the classic "take a photo of your setup" thread

[Ongelegen]

Ah ok, yeah the earmuffs is a pretty good idea, will act as wind protection, which you'll definitely need. Could use something like the H4n for the P48. The hardest part will be fitting them into the earmuffs, I assume you want to be undercover with this setup.

[deadly_habit]

nah don't need to be undercover haha, i don't mind looking bizarre as hell with a DIY rig if the end results sound good

[Ongelegen]

Ok, still gonna be hard to fit/attach them on the muffs, i don't know the size of the mics but I guess they are around the size of a xlr plug. With a xlr attached it's pretty big, maybe too big to point them the same direction as your ears. Pointing them to the front along the head might work and still give you a pretty spatial stereo image.

[deadly_habit]

grabbed the camera to show ya what i mean
phones are about the size of say hearing protection muffs





now it would be recessed a bit into the headphone, but still stick out like a martian's headset



but if you spliced or just make your own cables you can solder your wires directly to the leads here and have the male xlr connector outside of the muffs say dangling from the back of the muffs, where you can connect your standard xlr cable directly to your field recorder that is in the handy bag dangling from you gear bag (much like a boom mic operators setup in the field)

[nowaysj]

A few thoughts:

You've got that same really thin black flakey shit coming off your headphone pads. I've got a pair of decent/old sonys that do that. I can't even get that shit off in the shower, little flakes just stick to your skin around your ears for like 18 hours. Embarrassing.

Walking around with shooting muffs and an oddly shaped bag may not be the best idea, post 9/11.

With dropping a mic into a headset like this, where does the mic point? Straight out? Why though? Your ear canal is kind of straight out, but you've got all that reflector of your ear directing the sound into the canal, is there a way to replicate this with the direction of the mic, or by using actual reflectors on the muff? Sidenote: I knew a guy in grade school whose name I forget, but we just called him radar, because he had giant, smooth ears, and the guy had absolutely incredible hearing, like he could listen to your conversation all the way across the quad. Wish I had ears like that. /sidenote.

[deadly_habit]

thankfully those are just headphones i use for tracking vocals in booth (or corner with reflection filter) since they have nice isolation, response for the vocalist and i got em cheap

screw post 9/11, besides could get some good recordings of cops that way

as far as truly modeling what you'd hear i think that's why they use the mannequin head method, and i'm sure they have some with accurately modeled human ear canal patterns where the mics are embedded where the ear drum is

i'm just trying to come up with a condenser mic diy solution to get the best sound possible in a diy setting for some simulated stereo imaging

[Ongelegen]

Looks like you got it pretty figured out Deadly, definitely worth a try.

Yeah having the capsules in a earcanal will get you the best results. On my diy dummy head I have them placed just where the ear canal starts. From what i've heard there is very little difference in stereo imaging (posted comparison vs the neumann KU100 in the DIY thread). Also the thing with earcanals is that without decoding the signal it will sound tubey and shit. You'll need to apply match EQ (logic has this if i'm not mistaken) to make the freq response flat again. The neumann has this probably build in i'm guessing. Building an earcanal was not very hard, but I decided against it because I can only apply the match EQ in post, thus cannot monitor during recording.

[charliefoy]

Gonna buy a 27" iMac

[nowaysj]

screw post 9/11, besides could get some good recordings of cops that way

Like, "Sir, stop resisting!!!!" Followed by 72 gun shots. Yeah, another one of those classic recordings.

[charliefoy]

How does everyone use external hard drives? Straight back up or all production based stuff (samples ect) on a separate drive?

[Today]

i have 2
one has a partition for DP project files and another for a backup of my sample library and my masters
the other has a partition for DP project files and another for a backup of my sample library and my masters

i have a third that holds a copy of each of those folders as well as my regular music collection
and a fourth with just my itunes library constantly running through itunes

[RmoniK]

That's actually really interesting. I wonder if people have developed a way to simulate this inside a DAW by using simple panning, reverbs and resonators.

[Ongelegen]

I wonder if people have developed a way to simulate this inside a DAW by using simple panning, reverbs and resonators.

Not really, I would say it's nearly impossible, if not impossible to achieve with FX chains, but I know that there are some plugins which try to replicate the 3D spatialization, like H3D by Longcat, which seems to be one the best. Thb I haven't tried it so can't really say how good it works, but real binaural recordings are better imo.

[therapist]

I wonder if people have developed a way to simulate this inside a DAW by using simple panning, reverbs and resonators.

Not really, I would say it's nearly impossible, if not impossible to achieve with FX chains, but I know that there are some plugins which try to replicate the 3D spatialization, like H3D by Longcat, which seems to be one the best. Thb I haven't tried it so can't really say how good it works, but real binaural recordings are better imo.

Simulating the ear is one of the main things that makes binaural so effective. I don't see how that could be simulated with a plug-in, and I don't see how Deadly Habit's headphone-mic thing is achieving that at all?

[Ongelegen]

True, but just by using 2 omni mics which just barely simulate the position of human ears you can get pretty nice spatial recordings. Obviously it isn't 100% binaural, but there still is pretty strong sense of the direction of the sound source and it's distance.

[therapist]

True, but just by using 2 omni mics which just barely simulate the position of human ears you can get pretty nice spatial recordings. Obviously it isn't 100% binaural, but there still is pretty strong sense of the direction of the sound source and it's distance.

Really. How will a pair of omni mics perceive a sound at x angle to the front and to the back of the head differently?

Deadly may have covered this, I don't know. It just didn't look from those pictures like this method will be 3D as opposed to 2D. ie. the head itself is simulated, but that surely only provides left/right separation while the front/back and up/down separation that we hear ourselves comes largely from our ears.

[Ongelegen]

True, but just by using 2 omni mics which just barely simulate the position of human ears you can get pretty nice spatial recordings. Obviously it isn't 100% binaural, but there still is pretty strong sense of the direction of the sound source and it's distance.

Really. How will a pair of omni mics perceive a sound at x angle to the front and to the back of the head differently?

Deadly may have covered this, I don't know. It just didn't look from those pictures like this method will be 3D as opposed to 2D. ie. the head itself is simulated, but that surely only provides left/right separation while the front/back and up/down separation that we hear ourselves comes largely from our ears.

If the mics are at an angle of 180 degree from each other then it will be 3D, because human ears are at the same angle. Refections and delays between the two signals (left and right ear/mic) are the key to our ability to localize a sound source. The ears are just replaced with mics when recording. As long as they are approximately at the same angle and distance from each other then it will be percieved as 3D when listening back on headphone, as these give you total separation in left and right channels. I don't know the fine facts of how the front/back and up/down separations are percieved but I guess it's the same principle of reflections and delayed signals.

[therapist]

True, but just by using 2 omni mics which just barely simulate the position of human ears you can get pretty nice spatial recordings. Obviously it isn't 100% binaural, but there still is pretty strong sense of the direction of the sound source and it's distance.

Really. How will a pair of omni mics perceive a sound at x angle to the front and to the back of the head differently?

Deadly may have covered this, I don't know. It just didn't look from those pictures like this method will be 3D as opposed to 2D. ie. the head itself is simulated, but that surely only provides left/right separation while the front/back and up/down separation that we hear ourselves comes largely from our ears.

If the mics are at an angle of 180 degree from each other then it will be 3D, because human ears are at the same angle. Refections and delays between the two signals (left and right ear/mic) are the key to our ability to localize a sound source. The ears are just replaced with mics when recording. As long as they are approximately at the same angle and distance from each other then it will be percieved as 3D when listening back on headphone, as these give you total separation in left and right channels. I don't know the fine facts of how the front/back and up/down separations are percieved but I guess it's the same principle of reflections and delayed signals.

I was referring to the left/right imaging as 2D because it is without the front/back and up/down separation. Imagine that diagram without the ears, why would a sound at 60 degrees to the back-left sound any different to 60 degrees to the front-left? That's what I mean by 3D.

Re: the bolded section, this only allows us to localize a sound source between left and right surely. The ears add the next dimension. One mic can't (as far as I can work out) give you a stereo image- front and back on one side, as opposed to left and right- without another variable in there.

Unless you didn't really mean 180*, then there would be someway to distinguish dimensions other than left/right.

[Ongelegen]

I know exactly what you mean I just don't know how else to explain it so i've made a quick and dirty recording of me crumpling a piece of paper while turning 360 degrees around the setup.

Setup: small headphones modified to mics. The black dot on the pad is the right mic, left side is identical. No ears, no head and just 2 mics, so this is no true binaural recording, merely a spatial one. Yet you can clearly hear (on headphones), unless there is something wrong with me, the paper crumple starts in front turning to the left ear, going to the back of "your head", turns to the right and as last comes back in front.



Soundcloud

EDIT: player isn't working for me somehow, clicking on the link works though, so listen on SC if you have the same problem.

[docrasta]

new to the forum, so i thought id show and tell right along with all of you.

running pro tools 8 on a g5 power pc, digi 003 rack, rane eq, presonus pre amp, and a BGH? amp. genelec and jbl 4208 monitors, with a nice vega floor set for reference. an mpc 2000xl and a table are in the back there with the axiom pro 49 being my controller.

saving for the intel mac upgrade, can't wait!

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... =1&theater