Horizon: Science Under Attack

[noam]

i dont buy a lot of those 'not profitable' arguments, if modern society shows us anything its that anything can be 'controlled' and sold - its just a matter of time.

psychology?? we pay for thoughts now.

[christophera]

cannibis is not as profitable as prozac or about 1,000 other pharmaceuticals that are unnecessary

[noam]

there's loads of things which aren't as profitable as other products in medicine and health care

i just dont necessarily buy that the reason alternative medicines aren't sold is because they aren't profitable. if they can make unnecessary medicines (in your words) marketable then they could make alternative medicines marketable. in a respect its already started to happen over the last decade or two with more and more alternative therapies and medicines/health supplements finding their ways into supermarkets/pharmacys/health shops

[christophera]

its about having the market cornered so you can control who gets the money

[noam]

yeah ok i definitely get that

manufactured medicine is 10x easier to control in that respect certainly

[test_recordings]

Medical companies also sponsor 'education' programs for doctors so they know how to use THEIR drugs, as it's also the same companies that conduct all the testing of products they like to make 'unique' compounds that are therefore patentable meaning they can create a monopoly on certain conditions ('ours is best for heart disease' etc) but also means natural, unpatentable compounds are not tested as they are unprofitable for the companies testing them. Recently the Indian government overturned a patent by a drug company claiming the spice turmeric as its own product for use on inflammation even though it has been in use in the country for that purpose for 1,000s of years.
EDIT: also companies modify compounds with patents about to expire in a way that makes them a tiny bit different and therefore unique for patenting purposes even though they are no more effective to justify a cost of 10x more.

I think their should be a national testing centre for verifying commercial compounds and also more funding to university biochemistry departments as well as more multi-disciplinary research in to health. That way you can have greater gurantee of impartiality, accuracy and cheaper medicines.

[noam]

it certainly seems like more and more people are coming to at least appreciate the view that money and profit are generally bad things in the current economic format

both Zeitgeist and that article Alphacat posted are seemingly expressive of the growing resentment towards being fucked over for absolutely no end gain whatsoever... i like this.

[test_recordings]

Capitalism is another form of slavery, like feudalism with gambling...

[christophera]

also i haven't watched this episode but the one about reality was dope and i know you all heard me saying i told you so in your heads the whole time!

It's not an original concept though, many philosophers have been asking the same question for thousands of years. They may not have had the knowledge we do now* but the questions were still pondered.


*which doesn't even answer the question but raises more

also wait 30 years and see how holographic the universe is...

my guess is the maths will have gone further and gotten more abstract, and we will have found another equally abstract and in some ways meaningless ascription of 'the truth about reality'

eventually we won't be able to describe the world around us in any other way than by referral to mathematical ideas. in just the same way some philosophy genuinely loses meaning without the prerequisite logic, the physics won't mean anything without the maths. we've probably been at that stage for time anyway...

i agree that the universe is numbers and a deeper understanding of math is at the core of all knowledge

[magma]

Maths is the only universal language. If it can be proven with Maths, it shall be believed.

[christophera]

you should try enochian.

[magma]

Enochian is a name often applied to an occult or angelic language recorded in the private journals of John Dee and his seer Edward Kelley in the late 16th century. The men claimed that it was revealed to them by angels.

Yeah... maybe not. It doesn't sound likely to tell me why the square of a hypoteneuse is equal to the sum of the squares of the other two sides quite as clearly as maths.

Keep hitting the pipe and convincing yourself you have a clue, Christopher.

[christophera]

keep scoffing at shit that goes way over your head

[nousd]

^ and so disappears *into the night*

and Sloptroph needs a rewind for his reference to rancidity:

...coconut, palm oil, peanut/groundnut and ghee (indian clarified butter) are the best to use in cooking because they don't get damaged so much by heating...(for) dishes that don't need cooking then mono-unsaturated ones are probably better, like Olive and Almond, as they are less likely to go rancid...

[test_recordings]

^ and so disappears *into the night*

and Sloptroph needs a rewind for his reference to rancidity:

...coconut, palm oil, peanut/groundnut and ghee (indian clarified butter) are the best to use in cooking because they don't get damaged so much by heating...(for) dishes that don't need cooking then mono-unsaturated ones are probably better, like Olive and Almond, as they are less likely to go rancid...

Wasn't that me that said that? Regarding mono-unsaturated oils I meant that that they're better over polyunsaturated oils because polysats. go rancid quickly (apart from sesame oil with its high proportion of sesamol). Of course you still need to store the mono-unsaturated oils in optimal conditions as determined by the type of substance constituting the oil is affected by the environment in different ways, e.g. olive oil goes off rapids when you leave it in sunlight as it kills the chloroplasts that give it the green colour (and also a good source of chlorophyll that acts like vitamin D for processing calcium within the body, eating your greens is like eating sunshine in that respect).

Anything else?

[nousd]

sorry Testes
found your "rant" very informative
not enough peebs look after oil properly.
Interesting about the chlorophyl in olive oil...

One question:
They're using a lot of cotton seed oil here now in fish'n'chip shops.
I seem to recall some being contaminated awhile back.
What's the word on it's use for human consumption?

[test_recordings]

Testes? I'm not Spanish mate :p To be honest with you I don't know a lot about it so I avoid it, I was buying a pickle that was preserved with but I stopped because I was unsure. Long-chain fatty acid anyway though, your liver has to work on that shit but you could add an acid or alcohol to the meal to aid digestion.

[nousd]

how does acid (vinegar?) or alcohol (red wine?) help?
by breaking down and making easier to digest?
please explain the process
is it the same as marinading protein?

[test_recordings]

-Ish. Fat is soluble in acids and alcohol. Try squeezing some lemon or vinegar on butter/ghee or olive oil and watch what happens. Its also why the general order of salad dressing is vinegar then olive oil (or is it the other way around?) so they don't cross-tabulate in an un-culinarily pleasing way

[the wiggle baron]

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