depression and the artistic mind

[O Tumma Tum Ladin]

nah I wasn't no need to be so defensive lol

[Genevieve]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

There's suffering and there's suffering. 'Bad' feelings are just as necessary as 'good' feelings to grow to being a well-rounded person. Depression can drive a person to the point where feeling 'bad' is actually keeping you from becoming a more well-rounded person.

Things aren't as black and white and he's trying to insinuate.

Besides, therapy and treating people with depression isn't about making 'suffering go away', it's about helping people deal with the suffering.

I wouldn't trade my bipolar disorder for shit. I love it and I hate it and I'm quite sure that my experiences with both mania and depression have taught me a lot. But I still want to learn to get more good out of it than bad. Right now, my bpd is keeping me trapped.

[Pistonsbeneath]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

suffering through circumstances and clinical depression may bleed into one and other but they are not one and the same

i think you are confused, i couldnt agree more with the quote its fantastic....but it doesn't relate to my bleak times...ive for example experienced very difficult times in my family with trying my hardest to get my big brother clean on numerous occasions but when i was struggling with that i wasnt depressed

i have not so long ago been rendered useless for a period of time and it took all my will to go to work and do the same job...i was in that time talking to very few people...nothing particularly was different in my life then than now...it was chemicals and a lack of balance....not suffering in the way arthur miller meant

[parson]

suffering is what you do until you get tired of it and learn how to not suffer

[noam]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

There's suffering and there's suffering. 'Bad' feelings are just as necessary as 'good' feelings to grow to being a well-rounded person. Depression can drive a person to the point where feeling 'bad' is actually keeping you from becoming a more well-rounded person.

Things aren't as black and white and he's trying to insinuate.

Besides, therapy and treating people with depression isn't about making 'suffering go away', it's about helping people deal with the suffering.

basically this

there's certainly a point to be made that therapy in its many forms can often be misdirected and take a carte blanche approach to certain types of psychological disorder

there's also an obsession within western culture of psycho-analysis: so much of our culture revolves around the writings of an infamous psychologist who moulded our conception of psychology today

it is possible and imo probable that even by identifying 'disorder's', that in turn has influenced the thinking and behaviour - both directly and indirectly - of masses of people

in short he has a point about suffering, that it has caused acts that have been significant to culture and humanity, some of these positive and some of them negative

but to rely on a concept of 'the beauty of suffering' as reason for discrediting certain negative aspects of depression is a fundamental flaw in even understanding human psychology

the sheer amount of people who have committed suicide, who have hurt family members, who have committed atrocious acts, who have simply not lived their lives to the fullest, due to their own suffering - and importantly - haven't painted a picture or written a song thats made them famous and influential, is enough for me to think him misguided

Nietzsche was a believer in the power of suffering, he thought it fundamental to humanity's growth because he suffered all his life himself, and knew nothing else, he was also a believer in living life to the fullest and in his own words, 'every work of philosophy is the unwitting memoir of its author' - in other words, philosophers are incapable of writing objectively, their philosophy describes not the world, but their world: he believed in suffering because he couldn't NOT believe in its power... but to draw from that, that humanity NEEDS suffering to achieve greatness, is a leap which is negligent of numerous other factors in what it truly means to suffer, be human, and achieve great things

[kingGhost]

as you get older you'll get less depressed. you'll realize your concerns were trivial and not addressing the here and now. just wait it out bro.

[parson]

mad old people are depressed

[JBoy]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

There's suffering and there's suffering. 'Bad' feelings are just as necessary as 'good' feelings to grow to being a well-rounded person. Depression can drive a person to the point where feeling 'bad' is actually keeping you from becoming a more well-rounded person.

Things aren't as black and white and he's trying to insinuate.

Besides, therapy and treating people with depression isn't about making 'suffering go away', it's about helping people deal with the suffering.

basically this

there's certainly a point to be made that therapy in its many forms can often be misdirected and take a carte blanche approach to certain types of psychological disorder

there's also an obsession within western culture of psycho-analysis: so much of our culture revolves around the writings of an infamous psychologist who moulded our conception of psychology today

it is possible and imo probable that even by identifying 'disorder's', that in turn has influenced the thinking and behaviour - both directly and indirectly - of masses of people

in short he has a point about suffering, that it has caused acts that have been significant to culture and humanity, some of these positive and some of them negative

but to rely on a concept of 'the beauty of suffering' as reason for discrediting certain negative aspects of depression is a fundamental flaw in even understanding human psychology

the sheer amount of people who have committed suicide, who have hurt family members, who have committed atrocious acts, who have simply not lived their lives to the fullest, due to their own suffering - and importantly - haven't painted a picture or written a song thats made them famous and influential, is enough for me to think him misguided

Nietzsche was a believer in the power of suffering, he thought it fundamental to humanity's growth because he suffered all his life himself, and knew nothing else, he was also a believer in living life to the fullest and in his own words, 'every work of philosophy is the unwitting memoir of its author' - in other words, philosophers are incapable of writing objectively, their philosophy describes not the world, but their world: he believed in suffering because he couldn't NOT believe in its power... but to draw from that, that humanity NEEDS suffering to achieve greatness, is a leap which is negligent of numerous other factors in what it truly means to suffer, be human, and achieve great things

Straight copy and paste from a wiki page.

[noam]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

There's suffering and there's suffering. 'Bad' feelings are just as necessary as 'good' feelings to grow to being a well-rounded person. Depression can drive a person to the point where feeling 'bad' is actually keeping you from becoming a more well-rounded person.

Things aren't as black and white and he's trying to insinuate.

Besides, therapy and treating people with depression isn't about making 'suffering go away', it's about helping people deal with the suffering.

basically this

there's certainly a point to be made that therapy in its many forms can often be misdirected and take a carte blanche approach to certain types of psychological disorder

there's also an obsession within western culture of psycho-analysis: so much of our culture revolves around the writings of an infamous psychologist who moulded our conception of psychology today

it is possible and imo probable that even by identifying 'disorder's', that in turn has influenced the thinking and behaviour - both directly and indirectly - of masses of people

in short he has a point about suffering, that it has caused acts that have been significant to culture and humanity, some of these positive and some of them negative

but to rely on a concept of 'the beauty of suffering' as reason for discrediting certain negative aspects of depression is a fundamental flaw in even understanding human psychology

the sheer amount of people who have committed suicide, who have hurt family members, who have committed atrocious acts, who have simply not lived their lives to the fullest, due to their own suffering - and importantly - haven't painted a picture or written a song thats made them famous and influential, is enough for me to think him misguided

Nietzsche was a believer in the power of suffering, he thought it fundamental to humanity's growth because he suffered all his life himself, and knew nothing else, he was also a believer in living life to the fullest and in his own words, 'every work of philosophy is the unwitting memoir of its author' - in other words, philosophers are incapable of writing objectively, their philosophy describes not the world, but their world: he believed in suffering because he couldn't NOT believe in its power... but to draw from that, that humanity NEEDS suffering to achieve greatness, is a leap which is negligent of numerous other factors in what it truly means to suffer, be human, and achieve great things

Straight copy and paste from a wiki page.

LAWL

best you can do??

i have a philosophy degree, did my dissertation on Nietzsche on truth subjectivity and Nietzsche as a psychologist, not a philosopher... suck my dick Gaiboy

[noam]

mad old people are depressed

yea thats why old women grow beards and cba to shave em off

[kingGhost]

i have a philosophy degree

so what you're saying is you're unemployed?

[O Tumma Tum Ladin]

everyone's got a degree these days it's so depressing.

[noam]

i have a philosophy degree

so what you're saying is you're unemployed?

i have 2 jobs bitch

[jaydot]

This is turning sour and I ain't the kinda pussy to drink it.

[wub]

This is turning sour and I ain't the kinda pussy to drink it.

Your Lock Stock paraphrasing is weak, padwan.

[JBoy]

"My argument with so much of psychoanalysis, is the preconception that suffering is a mistake, or a sign of weakness, or a sign even of illness, when in fact, possibly the greatest truths we know have come out of people's suffering; that the problem is not to undo suffering or to wipe it off the face of the earth but to make it inform our lives, instead of trying to cure ourselves of it constantly and avoid it, and avoid anything but that lobotomized sense of what they call "happiness." There's too much of an attempt, it seems to me, to think in terms of controlling man, rather than freeing him. Of defining him rather than letting him go. It's part of the whole ideology of this age, which is power-mad."

- Arthur Miller


what do depressed ppl make of that statement?

There's suffering and there's suffering. 'Bad' feelings are just as necessary as 'good' feelings to grow to being a well-rounded person. Depression can drive a person to the point where feeling 'bad' is actually keeping you from becoming a more well-rounded person.

Things aren't as black and white and he's trying to insinuate.

Besides, therapy and treating people with depression isn't about making 'suffering go away', it's about helping people deal with the suffering.

basically this

there's certainly a point to be made that therapy in its many forms can often be misdirected and take a carte blanche approach to certain types of psychological disorder

there's also an obsession within western culture of psycho-analysis: so much of our culture revolves around the writings of an infamous psychologist who moulded our conception of psychology today

it is possible and imo probable that even by identifying 'disorder's', that in turn has influenced the thinking and behaviour - both directly and indirectly - of masses of people

in short he has a point about suffering, that it has caused acts that have been significant to culture and humanity, some of these positive and some of them negative

but to rely on a concept of 'the beauty of suffering' as reason for discrediting certain negative aspects of depression is a fundamental flaw in even understanding human psychology

the sheer amount of people who have committed suicide, who have hurt family members, who have committed atrocious acts, who have simply not lived their lives to the fullest, due to their own suffering - and importantly - haven't painted a picture or written a song thats made them famous and influential, is enough for me to think him misguided

Nietzsche was a believer in the power of suffering, he thought it fundamental to humanity's growth because he suffered all his life himself, and knew nothing else, he was also a believer in living life to the fullest and in his own words, 'every work of philosophy is the unwitting memoir of its author' - in other words, philosophers are incapable of writing objectively, their philosophy describes not the world, but their world: he believed in suffering because he couldn't NOT believe in its power... but to draw from that, that humanity NEEDS suffering to achieve greatness, is a leap which is negligent of numerous other factors in what it truly means to suffer, be human, and achieve great things

Straight copy and paste from a wiki page.

LAWL

best you can do??

i have a philosophy degree, did my dissertation on Nietzsche on truth subjectivity and Nietzsche as a psychologist, not a philosopher... suck my dick Gaiboy

That must be the reason why youre so much better than everyone else on this forum and why you are always right

p.s id rather be gay than a stuck up little turk or whatever it is that you are.

[noam]

lololol

lololol

[O Tumma Tum Ladin]

I'd rather be gay than stick it up a little turk

[wobbles]

you have ruined a perfetcly legitimit thread with your fightign wel i hope your hapyp

[Pistonsbeneath]

noam's racial background is obviously massively relevant