emi chairman says the "cd" format is dead.

[dirty]

not everyone who has a record deck is a dj, either.

Thats true

As far as vinyl being the best format so far, how can you explain CD being so successful for so many years?

Yes vinyl sounds sick on a bangin system but for home listening....?

Digtial media allows you to play music in so many different environments, home, car, computer, ipod etc. And you can play multiple tarcks without having to move.

Don't get me wrong I love vinyl but for the average consumer, its digital all the way.

[bedward]

320 of Dutch Flowerz from the CD album is so much better than when I play the tune on vinyl.

yeah well there's no accounting for taste.
if u prefer the transients and pitch-accuracy to be subtly distorted in that way, you're not wrong.
perhaps yr record player & phono-amp is a bit crap as well.

some music sounds more attractive to me on tape.

but vinyl is still "better" in terms of sonic accuracy and psycho-acoustic "digestability."
it's good for you.

your experience is your own though, i'm not trying to change your mind.

[bedward]

As far as vinyl being the best format so far, how can you explain CD being so successful for so many years?

because excellence of service is not what dictates the actions of capitalist industries.

and most ppl don't give a shit about anything except being "modern" and not "unusual" so that they don't get ousted by the clan and eaten by wolves and crows.

[digital]

No it's not man.. mp3s are compressed files, it doesn't work like that. If the vinyl sounds bad, it's probably to do with your turntable, stylus, speakers or something like that. As far as I know, the possible frequency range for vinyl is also far greater than digital formats.

Yeah it is, the CD version sounds better. I have next to brand new 1210's with a better than decent pair of cartridges/needles and a very heavy sound system that rinses vinyl and mp3/wav all day long mate.

Unless your playing your tunes on a ridiculous system, i.e, in a club, can you really, honestly pick out the 'frequency ranges', and to quote bedward, 'sonic accuracy and psycho-acoustic digestability'....WTF.

@ Bedward, my record player & phono-amp must be crap yeah, obviously, thats it, cheers.

I aint gonna profess to know a lot about the technical side of music and throw-up any jargon. I am telling you that IMO.....It sounds better on CD.

Vinyl is cool and all that, but to the masses, digital media is more accessible. There will always be a dubplate culture, but if the scene is to gain more exposure and essentially artists gaining more sales and more money, the digital age must be addressed.

[digital]

As far as vinyl being the best format so far, how can you explain CD being so successful for so many years?

because excellence of service is not what dictates the actions of capitalist industries.

and most ppl don't give a shit about anything except being "modern" and not "unusual" so that they don't get ousted by the clan and eaten by wolves and crows.

What?

A slight generalisation here I think.

[metalboxproducts]

@bedward. I would despute you ability to discern the difference between vinyl and cd. Apart from the fact that vinyl has a crackle no matter what system you use. I've been readind articles about that shit for years and despite your technical theory
"if u prefer the transients and pitch-accuracy to be subtly distorted in that way, you're not wrong" I would have to say that digital is better. In theory vinyl can do all the things you state but it still crackles.

[metalboxproducts]

btw: cd's are kind of biodegradable, natural skin acids corrode them.

And so is vinyl. And natural skin acids have a much more detrimental effect on vinyl.

[bedward]

been readind articles about that shit for years and despite your technical theory
"if u prefer the transients and pitch-accuracy to be subtly distorted in that way, you're not wrong" I would have to say that digital is better.

i was specifically referring to mp3.

didn't kno that about vinyl & finger acid. you sure?
thing is, a damaged record still plays, digital dropouts etc are much more horrible.

[bedward]

@bedward. I would despute you ability to discern the difference between vinyl and cd.

why?
you assume too much.

all the same, it's as much about listening fatigue as instantaneous recognition.

[digital]

been readind articles about that shit for years and despite your technical theory
"if u prefer the transients and pitch-accuracy to be subtly distorted in that way, you're not wrong" I would have to say that digital is better.

i was specifically referring to mp3.

didn't kno that about vinyl & finger acid. you sure?
thing is, a damaged record still plays, digital dropouts etc are much more horrible.

What's a digital dropout?

I've never had any problems with my digital tunes, mp3 or wav, where as I've had scratched, warped and weathered vinyl.

[elgato]

jesus prefers analog

[bedward]

I've never had any problems with my digital tunes, mp3 or wav, where as I've had scratched, warped and weathered vinyl.

oh well that proves me wrong then doesn't it!

and, "what's a digital dropout?"
use yr imagination ffs.

it's when the sound drops out.

digital glitches and are far more intrusive than a bit of analog noise or distortion.

you've never heard a cd skip? or just stop altogether?

anyway digital, i said in the first place, it's up to you.
your choice.

[jackquinox]

Its interesting we had a guest lecturer from universal the other day and according to the market standing digital releases accounted for only 12% of the whole market so it only actualey rose by 4% in one year i guess if it keeps doubling then yes they may have a problem with cds but as it stand 88% of people still want some form of hard product.

And on a personal note as the great prophet jehst once said on high plains anthem:

" i love the crackle of the old vinyl......."

[shonky]

Crackle's not a problem to my mind, it's one of those beautiful things about vinyl. It's a far better signifier of good things to come than watching a counter count no matter how more "perfect" the sound is.

Can't explain it, won't justify it, that's how I feel, and that's what counts most towards my enjoyment of the music. Listening to a record's noise, playing tunes I love and hearing those real world imperfections is far more satisfying than an mp3 counter ticking away, no matter what digital fripperies may come to pass.

I will never pay money for an mp3 that's for sure.

[pangaea]

I will never pay money for an mp3 that's for sure.

I'll buy MP3-only releases purely to support the artist, but I'm not keen on paying for MP3s either.

[dusty]

I think its only fair to point out that for many people who dislike the sound of CD, its probably because you don't have a good DAC converting and upsampling the data in the first place - just like vinyl a good deck makes it sing so it is with a CD. Just because its digital info doesn't mean all CD players convert it into analog the same way. A cheap CD player with built-in DAC is going to sound thin and hard on the ears.

Vinyl mastering involves capping the frequency range of the recording anyway so that it can be cut well... and I seem to recall its capped in much the same way as a digital recording, so often its a myth that you will hear a higher range on a wax plate.


I personally think both CD and vinyl are of such good quality sound that the human ear isn't good enough to recognise any problems.

[dirty]

I've never had any problems with my digital tunes, mp3 or wav, where as I've had scratched, warped and weathered vinyl.

oh well that proves me wrong then doesn't it!

and, "what's a digital dropout?"
use yr imagination ffs.

it's when the sound drops out.

digital glitches and are far more intrusive than a bit of analog noise or distortion.

you've never heard a cd skip? or just stop altogether?

anyway digital, i said in the first place, it's up to you.
your choice.

You only get dropout when your digital media is on a physical format such as CD, WAV is a lossless format so therfore can never degrade if it is kept on your hard drive.

The drop out occurs if your physical media is comprimised ie. scratched or damaged. You may not get drop out on vinyl but it sure doesn't play smoothly if you scratch it!

Hence why I always back-up my tunes.

Digital was specifically talk about mp3s and WAVs. As he is a digital DJ mainly playing tunes from a mac book.

Bedward your problem is with CDs and their problems, yes I think you could argue the difference between a 320 mp3 and vinyl, but I really don't think you could tell the difference between a mastered wav and mastered vinyl.

And I wouldn't get too vitriolic when stating your opinions because it just gets people's backs up.

[scoz]

Vinyl mastering involves capping the frequency range of the recording anyway so that it can be cut well... and I seem to recall its capped in much the same way as a digital recording, so often its a myth that you will hear a higher range on a wax plate.

That could be in part due to the fact most masters are digital these days. If you can be bothered there's a big old rant about it here , here, and here

[digital]

I've never had any problems with my digital tunes, mp3 or wav, where as I've had scratched, warped and weathered vinyl.

oh well that proves me wrong then doesn't it!

and, "what's a digital dropout?"
use yr imagination ffs.

it's when the sound drops out.

digital glitches and are far more intrusive than a bit of analog noise or distortion.

you've never heard a cd skip? or just stop altogether?

anyway digital, i said in the first place, it's up to you.
your choice.

I didn't know so I asked....no need to be rude and get on your high and mighty now is there.

I'm not proving you wrong, I'm merely saying that in my experiences with tunes in a digital mp3 or wav format I've had far less problems than I have with vinyl.

Like Dirty said, thats why digital tunes get backed up at least twice, on pc and laptop, so if my CD gets scratched I can just burn off another one.

I want my tunes at the highest quality possible whatever the format. I haven't been using vinyl for all that long so I guess the imperfections of analog noise/interference and distortion stick out like a sore thumb as I'm used to playing 320's and WAV's that don't have this problem.

Course it does depend on how you maintain and look after your CD's and vinyl, because no, I've never had a CD that just stopped alltogether.

[scoz]

On a side note. I find modern CD players far less forgiving about scratches than my pretty ancient one. I've got one, well more than one thats fucked but this one in particular, that would not work on the CD player at work at all ever. I got home thought fuck it I'll have a go on my ancient one and it played it no problem. The thing is I've got ones that are far less knackered that the new cd players refuse to play.