[production bible 2] Sub-bass

caeraphym · Post by **caeraphym** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:25 am

nowaysj wrote:
TeReKeTe wrote:
think notes first, frequencies second. a low D/E/F always rumbles nicely.
Open E string on bass is around 40 hz.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bass_guitar_tuning wrote: String Note Frequency

1 (thinnest) G 97.999 Hz
2 D 73.416 Hz
3 Aˌ 55 Hz
4 (thickest) Eˌ 41.204 Hz

Brisance · Post by **Brisance** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 1:05 pm

Daft tnuc wrote: English friends plz correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure .25 is actually right.

It depends regionally .25; 0.25; 0,25 etc. But if you don't use the zero before the decimal point, the latter can be hard to miss.

rubadub · Post by **rubadub** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 7:33 pm

Rendr wrote:

what, you think your going to have a sine at C1 and C3 for you sub...

0.25 semitone aka 50 cents either way.

Sorry did say I was being a plank. Just got confused because cubase wouldn't let me do decimal points on track parameters, got to do it on midi>transpose. I know that it's not on C1+3. Oh does anyone know where the old sub bass post went, from the old bible? couldn't find it in search.

rubadub · Post by **rubadub** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 7:33 pm

Sorry about double post. Is there an eqing thread somewhere, had a search, didn't find the one I was thinking of.

austin_tacious · Post by **austin_tacious** » Fri May 01, 2009 9:18 pm

Peace Dubstep Fam. My first post here!

Rather than a sine for a sub bass osc I recommend a triangle wave which has weak, odd harmonics. Layer three of them up. Put one down an octave. Do not detune.

As an aside, I find detuning to be counterproductive for sub bass as the phase shifting causes changes in volume at those frequencies. Generally, you just want a sub to be big and just resonate with any movement being a controlled thing, ie lfo or pitch. Detuning is a better trick for leads and pads, maybe basses (as opposed to subs). You CAN compress and detune , but just leaving it solid with mild overtones seems to be a better foundation...

Back to the tri wav patch. Engage an HPF and turn res right up. Tune cutoff to the lowest note in your song then back res down a bit. I've found lower order filters to be best as they are broader than a 4pole moog style. You'll find it resonating with everything in the room, vases falling over, glass breaking etc. As you go up the scale from your knee/cutoff you'll find it resonating less. You can either sample those goodies and move your knee OR if you have two filters ala a Virus you can add a LPF. Tune that the highest note in your song and crank the res up. You should have about an octave and a half of playable sub bass resonant destruction to layer under everything. You shouldn't need any compression or EQ at all.

megaladon · Post by **megaladon** » Sat May 02, 2009 1:15 am

fiziks · Post by **fiziks** » Mon May 04, 2009 2:58 am

For pure subs I usually float around the 40-50 range. Give or take a few hz in either direction, but 40 seems to be the sweet spot for the lowest note. F0 in an exs24 with no instruments will get the lowest note I'm referring to. While the heart of the note is at 40, you get some residual sound on both sides of 40. So maybe it's like 36-43 (or possibly lower, I'm only estimating) or some shit.

Also, with a sub, if you can hear it real well, it's way WAY too loud. If I'm mixing the drums and bass to -6 or so, I'll have the sub at around -16 to -18. Sub is the easiest thing to turn up too much since it's not that audible. Open up your analyzer and see where the sub is peaking. Make sure it's not spiking higher than everything else. Especially if you're using a straight sine because there aren't a lot of dynamics.

abZ · Post by **abZ** » Mon May 04, 2009 3:59 am

fiziks wrote:For pure subs I usually float around the 40-50 range. Give or take a few hz in either direction, but 40 seems to be the sweet spot for the lowest note. F0 in an exs24 with no instruments will get the lowest note I'm referring to. While the heart of the note is at 40, you get some residual sound on both sides of 40. So maybe it's like 36-43 (or possibly lower, I'm only estimating) or some shit.

Also, with a sub, if you can hear it real well, it's way WAY too loud. If I'm mixing the drums and bass to -6 or so, I'll have the sub at around -16 to -18. Sub is the easiest thing to turn up too much since it's not that audible. Open up your analyzer and see where the sub is peaking. Make sure it's not spiking higher than everything else. Especially if you're using a straight sine because there aren't a lot of dynamics.

Yeah a lot of my stuff is in the key of F because you right that is def a sweet spot. But you can go much lower on a nice rig. I really dig that in tunes when they go super low it's just that you will never really "get" the tune untill you hear it on some nice subs. That can be a draw back but at the same time people will be going nuts for that tune when you get the chance to unleash it. Another thing with the F note. It depends on how your bass line goes like you may want to do the tune in the key of A flat and make that F the 7th. Or maybe B flat and the bring the F in as the root of your 5th chord as a couple examples. That is usually how I figure out what key I want to make the tune in.

Sharmaji · Post by **Sharmaji** » Mon May 04, 2009 4:34 am

fiziks wrote:For pure subs I usually float around the 40-50 range. Give or take a few hz in either direction, but 40 seems to be the sweet spot for the lowest note. F0 in an exs24 with no instruments will get the lowest note I'm referring to. While the heart of the note is at 40, you get some residual sound on both sides of 40. So maybe it's like 36-43 (or possibly lower, I'm only estimating) or some shit.

Also, with a sub, if you can hear it real well, it's way WAY too loud. If I'm mixing the drums and bass to -6 or so, I'll have the sub at around -16 to -18. Sub is the easiest thing to turn up too much since it's not that audible. Open up your analyzer and see where the sub is peaking. Make sure it's not spiking higher than everything else. Especially if you're using a straight sine because there aren't a lot of dynamics.

big up fiziks! it really is that simple.

FWIW the exs24 is a monster for sinewave 'tingz.

grooki · Post by **grooki** » Mon May 04, 2009 5:22 am

fiziks wrote:
Also, with a sub, if you can hear it real well, it's way WAY too loud.

this always buggers me up... it has to be quiet, but yeah, often I turn it up much to loud... I made a BIG mistake with that recently... someone listened to something of mine on their headphones and said they couldn't hear the bass too well, so I pumped it up, resulting in bass wwwaaaay too loud - I have to trust myself more too.. it's on my myspace, Plan B, turn down your bass first or it might blow up lol

fiziks · Post by **fiziks** » Mon May 04, 2009 7:39 pm

nowaysj wrote:
fiziks wrote:If I'm mixing the drums and bass to -6 or so
d and b summed, or individually at - 6db?

Summed. To be more specific, the kick plus sub, plus any mid-bass that's sitting above the kick. Generally the first note of a bar has these three elements, so that's what I use to gauge where things should be. The kick is generally around -9 +/- a db. So I guess the bass adds about 3db.

However, this can only happen when there aren't any frequencies clashing and all elements are eq'd, pitched, and occupy their own space in the frequency range.

Finally, in regards to mid bass, the definition of "mid bass" is completely subjective. A rip roaring Rusko bass has loads of mids and is more a synth line, while an 808 line or something more subtle doesn't go that high and both need mixed and wrote differently. So, it depends on the tune

.

mqfluquerton · Post by **mqfluquerton** » Sun Jul 19, 2009 7:06 pm

LewisR wrote:What would you say is the BEST frequency to have your sub at?

kind of like, whats the natural frequency of your chest? there must be one frequency that you can feel the most.

Just a thought?

im probably completely wrong though

the listening body:

40 Hz - Pelvis
800 Hz - Torso
1000 Hz - Throat
5000 Hz - Forehead
10000+ Hz - Above the head

they overlap but these are the main focus points

frizzwah · Post by **frizzwah** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:53 am

mqfluquerton wrote:
LewisR wrote:What would you say is the BEST frequency to have your sub at?

kind of like, whats the natural frequency of your chest? there must be one frequency that you can feel the most.

Just a thought?

im probably completely wrong though
the listening body:

40 Hz - Pelvis
800 Hz - Torso
1000 Hz - Throat
5000 Hz - Forehead
10000+ Hz - Above the head

they overlap but these are the main focus points

and teh brown not3?

frizzwah · Post by **frizzwah** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:55 am

in all seriousness, this thread has been hella useful, realised how much i've been pushing my sub lines.

daft cunt · Post by **daft cunt** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:58 am

Added a very nice tutorial by Subfocus using Massive for some fat & moving sub.

daft cunt · Post by **daft cunt** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:29 am

nowaysj wrote:LINK?

In the 1st post mate.

[production bible 2] Sub-bass

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