An afterlife theory from a different standpoint

[helix]

The first time I had ever heard anything about Waking Life was also my first acid trip. That was a very hard few minutes to watch.

[parson]

you should see before sunrise. waking life references it.

[knell]

yay, movies... looks like i wont be sleeping much tonight

[mcpable]

Love Waking Life, it's my favorite movie. That's one of the best scenes from it as well. The first time I watched it, I was astounded because the large majority of topics being discussed were already things I had thought about at one time or another, even really specific things. It's amazing hearing your abstract thoughts being put into succinct dialogue and played out by surreal undulating dream characters.
I recommend it very highly

Waking Life is the only movie besides Big Lebowski that I've had the desire to watch more than once... and Big Lebowski I've seen a few times, but Waking Life I've watched many times, and also have re-read parts of the script several times -- there's just so much wisdom in it (you can find the script on google).

A couple quotes that I think sort of relate to this thread:

"I think metaphysics is good if it improves everyday life; otherwise forget it."
"Metaphysics is a restaurant where they give you a thirty thousand page menu, and no food."
-Robert M. Pirsig

Basically there's no point in spending too much time thinking about it, because whatever happens happens. HOWEVER I think that if you are like TOTALLY depressed when you die / have a negative outlook about everything you die in a SHITTY/negative way... like I dunno, thinking that "I'm gonna suffer and feel like ass for the rest of eternity... Ahh...!!!" as you fade off into nothingness. Whereas if you were positive about everything and your life that you have led so far, you fade away with a positive mindset: "I have done my best with what I was given, and have had a positive impact on the world, !!"

[lloydnoise]

cool thread

xarcane, i think that idea doesn't need something like DMT to work. All religion is metaphor imo, heaven and hell are the same and surely all complex human minds are burdened with thoughts of their life as they die which would either make you feel good or terrible depending on how you lived. seems pretty intuitive to me..

I like to think of my conscious mind as a fragment of the universe's ego, when we die those fragments rejoin the main brain (brane? ) in the sky
like a never ending track that keeps sampling itself

[-dubson-]

Big thread. Can't put much input in don't know enough about the subject. I do love that scene in Waking Life though, although a lot goes over my head.

[noam]

you should see before sunrise. waking life references it.

will do

[2manynoobs]

just enjoy life to the fullest, love and be loved in return, never let anything or anyone control you and never, ever be afraid

[Alty]

Doesn't make sense from an evolutionary view point.

Only from that of hope.

[Mutiny]

Im posting in order to remind myself to read this tommorow. Interesting thread!

[SunkLo]

Doesn't make sense from an evolutionary view point.

Only from that of hope.

How does it conflict with evolution in any way?

[noam]

Doesn't make sense from an evolutionary view point.

Only from that of hope.

How does it conflict with evolution in any way?

fear of danger, harm and death are pretty central to evolutionary theory, i assume?

[SunkLo]

But it's a post-death experience. There's plenty of other chemicals pre-death that help you try to avoid it but once the deed is done...

[noam]

well from that point of view you could argue there would be no evolutionary value in any post-death experience-enhancing chemicals based on the same logic? the way the brain works after death from a perspectival point of view still unknown isn't it

im just playing devils advocate here, but i dont subscribe to to anything of which so little is known

try watching this, i didnt rate it at all though, thought most of em were chattin shit tbh but was quite interesting

http://www.documentary-log.com/d183-the-day-i-died/

[SunkLo]

Yeah I get what you mean about it not being supported by evolution, not in direct conflict with it either though. Lot of things can't really be given an evolutionary purpose, for instance dreams, which are reportedly related to the pineal gland. I guess it could be said they help us test mental constructs, but that probably wouldn't be a product of evolution. As it is, the body requires paralysis to impair the confused dreamer from harming themselves in reality.

To debate the presence of an afterlife or collective consciousness, you'd have to contemplate the seed of consciousness itself. It could be considered an extension of cognitive process, which could be considered an extension of survival instinct. Perception rationalized as an advanced survival tool, right? So I suppose, continuing along that thread, dreams could be called an extension of reality and consciousness, which would make it a short stretch to assume that any form of consciousness or perception before or after life could also be treated as a same kind of extension.

Interested to hear what the people of the Secret Ninja Philosopher's Club think.

[mcpable]

This is worth watching:



In that video Joe Rogan talks about DMT and death etc. ... like how if we don't sleep we eventually go crazy and die, so there is something important about what dreaming and the release of DMT does to the brain... pretty interesting.

[mcpable]

It's possible that we enter a (perceptually-) eternal dreamlike state after death, but this can't be the case for people who die in explosions or plane/automobile crashes and have their bodies and brains completely destroyed very quickly, and therefore have no workable brain left for DMT to do its thing.

[noam]

Yeah I get what you mean about it not being supported by evolution, not in direct conflict with it either though. Lot of things can't really be given an evolutionary purpose, for instance dreams, which are reportedly related to the pineal gland. I guess it could be said they help us test mental constructs, but that probably wouldn't be a product of evolution. As it is, the body requires paralysis to impair the confused dreamer from harming themselves in reality.

To debate the presence of an afterlife or collective consciousness, you'd have to contemplate the seed of consciousness itself. It could be considered an extension of cognitive process, which could be considered an extension of survival instinct. Perception rationalized as an advanced survival tool, right? So I suppose, continuing along that thread, dreams could be called an extension of reality and consciousness, which would make it a short stretch to assume that any form of consciousness or perception before or after life could also be treated as a same kind of extension.

Interested to hear what the people of the Secret Ninja Philosopher's Club think.

just a point, thats the same thing Descartes said was the physical place where the soul connected to the body. As of today all scientific speculation about the pineal gland is speculation isn't it? i was under the impression it was C17th bollocks!

Edit: its where melatonin is produced.

in another point, a study was done on animals where the scientists blocked the chemical the brain releases, to paralyse the body whilst dreaming. Cats that were asleep acted out their dreams in real time, most of them just acted out mundane tasks, cleaning, hunting etc.

there are also some people who have a degenerative disease in their brain, which attacks the place where paralysis is controlled during dreaming, again, they are seen to act out their dreams, some of it is quite disturbing, but at the same time some of it quite mundane. the whole thing is interesting anyway, i cant remember where i saw it, i'll find it and post it up!

edit 2: http://www.documentary-log.com/d273-why-do-we-dream/

[2manynoobs]

This is worth watching:



In that video Joe Rogan talks about DMT and death etc. ... like how if we don't sleep we eventually go crazy and die, so there is something important about what dreaming and the release of DMT does to the brain... pretty interesting.

that made my day haha

[lloydnoise]

just enjoy life to the fullest, love and be loved in return, never let anything or anyone control you and never, ever be afraid

DAT IZ WELL GAY