Starting out making Electronic music..

[paravrais]

You don't really need music theory to produce dubstep. It's more about chromatics (semi-tones), diminished chords and blues scales

Because everyone knows semi-tones and scales aren't music theory...

[RmoniK]

Even if you do learn in a class (which might very well be easier depending on the class and your learning style) you will still need to put in LOADS of time on your own practicing and experimenting.
Anyone who tells you you don't need music theory for dubstep is lying. How else would you know what a diminished chord, blues scale or I-IV progression is.
DO learn the piano, but make sure you have enough time to practice both that and producing enough to progress properly with both (i.e. at least an hour or so per day, each.)

You can't learn to play the piano in a few months. I've been at it (and in music theory) for over 9 years and i still suck. My point is that with a basic knowledge of chords and notes you're just fine in dubstep, whereas in other musical genres you are not.

[EDN]

Yeah fair enough, but low level music theory is still music theory.
It's just that statements like "You don't really need music theory to produce dubstep." perpetuate the myth that you don't need to know anything about actual music to make electronic music.

I also never said you could learn piano in a few months, I was saying that OP should make sure that he practices enough to make it worthwhile to him.

[benjam]

as for DAWs I'll probably start with illegally downloaded FL, and then drop the $300 on Reason when I get the chance. Thanks for all the helpful suggestions and input.

Dont talk about about cracked software and anyway why would you go from FL to reason ??? All DAWs are basically the same just a different workflow. Dont believe anyone if they tell you this is better than that or this DAW has better sound quality than that one. Its bollocks theyre mis-informed. Talent is the key to good music DAWs are just 1s and 0s.

[paravrais]

Even if you do learn in a class (which might very well be easier depending on the class and your learning style) you will still need to put in LOADS of time on your own practicing and experimenting.
Anyone who tells you you don't need music theory for dubstep is lying. How else would you know what a diminished chord, blues scale or I-IV progression is.
DO learn the piano, but make sure you have enough time to practice both that and producing enough to progress properly with both (i.e. at least an hour or so per day, each.)

You can't learn to play the piano in a few months. I've been at it (and in music theory) for over 9 years and i still suck. My point is that with a basic knowledge of chords and notes you're just fine in dubstep, whereas in other musical genres you are not.

This is bullshit, maybe if you want to make shit sounding music with 2 note basslines and no chords you don't need to know much theory. But to make good dubstep (deep OR tearout) you need to know your stuff, whether you learn it from a book or trial and error it's still learning the theory. It's people that think they can make 'club bangers' without learning theory that are the reason there is so much shit music about today.

[RmoniK]

Even if you do learn in a class (which might very well be easier depending on the class and your learning style) you will still need to put in LOADS of time on your own practicing and experimenting.
Anyone who tells you you don't need music theory for dubstep is lying. How else would you know what a diminished chord, blues scale or I-IV progression is.
DO learn the piano, but make sure you have enough time to practice both that and producing enough to progress properly with both (i.e. at least an hour or so per day, each.)

You can't learn to play the piano in a few months. I've been at it (and in music theory) for over 9 years and i still suck. My point is that with a basic knowledge of chords and notes you're just fine in dubstep, whereas in other musical genres you are not.

This is bullshit, maybe if you want to make shit sounding music with 2 note basslines and no chords you don't need to know much theory. But to make good dubstep (deep OR tearout) you need to know your stuff, whether you learn it from a book or trial and error it's still learning the theory. It's people that think they can make 'club bangers' without learning theory that are the reason there is so much shit music about today.

my good friend, i challenge you to analyze any rusko song you find, and then tell me how much of them were based on the blues scale or on a chromatic movement from the root note... Ofcourse i'm not implying ALL dubstep is made this way, but sure as hell a lot of em is (*cough*brostep*cough*).

Man am i gonna get into trouble here.

[EDN]

The point is that it is always a good idea to learn theory. Thats it, full stop. You may someday want to produce something other than dubstep which needs a bit better of an understanding.
Just cause Rusko does it doesn't mean its good practice.
And cough all you like my friend but listen to any GOOD filth ("brostep") you will find that the melodies and harmonies are a lot more interesting than you seem to think.

[RmoniK]

link me an example. I'm not saying it's bad. People tend to think that music that isn't complex is not as good as the complex music. Why, everyone would be listening to jazz then. This is so wrong it hurts my mind to think about it. Some of the best music in the world is written with simple I-IV's and V-I's. My opinion is that dubstep is far more production related then melody. If you got production skills, you can make one long note sound like an absolute banger!

[paravrais]

Boy are you gonna wish you chose a different example XD do a bit of research, Rusko is a classically trained musician and a multi instrumentalist. Sure there is lots of bro that's made by people that know nothing about music, but if you can't even tell them apart from the ones who do know their shit then I don't think you're the best person to comment on this.

[paravrais]

This is a high profile brostep artist and if you think this song is only one note or doesn't make use of music theory then you're an idiot;



Not brostep but some examples of amazing melodic structure in dubstep;

[RmoniK]

paravrais, you just prove my point. Rusko may be the best musician in the world, he still keeps his music simplistic and easy-to-follow. He's the best example that good music doesn't have to be complex, because, let's face it, Rusko is pretty awesome. But he keeps it tidy and nice. The best rule to make music popular is to make it comprehensible. People have to have an idea about what is following on a chord. That's why certain progressions sound nice and others don't.

And yes, i knew Flux Pavilion was coming ;p Although that song is pretty easy to get. Just a typical I-V (or I-VII if you prefer). You guys are totally missing out the point. I'm purely talking about the music theory. Imagine any Flux Pavilion song's chord structure, they are the most simple stuff ever made. It would be dull as hell without the amazing production skills and the brilliant (but simple!) melodies he puts over them. If you are planning to make FP or Rusko style music, don't mess around with music theory, mess around with you're production skills.

Now imagine this in electronic dubstep style:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnSC0tRmya4
That's right, awful. No one would like that shit. Although Chick Corea is one of the most brilliant musicians alive.

I'm sorry to say it, but you are really just being narrow-minded. You refuse to accept that complexity does not equal good music (in all genres). Maybe that's where successful and classically schooled musicians succeed where a lot of the peeps here fail, because a lot of you certainly do not lack production skill. The main importance in dubstep is to find something CATCHY. NOT brilliant.

[hifi]

from what I can tell, most people share the opinion that it's MUCH easier to learn most of the stuff at a class rather than self-teach with tutorials.

Where the fuck did you get that idea from? It certainly wasn't here as most of the producers here are self taught. I suggest you take another look at that thread and actually follow the links and read what it says this time as literally everything you need to know IS in there. So don't pretend like you've read it all just cos you were too lazy to find the answers to your questions yourself.

you kidding me the actual "good" producers here have tooken classes. I'm currently in an Electronic Music/Production class. And I'm in theory, just recently started all the classes but it's better than self teaching because you have so many distractions it's insane well at least for the ADD people ahah. But being self taught is a good thing too, just getting taught is much easier while self teaching you can get up any time and eat something while in a classroom you have to stay there until it is over

[aeser]

this book is fucking awesome if you want to learn music theory:
http://www.amazon.com/Basic-Music-Theor ... 23&sr=1-12

[EDN]

Ok, srsly guys.
Paravrais calm down, Rmonik stop being an obtuse douche.
The important thing here is not whose music theory penis is bigger, the point is...

KNOWING MUSIC THEORY > NOT KNOWING MUSIC THEORY

Not both of you, put your handbags away kthnx.

[Genevieve]

Even if you do learn in a class (which might very well be easier depending on the class and your learning style) you will still need to put in LOADS of time on your own practicing and experimenting.
Anyone who tells you you don't need music theory for dubstep is lying. How else would you know what a diminished chord, blues scale or I-IV progression is.
DO learn the piano, but make sure you have enough time to practice both that and producing enough to progress properly with both (i.e. at least an hour or so per day, each.)

You can't learn to play the piano in a few months. I've been at it (and in music theory) for over 9 years and i still suck. My point is that with a basic knowledge of chords and notes you're just fine in dubstep, whereas in other musical genres you are not.

Learning piano is a good way to gather basic knowledge of chords and notes. It's all in front of you, laid out in a pretty straight forward manner (notes go from left/lowest to right/highest). Learning basic chords, scales and progressions in combination with piano is the way to go.

[paravrais]

@EDN - you've said pretty much identical things to me in this thread so I dunno why you're suddenly turning round and acting like I'm taking it more seriously than you :\ Oh and I think you dropped your lipstick.

@Rmonik - It always annoys people when people equate commonly used scales and patterns to being uncomplicated. You can do complex things with common scales and you can do very simple things with jazz scales and other things usually associated with more 'intelligent' music. If you actually listen to the things going on in those songs and the way the different harmonic elements interact with each other you will see it's a lot more complex than Kate Nash or whoever.

@Hypefiend - I wasn't trying to say self taught was better than lessons. Obviously they both have their plus and minus points but you'd be surprised how many people on here are totally self taught. I'm probably very wrong about this but isn't Kaiori even mostly self taught?

[RmoniK]

@EDN - you've said pretty much identical things to me in this thread so I dunno why you're suddenly turning round and acting like I'm taking it more seriously than you :\ Oh and I think you dropped your lipstick.

@Rmonik - It always annoys people when people equate commonly used scales and patterns to being uncomplicated. You can do complex things with common scales and you can do very simple things with jazz scales and other things usually associated with more 'intelligent' music. If you actually listen to the things going on in those songs and the way the different harmonic elements interact with each other you will see it's a lot more complex than Kate Nash or whoever.

@Hypefiend - I wasn't trying to say self taught was better than lessons. Obviously they both have their plus and minus points but you'd be surprised how many people on here are totally self taught. I'm probably very wrong about this but isn't Kaiori even mostly self taught?

That's actually exactly what i was saying. But i give up. I haven't slept in 34 hours so that's probably why i'm acting like a dick i'm pretty bad at explaining also.

[EDN]

@EDN - you've said pretty much identical things to me in this thread so I dunno why you're suddenly turning round and acting like I'm taking it more seriously than you :\ Oh and I think you dropped your lipstick.

Yeah but I try not to call people idiots...


...found my lipstick though, it was hidden underneath your gay card.

[paravrais]

@EDN - you've said pretty much identical things to me in this thread so I dunno why you're suddenly turning round and acting like I'm taking it more seriously than you :\ Oh and I think you dropped your lipstick.

Yeah but I try not to call people idiots...


...found my lipstick though, it was hidden underneath your gay card.

To be fair I often forget that there are lots of people on here who take offence to shit like that. I'm too used to hanging out with my mates and we all call each other hideous names as a sign of affection. I think a lot of the time people on here think I'm all riled up about something when I'm actually just having a laugh :\ anyway, all in good fun ehy

[EDN]