story of brostep

[-[2]DAY_-]

people don't bitch about coki cause hes a badman. end of story.
a lot of people you'd call elitists or the "deeper crew" don't get enough credit. They've got smart, diverse taste and understand the scene better. No one hates heavy dubstep. People hate lousy, boring dubstep, and DJ sets with no variation.

[JimmaJamJamie]

I am saying the opposite to your point. Your saying that people only like certain producers because of other producers liking them, but there are a lot people out there getting there tunes (harder stuff) pushed. That doesn't mean everyone that likes the producer pushing that sound is gonna jump on the harder stuff.

I am pretty sure that everyone likes certain music because it sounds good to them, not because of someone else telling them it's good.

I appreciate all sides it's what makes the whole.

I completely agree with this comment though but only if both sides are getting the hype they deserves. I don't like all these badly made songs getting undeserved hype.

[hellfire machina]

people don't bitch about coki cause hes a badman. end of story.
a lot of people you'd call elitists or the "deeper crew" don't get enough credit. They've got smart, diverse taste and understand the scene better. No one hates heavy dubstep. People hate lousy, boring dubstep, and DJ sets with no variation.

I don't name anyone in my previous post, so to say a lot of people I'd call the elitists or deeper crew don't get enough credit is retarded. There are tons of people in music that don't get enough credit, is it a travesty - yes it is, is it like this with every form of music - yes it is, is it futile to moan about it and also turn against other people because of it - yes it is.

It's a waste of energy and a disservice to yourself to be jealous of other people's success no matter how unjust you think it is.

I don't hate anything but I'm not a fan of boring dubstep or boring dj sets. These arn't afflictions of a style, boring music and dj sets are boring no matter what the sub genre or style. I find the mr eclectic dj "i play it all man but havnt got a clue as to how to make it flow" as much of an annoyance as the dj who's telling me to just feel it as he plays a variation of 5 notes in sub base with added atmospheric moods that have been used by bands like Hawkwind since the 70's and let's not forget mr 'I'm gonna kill your nan' with unimaginative mid range wobbles and robobass. They are all equally as annoying and boring. Oh I almost forgot mr 'dnb isn't the same since the ragga jungle days and I'm going to play the same 20 records over and over just to prove it'. I'm reaching for the razorblade and looking at my wrist no matter which one it is.

"They've got smart, diverse taste and understand the scene better" - I really don't know what to say to that.....

I've been writing and producing music proffesionally since 94 and djing since 96 , in that 17 year period I must have seen/heard these same arguments over and over a million times. It's silly and a waste of time that could be put to better use. Surely if you look behind you and see the same pattern over and over and it's not producing anything positive, it's time to break the cycle.

Come on guys this is all getting a bit silly now.

[fractal]

also its fair to point out that dubstep is not a coin, with only two sides "deep" and "hard"...

more like dubstep is a diamond, with tons of different facets... hard, hype, distorted, wonky, hip hopish, deep, 2stepy, housey, techno influenced, electro house influenced, soca flavored, congo heavy, wobbly, pretty, cheesy, etc... and for me, there is stuff in every facet that I enjoy and that I don't... to pretend that there are only two sides of dubstep is a great disservice to the sound, imho

[hellfire machina]

also its fair to point out that dubstep is not a coin, with only two sides "deep" and "hard"...

more like dubstep is a diamond, with tons of different facets... hard, hype, distorted, wonky, hip hopish, deep, 2stepy, housey, techno influenced, electro house influenced, soca flavored, congo heavy, wobbly, pretty, cheesy, etc... and for me, there is stuff in every facet that I enjoy and that I don't... to pretend that there are only two sides of dubstep is a great disservice to the sound, imho

100% agreed times eleventy billion!

[hellfire machina]

It's always evolving in a multitude of directions, that's the beauty of it for me.

[fractal]

for me as well!

[JimmaJamJamie]

Yeah completely agree with fractal's point. That is what has kept me so passion about this scene (every aspect) since first hearing it.

I think my passion is kind of what causes me to get into these arguements (i normally try and stay away from them ha). I just don't like seeing people getting undeserved attention and it therefore bringing negative connotations to the scene.

[-[2]DAY_-]

I don't hate anything but I'm not a fan of boring dubstep or boring dj sets. These arn't afflictions of a style, boring music and dj sets are boring no matter what the sub genre or style. I find the mr eclectic dj "i play it all man but havnt got a clue as to how to make it flow" as much of an annoyance as the dj who's telling me to just feel it as he plays a variation of 5 notes in sub base with added atmospheric moods that have been used by bands like Hawkwind since the 70's and let's not forget mr 'I'm gonna kill your nan' with unimaginative mid range wobbles and robobass. They are all equally as annoying and boring. Oh I almost forgot mr 'dnb isn't the same since the ragga jungle days and I'm going to play the same 20 records over and over just to prove it'. I'm reaching for the razorblade and looking at my wrist no matter which one it is.

obviously right about all that.

It's a waste of energy and a disservice to yourself to be jealous of other people's success no matter how unjust you think it is.
[. . .]
"They've got smart, diverse taste and understand the scene better" - I really don't know what to say to that.....

I dunno what jealousy has to do with it... people who've been around, know the lineage of the music just deserve some credibility over those who showed up yesterday, and their taste reflects it.

Don't you think a Bad Religion fan who's approaching 30 would understand the punk scene more than a 16 year old on their way back from their first Sum 41 concert?

[hellfire machina]

I'd like to think that's a common ground for most people on here.

All this talk of splits and sides really does make me shudder.

JimmaJamJamie - I hear you bruv but surely you can see how your attitude towards this is what's bringing negativity to the scene. Who are you to judge what deserves attention beyond your own opinion. Surely if you see a bunch of people enjoying a form of this music you would be happy about it. That's the whole thing with elitism, who gets to decide on what deserves attention, your shit tune is another mans percy. My opinion isn't better than yours its just an opinion formed by someone other than yourself, try to bear that in mind.

[hellfire machina]

I don't hate anything but I'm not a fan of boring dubstep or boring dj sets. These arn't afflictions of a style, boring music and dj sets are boring no matter what the sub genre or style. I find the mr eclectic dj "i play it all man but havnt got a clue as to how to make it flow" as much of an annoyance as the dj who's telling me to just feel it as he plays a variation of 5 notes in sub base with added atmospheric moods that have been used by bands like Hawkwind since the 70's and let's not forget mr 'I'm gonna kill your nan' with unimaginative mid range wobbles and robobass. They are all equally as annoying and boring. Oh I almost forgot mr 'dnb isn't the same since the ragga jungle days and I'm going to play the same 20 records over and over just to prove it'. I'm reaching for the razorblade and looking at my wrist no matter which one it is.

obviously right about all that.

It's a waste of energy and a disservice to yourself to be jealous of other people's success no matter how unjust you think it is.
[. . .]
"They've got smart, diverse taste and understand the scene better" - I really don't know what to say to that.....

I dunno what jealousy has to do with it... people who've been around, know the lineage of the music just deserve some credibility over those who showed up yesterday, and their taste reflects it.

Don't you think a Bad Religion fan who's approaching 30 would understand the punk scene more than a 16 year old on their way back from their first Sum 41 concert?

This is where we heavily disagree. Credibility for what? You speak like there is a contest of some kind taking place.

Music is relative, people connect to it or they don't. Your personal taste in music is no better than anyone elses, if it was it wouldn't be called personal taste it's an experience relative to you that you will share with others who have similar tastes. There is no winning or losing though, or better or worse, just different. Take the duality out of it bruv it's unnecessary.

[JimmaJamJamie]

Yeah man, i do understand what your saying now. Suppose it is a pretty narrow minded and elitist view to decide what is good and what is bad for everyone just from my judgement.

For a while i would get annoyed when people listened to "Brostep" and enjoyed it, but after a while i just couldn't be bothered with the hassle of trying to defend what i see as the better side of the scene. Now i do just realise that everyone has there tastes and who am i to tell them it's shit. I personally think it's shit but that doesn't me it is to everyone else.


These threads need to stop to be quite honest.

[hellfire machina]

Yeah man, i do understand what your saying now. Suppose it is a pretty narrow minded and elitist view to decide what is good and what is bad for everyone just from my judgement.

For a while i would get annoyed when people listened to "Brostep" and enjoyed it, but after a while i just couldn't be bothered with the hassle of trying to defend what i see as the better side of the scene. Now i do just realise that everyone has there tastes and who am i to tell them it's shit. I personally think it's shit but that doesn't me it is to everyone else.

That's all I'm really saying bruv. The world is a much more enjoyable place when you concentrate on what you like.


Big up!

[-[2]DAY_-]

In the bigger picture, yes. there's nothing to deserve credit for as a music fan, really.... but when someone's spinning a bunch of loud aggro records and someone else says "hmm, this isn't what dubstep's really about." i think they're correct and totally should say that, that is if anyone around them cares.

but that's just an opinion formed by me, i reckon.

Alternatively they could just walk away from that sound and seek something else. But people do like discussing shit and coercing others to share their taste. In anything, food, drugs, tunes, handball vs. raquetball.... its stupid, but don't pretend we're not of that nature.
I just went out on a limb to try n give credit where i think its deserving.

[hellfire machina]

In the bigger picture, yes. there's nothing to deserve credit for as a music fan, really.... but when someone's spinning a bunch of loud aggro records and someone else says "hmm, this isn't what dubstep's really about." i think they're correct and totally should say that, that is if anyone around them cares.

but that's just an opinion formed by me, i reckon.

Alternatively they could just walk away from that sound and seek something else. But people do like discussing shit and coercing others to share their taste. In anything, food, drugs, tunes, handball vs. raquetball.... its stupid, but don't pretend we're not of that nature.
I just went out on a limb to try n give credit where i think its deserving.

I agree it's amazingly stupid, which is why I don't partake and I genuinely believe that this forum would be a better place for EVERYONE if we all let people enjoy what they enjoy without passing judgement on them. I'm kinda hoping we can agree on that too.

[cityzen]

"It is better to be a human being dissatisfied than a pig satisfied; better to be Socrates dissatisfied than a fool satisfied. And if the fool, or the pig, are of a different opinion, it is because they only know their own side of the question."
— John Stuart Mill

[64hz]

"It is better to be a human being dissatisfied than a pig satisfied; better to be Socrates dissatisfied than a fool satisfied. And if the fool, or the pig, are of a different opinion, it is because they only know their own side of the question."
— John Stuart Mill

i would argue against this, but its the wrong thread.


so ill just post a tune instead.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_6oTfN_owc

[gremino]

going offtopic now, but

Don't you think a Bad Religion fan who's approaching 30 would understand the punk scene more than a 16 year old on their way back from their first Sum 41 concert?

i know you're talking about pop punk now, but if we think about punk as an attitude, sure it's all about teenager/early twenties raw anger and rebellion rather than some slighty dusted and hung-y 30ish bloke who's grew out of his rebellion. he might have a deep knowledge of punk music's history etc., but the problem is they tend to think the true kind of rebellion is only from 70's, and ignore/underestimate everything what is happening right now around them. okey there's my own assumptions here (and generally i know nothing about guitar music), so please correct me if you need

anyways, what i'm chasing here is the way how older generations underestimate youngers. and that's something which is frustating. the thing is, at the end of the day, this is youngsters music: Shy FX was only 16 when he made alltime jungle classic 'Original Nuttah', Skream and Benga were like, 15 or something when their tunes started getting released, Dizzee Rascal was 18 when 'Boy In Da Corner' was released, and wasn't oldskool hardcore full of teenager producers? the list goes on. it's ironic and tbh ridiculous, when an elder starts to "educate" a younger one about youngsters music. not to mention peeps in their 40/50s who's stuck in sixties rock, - LOL. (don't get me wrong tho, definetly not saying elders can't listen/make/dj this music aswell!)

where's people like John Peel? he was one of the rare persons who still understanded younger generations' music instead of looking them down.

[cityzen]

I only posted that quote because I feel it's pertinent to this thread. Sorry, that wasn't clear at all. It's just the argument of higher/lower pleasures but in Dubstep form ay.

[Majin]

Another thing that I think is overlooked yet astoundingly obvious is the fact that each producer has different goals when creating their music. My impression is that a lot of people that follow this music seem to assume that each producer is trying to create the perfect, definitive dubstep song. Obviously, this is not the case. Some guys to to go for a warm, deep, ambient feel and come up with something great. Others, go for a peak-time D&B kinda feel and also accomplish their goals.

So think now: which of these guys is a better, more talented producer of dubstep? Which is more deserving of attention? You shouldn't even be comparing the two. Just because 2 producers make music at a certain bpm, on a computer, doesn't mean they go for similar results.

What I think needs to happen is that we just forget about the fact that it's all called dubstep, and stop coming up with retarded sub-genre names, and just listen with an open mind.