Good vs. Bad Mastering

[AxeD]

^ that's a good way to do it. I play my tunes on a variety of systems also. I once heard a blunt definition of mastering engineers job to be " make sure it sounds good on no matter what you playing In through" basically it's right without getting into all the technical mumbi schmumbo.

If anything I make sounds good on laptop speakers I would probably hate it myself

[Disco Nutter]

And have in mind that a good master comes after a good mix.

[Electric_Head]

I do digital mastering for a good group of labels, professionals and novices. Am working for z-audio (i mastered 6 tracks on the new dubstep onslaught cd), paradise lost, viscious audio, sqnc, and many others.

I can do you an a/b clip if you like. For details head over to www.
depone.co.uk/mastering

There we go.
Don`t look further.

[Littlefoot]

You have to remember what mastering is, it's the preparation of the audio for consumption, so a good master is one that sounds "right" (whatever that might be) in it's intended listening scenario(s). So some pretty obvious ones for dubstep would be that the bass needs to be balanced correctly against the rhythmic elements and remain the dynamic it needs to physically move the dancefloor, but this differs for example to a vocal pop track, where the dynamics of the bass are not entirely relevant but the loudness and translation of tonal balance of playback on on iPod headphones is extremely important.

When mastering you have to be aware of where the audio ends up, and how it needs to sound across what is often a complex range of listening scenarios

[joshisrad]

Why are you bumping all the old mastering threads O_o

oh I see why.. you're trying to market your mastering service in your signature

[jrisreal]

Why are you bumping all the old mastering threads O_o

Wondering as well...

this thread is way old and I don't even really care about mastering anymore.

[travis_baker]

mastering is all about a second pair of ears, it dosnt make sence to master ur own track, if u think about that is.

[RandoRando]

i love mastering, but then i hate it.

[wub]

I'll do a rough self mastering job on any tune I want to road test by playing out, but that'll involved FL Compressor on the Master > Brickwall > 40/50% wet


Rough & ready but does the job and if the mixdown is up to scratch it'll have the desired effect.

[fuz]

That must cost a lot of dynamic.
I don't think a limiter on a master track is an efficient solution. a compressor, even with some hard setup should do a better (ie musical) job and keep you out of the red.

[Maxxan]

I don't know what kind of strange bubble you people are living in, but unfortunately (of course this only applies if you're making commercial music) anything but smashing the shit out of the master (imo) is out of the question at this point. If your track is coming in much quieter than the previous one, the vast majority of people is going to think it sounds like shit and move on. I'm not saying I like it but that's how it is right now, adapt to survive.

And anyone that says they don't wanna make money off music is either already ridiculously rich or a lying tnuc.

[AxeD]

sometimes i try turning up the volume on my stereo to see how loud I can push the mix without it distorting to bits. stupidly simple, but not a bad way to listen for quality of your master. obviously you want its RMS to be loud in general... not talking about the mixdown here. but if you see how it stands up to the volume knob on whatever playback system.....This can help reveal clashing frequencies and spots where headroom is an issue.

Wouldn't that be your amp distorting?

[wub]

If your track is coming in much quieter than the previous one, the vast majority of people is going to think it sounds like shit and move on.

Does the DJ not have a volume/gain control?

[AxeD]

If your track is coming in much quieter than the previous one, the vast majority of people is going to think it sounds like shit and move on.

Does the DJ not have a volume/gain control?

On an album this is definitely the case. That's why mastering an album from a band is way more important than
a single completely digitally produced track.

[Maxxan]

If your track is coming in much quieter than the previous one, the vast majority of people is going to think it sounds like shit and move on.

Does the DJ not have a volume/gain control?

You're assuming that most producers have the luxury of having their tracks played out by DJ:s. Most of new producers traffic is going to come from soundcloud/youtube in the beginning, before people can hear their tracks out. And even then, when they go home, download the track they thought was good while they were shitfaced last night and play it just after, say a heavily limited Revolvr track, it's going to sound weak in comparison. Simple as that. If I want to play one of my own tracks live I might not smash it as much and just turn the gain up, but if I do it too much I'll bring the peaks up and either blow out the system, or peak the systems own limiter anyway which is the same thing with less control.

So no, I'm not sure I agree there tbh. I mean, for a big system you can definately get away with less limiting since everything sounds better louder so you don't have to smash it as much to get an impressive sound. But still, it's not that simple, and these days EDM isn't something you just listen to in clubs. I get some of my fans telling me they listen to my tracks in the gym in their iPod, and I have lots of friends who listen to Avicii or whatever on the bus or when they're doing the dishes, and on those occasions limiting is going to make a huge difference.

[DubMikey]

If you really want to compare your mastering with a professionally mastered tune, the only way is to do as wub suggests. Get one of your tunes professionally mastered, master the same tune yourself, compare. Basically everyone in the whole world will be able to pay 15 - 30EU at one point or another, it's not really that much money. Trust me, I know how it feels to be broke as I've been broke for all of my 20 years of life.

[ehbes]

If your track is coming in much quieter than the previous one, the vast majority of people is going to think it sounds like shit and move on.

Does the DJ not have a volume/gain control?

You're assuming that most producers have the luxury of having their tracks played out by DJ:s. Most of new producers traffic is going to come from soundcloud/youtube in the beginning, before people can hear their tracks out. And even then, when they go home, download the track they thought was good while they were shitfaced last night and play it just after, say a heavily limited Revolvr track, it's going to sound weak in comparison. Simple as that. If I want to play one of my own tracks live I might not smash it as much and just turn the gain up, but if I do it too much I'll bring the peaks up and either blow out the system, or peak the systems own limiter anyway which is the same thing with less control.

So no, I'm not sure I agree there tbh. I mean, for a big system you can definately get away with less limiting since everything sounds better louder so you don't have to smash it as much to get an impressive sound. But still, it's not that simple, and these days EDM isn't something you just listen to in clubs. I get some of my fans telling me they listen to my tracks in the gym in their iPod, and I have lots of friends who listen to Avicii or whatever on the bus or when they're doing the dishes, and on those occasions limiting is going to make a huge difference.

is there not a volume control on iPods.....

[Maxxan]

is there not a volume control on iPods.....

Well sure, if it's on their iPod they already know it's a good track so they might turn the volume up. But, it's a fucking hassle and I hate having to do this on my phone, and I'm sure other people do as well. And, maybe their shuffling from their phone at a party. No one is going to bother getting up and changing it for one track, they're just gonna think 'Oh here is some poorly produced not banging shit that sounds worse than skrillex'. Same thing if some ADD kid is browsing on soundcloud, he'll play the first ten seconds, it's not gonna be banging like Zomboy or whoever and he'll draw the conclusion that it's because it's not produced as tightly and write it off as just amateur producer. Whether or not what he thinks is correct doesn't matter in this case.

And tbh, if you think it's wrong to smash your tracks then you are wrong. Because all producers who are better than you (this is subjective of course but still, they earn more money so I'll take that as proof DERP) do it, and it works for them. Is it detrimental to music overall? Maybe. But, it's like boycotting cheap clothes from Indonesia. Bad for you, good for everyone else.

[RandoRando]

is there not a volume control on iPods.....

Well sure, if it's on their iPod they already know it's a good track so they might turn the volume up. But, it's a fucking hassle and I hate having to do this on my phone, and I'm sure other people do as well. And, maybe their shuffling from their phone at a party. No one is going to bother getting up and changing it for one track, they're just gonna think 'Oh here is some poorly produced not banging shit that sounds worse than skrillex'. Same thing if some ADD kid is browsing on soundcloud, he'll play the first ten seconds, it's not gonna be banging like Zomboy or whoever and he'll draw the conclusion that it's because it's not produced as tightly and write it off as just amateur producer. Whether or not what he thinks is correct doesn't matter in this case.

And tbh, if you think it's wrong to smash your tracks then you are wrong. Because all producers who are better than you (this is subjective of course but still, they earn more money so I'll take that as proof DERP) do it, and it works for them. Is it detrimental to music overall? Maybe. But, it's like boycotting cheap clothes from Indonesia. Bad for you, good for everyone else.

and thats why i dont care if ADD kids are listening to my music or not, if the kids at my party like my song they will get up and turn it up. I make music to please me and anyone else who takes an interest in my sound, not to please majority of todays dubstep listeners. I can tell you i deleted "burst" by 12th planet and skrillex because that is the loudest fucking song ive ever heard in my life and annoyed the shit out of me whenever it came on. So no, its not 100% percent working for those producers who "earn more money and are better than me".

[Maxxan]

Nothing is 100% working for anyone. I don't care if my fans aren't as 'educated' in music as I am. It's not their fault that the music industry is controlled by dollars and if you're not educated on production and physics I can see how louder = better to the average ear. I make music for myself but I'm not the one that's going to end up listening to it, so I adapt my tracks so that other people who are not producers can enjoy them. And in a way this means mastering them hotter.

I don't know, I see all your points and I'm not going to argue that I'm not a sellout because inarguably I am. I dunno, I just want my tracks to be heard by people and this is an effective way to increase my chances. But, to each his own I guess. I know a lot of people who'd prefer to have one passionate hipster fan than a hundred bros, I guess I'm just not one of those producers. I don't care as long as they dig it.