real - people are usually too drunk to notice the difference anyway

As someone that doesn't play out much, so correct me if I'm wrong, but won't most places' set ups nowadays lean towards digital anyway?

Yeah this is true, that's if the venue gives a shit about the sound in the first place. I guess it would have been more of an issue a few years ago.

I would like to hear vivek's input on this subject. Didn't system start off as a vinyl only night? Be interesting to see how much tuning has to go into catering for both.

[hubb]

It comes down to what the system is tuned for, but generally I'd be cutting the his on the mixer a fair bit when playing digital because the hi end is harsher at louder levels.

But lets be real - people are usually too drunk to notice the difference anyway

As someone that doesn't play out much, so correct me if I'm wrong, but won't most places' set ups nowadays lean towards digital anyway?

If its a 'band' venue then it will lean towards old standards nut again those are usually fine tuned over the years and better

[AxeD]

I usually apply slightly different EQ if people are playing vinyl.
I find there's a little more room for high end and mid-high.

It's real hard to hear though. A big system is so loud, it makes everything sound 'good'.

[wolf89]

On the subject of playing mp3 out:


Mp3 is a lossy codec which reduces file size whilst attempting to minimise perceivable loss of audio information. It is done by exploiting a number of psychoacoustic phenomena such as temporal masking and frequency masking. However the volume level mp3s were calculated around for the perceivable loss to be minimal is actual very low in the grand scheme of things which is one likely reason people will go for flac and wav when playing on large systems. Also depending on the encoder used there can be significant losses in high frequency content too. Low bit rate lossy formats will always sound shit. In fact at 128kbps, MP3s and AACs show the effects of a brickwall filter on the upper frequencies, losing content above 16khz. Apple mp3 vs LAME and Aac also creates actual fuckingdistortion and artifacts in the high frequency range below 256kbps VBR. Which I imagine wold be worse with CBR making me think below 320kbps would be worthless for any application and makes me suspect of using the codec at all even at 320kbps.

The critical band filtering process also leads to a lot of transient smearing with mp3 files too which to my ears is super noticable. In fact I was played 320kbps mp3 files and wav files of the same music in a studio in a double blinded test and quickly could consistently tell the difference by focusing on hi hat transient blurring.

Bass is also something easily damaged by lossy codecs too. To borrow from sound on sound for a second:

"Low frequencies are harder for DSP algorithms to analyse because their durations are long, and amplitude differences over the short analysis windows used by the encoders may only be slight — so the analysis system doesn't get an entire cycle of a low frequency per analysis window. In some situations, the encoder will be presented with less than a half cycle of any frequency below 114Hz. The AAC format fares much better in bass resolution, and it is thus much more forgiving to the bass."

So personally I avoid playing lossy files out. I will play 320kbps files because it's honestly not bad on most systems but still lossy codecs are pointless outside of streaming and mobile devices these days.

Now with vinyl vs a wav of a digitally produced file a big part is the difference in mastering. However the physical process of cutting and playing records does colour the sound. Meaning a digitally produced track will be more accurate to what came out the DAW vs the vinyl. However I personally like that colouration

[scherou]

That's one of the main reasons for playing a vinyl set right? The sound quality?

i love vinyl as much as the next guy, but the sound quality difference is 99% of the time placebo.

Well this isn't true.

prove me wrong? the only quantifiable difference in quality comes from the master, the rest is all placebo

Sorry mate I can't cite you any numbers. I remember when dubstep was mainly a vinyl and acetate based genre, and first hearing digital releases it didn't sound right at all. Vinyl has a physicality and presence, especially in the lowend/midrange that digital just doesn't.
Basically, A/B the same tune on a decent set of speakers with a vinyl and a wav and let us know what you think.
And to be clear, I've never been a vinyl purist either, I have nothing against CDJs but to say the sound of vinyl is a placebo is frankly ridiculous

but what im saying is that the 'physicality and presence, especially in the lowend/midrange' is only possibly different because of the mastering. also a worn out needle will obviously mean less high end. the rest of it is all down to the love of the physical format etc. which i totally get. but when i buy records i don't buy em pretending that they're doing a better job of reproducing the sound purely because of the format...
put it this way, if you were to play a 12" of a tune, then wheel it when the tune drops and play a wav of the same tune, no one is going to notice any difference if they weren't looking at the booth, unless the 12" was crackling. im not talking about mp3s here.

dont really appreciate the patronising 'frankly ridiculous ' because it's a very small and nitpicky difference. the fact that it gets discussed so often shows how subjective this topic is anyway so we should all probably stfu

edit: just to note, im not saying digital is better than vinyl, i prefer vinyl.

[CreamLord]

I use vinyl cause I couldn't really be bothered with digital

[Harkat]

sure

[nousd]

with my thread deleted without allowing the development of its theme,
it seems that this opinion belongs here:

people have all sorts of variations on basic genitalia
which, as children, they may come to regard as abnormal or ugly
(not talking deformities here)
particularly if families are uptight about nudity
or they have no sisters or brothers

most people as they mature become comfortable with what they got
but there's probably heaps that don't because any comparison can only be done thru porn
and I reckon it would help if our societies were more relaxed with public nudity
rather than be drawn into the current paranoia about paedophilia.
In Sydney of late, the 70s/80s tolerance of beach nudity has long gone
replaced by the wowserism that has lead to the condemnation of grandparents who allow infants to bathe naked
and beachside Councils are socially-engineering people's attitudes by pulling down communal changing sheds
and building claustrophobic, smelly cubicles which perfectly represent their small-mindedness.

rant over...

[CreamLord]

On the topic of vinyl, what's better, acetate or vinyl dubs?

[Phigure]

depends how you define better

vinyl is a lot harder of a material to cut than acetate. so vinyl dubs don't sound as good but are more durable, while acetate dubs sound better at first but wear out a bit faster

[DrGatineau]

try this thread

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=91594

i don't think acetate like completely wears out (ie it's not "done" after 50 or whatever amount of play) but it gets more noise faster than vinyl would

[sixs]

absolutely sickening even if it was only a matter of time

[butter_man]

is that unpopular? im sure most people feel the same.

'cept maybe katie hopkins who'll probably use it as a way to enforce another stereotype.

my bad, shame that.

[sixs]

i dunno, everyone seems surprised on FB twitta etc
it's not as if there were no warnings either
poke a dog with a stick for long enough & it's gonna bite you