Nu-Dubstep

[feasible_weasel]

Anyone written any groundbreaking tunes during the duration of this thread?

Weaselstep on the way

[xor]

Anyone written any groundbreaking tunes during the duration of this thread?

Weaselstep on the way

Go to it Weasible!

[feasible_weasel]

Anyone written any groundbreaking tunes during the duration of this thread?

Weaselstep on the way

Go to it Weasible!

[feasible_weasel]

there done
best 5mins of my time yet
http://www.zshare.net/audio/52337306a07ba6/

[shonky]

...I said that loads of people are creating diverse stuff but it is swamped by expectation of what dubstep SHOULD sound like by a misinformed public which is growing due to the crossover appeal of a section of the sound.

The original dubstep producers created a different sound by following their own vision and influences, newer producers are now concerned about making dubstep. Best thing to do is include what you want in your productions, support the artists that you rate and ignore the ones you don't, and don't worry about the new folks - if it gets too predictable, the heads will move elsewhere and start something new, or maybe the newcomers might be inspired and take it somewhere else.

Just means that the big regular nights are going to be a bit oversubscribed, but then if you look to the smaller nights or start your own, you can take it where you want. In a way dissatisfaction with the path of a lot of dubstep has opened up far more interesting possibilities to me, why not add in broken beat, jungle, house rhythms, glitch loops, etc. If you're not hearing what you wanna hear, then make it and start getting it out there to dj's

[billy blanks]

i think there's great value in what HEDFUKKAH is saying personally, if i understand what he is saying. garage as and when it was, was always quite explicitly put forward as one or more of its own sub-genres. whether it be 2-step, 4X4, speed, bassline, US and so on, these taxonomies were quite liberally used, and in my opinion in an informative way, rather than acting as a restriction on producers. these days the variation within dubstep makes the name dubstep almost redundant as a term, and when i'm asked about a tune, or what i like, i find myself having to quite extensively detail what type of dubstep (and usually more importantly detailing what type of dubstep it isnt). its obviously a tricky one cos you dont want over delineate to some ridiculous level, but a balance exists and i certainly dont think the term dubstep represents that balance.

i also look forward to the day when people actually at least attempt to attentively read what a person has said before replying on this forum, though it may be a hopeless wait.

[spender]

i find myself having to quite extensively detail what type of dubstep (and usually more importantly detailing what type of dubstep it isnt).

Why?! Who insists on this level of detail?

[billy blanks]

i find myself having to quite extensively detail what type of dubstep (and usually more importantly detailing what type of dubstep it isnt).

Why?! Who insists on this level of detail?

if someone told me they like techno, i would naturally ask what sort; minimal, wonky, jacking, detroit, hard, acid, downtempo and so on. similarly, with garage as i mentioned before. similarly with house, drum'n'bass, and most formed dance music genres. and similarly again with more traditional forms of music; jazz, african etc. given the variety that exists within dubstep, a level of variation which is analogous to other dance genres, for me it seems appropriate to be able to sub-define, to the benefit of both listener and producer (the latter being for reasons hedfukkah was alluding to). i really do feel it would make the variety that exists significantly more accessible (making production of such variety potentially more appealing), and would help to highlight the history and lineage which defines current productions, much in the same way the sub-genres of garage did for garage productions (well for me anyway!).

on another note, to those of the viewpoint "oh stop moaning just listen to the music etc"; i really dont think anyone in this thread is idly whinging. if i come across that way i dont mean to, rather just making observations which i think are worth reflecting on, and fair do's if you dont think they are.

[osk]

i find myself having to quite extensively detail what type of dubstep (and usually more importantly detailing what type of dubstep it isnt).

Why?! Who insists on this level of detail?

if someone told me they like techno, i would naturally ask what sort; minimal, wonky, jacking, detroit, hard, acid, downtempo and so on. similarly, with garage as i mentioned before. similarly with house, drum'n'bass, and most formed dance music genres. and similarly again with more traditional forms of music; jazz, african etc. given the variety that exists within dubstep, a level of variation which is analogous to other dance genres, for me it seems appropriate to be able to sub-define, to the benefit of both listener and producer (the latter being for reasons hedfukkah was alluding to). i really do feel it would make the variety that exists significantly more accessible (making production of such variety potentially more appealing), and would help to highlight the history and lineage which defines current productions, much in the same way the sub-genres of garage did for garage productions (well for me anyway!).

on another note, to those of the viewpoint "oh stop moaning just listen to the music etc"; i really dont think anyone in this thread is idly whinging. if i come across that way i dont mean to, rather just making observations which i think are worth reflecting on, and fair do's if you dont think they are.

You own this thread my man. I agree 100%.

[billy blanks]

i find myself having to quite extensively detail what type of dubstep (and usually more importantly detailing what type of dubstep it isnt).

Why?! Who insists on this level of detail?

if someone told me they like techno, i would naturally ask what sort; minimal, wonky, jacking, detroit, hard, acid, downtempo and so on. similarly, with garage as i mentioned before. similarly with house, drum'n'bass, and most formed dance music genres. and similarly again with more traditional forms of music; jazz, african etc. given the variety that exists within dubstep, a level of variation which is analogous to other dance genres, for me it seems appropriate to be able to sub-define, to the benefit of both listener and producer (the latter being for reasons hedfukkah was alluding to). i really do feel it would make the variety that exists significantly more accessible (making production of such variety potentially more appealing), and would help to highlight the history and lineage which defines current productions, much in the same way the sub-genres of garage did for garage productions (well for me anyway!).

on another note, to those of the viewpoint "oh stop moaning just listen to the music etc"; i really dont think anyone in this thread is idly whinging. if i come across that way i dont mean to, rather just making observations which i think are worth reflecting on, and fair do's if you dont think they are.

You own this thread my man. I agree 100%.

if thats the case you should be asking permission to post in it sonny!!

[chunkie]

The original dubstep producers created a different sound by following their own vision and influences........... maybe the newcomers might be inspired and take it somewhere else..............
In a way dissatisfaction with the path of a lot of dubstep has opened up far more interesting possibilities to me, why not add in broken beat, jungle, house rhythms, glitch loops, etc. If you're not hearing what you wanna hear, then make it and start getting it out there to dj's

bang on Shonky!

dubstep caught my attention because of the inventiveness and creativity, people will fall into the trap of 'making dubstep' as opposed to making music which happens to fall within the genre of dubstep

categories can be useful but also leads to a sense of elitism and pigeon-holing
"as in what d'ya mean kode9 has done a soul-step track i thought hes a tech-stepper"
exactly what happens in d'n'b when people try and get out of their cubby hole

i think the risk is that the creative producers become stifled by the categorisation, because within the categories themselves said producers get elevated to demi-god status and its easier for them (plus probably more lucrative with consistent bookings etc) to keep doing what they are doing

eg dj zinc
hes a brilliant producer and very creative but by the same token he can knock out a dnb roller blinfolded and everyone loves him.. so he ends up doing this a lot!

[spender]

Garage was different. Producers generally stuck to a style. You rarely had a 2-step producer making a bassline/speed garage/US style tune etc so the categorisation kind of worked. The big difference with dubstep is the variety of styles you'll get from a single producer on a single EP. Look at Benga's Invasion EP or the Skreamizms. That brilliant diversity just didn't exist with garage producers and that's what makes dubstep so fresh (for me anyway).

Likewise with labels. DMZ, Deep Medi, Hyperdub etc focus purely on quality and diversity, not a style or a sound. That's what defines them. Not a name like 'deep' 'organic' or god forbid 'intelligent'.

And likewise with the nights, big or small - DMZ still puts out unpredictable line ups, Platform 1 represents a brilliantly diverse array of sounds and Box of Dub rocked down to sheer quality and diversity of sounds all night. Anyone disimissing recent nights as all wobble and rewinds should've checked this (there was a criminally short aftermath thread buried under the weight of the FWD mud slinging).

The minute you can put things in boxes, they become much less interesting. I completely agree with Shonky, the only categories you need are stuff you like and stuff you don't. The fact that so much dubstep (whether it's producers, labels or nights) is hard to categorise is surely a reason to be cheerful isn't it Mr Blanks?

[billy blanks]

Garage was different. Producers generally stuck to a style. You rarely had a 2-step producer making a bassline/speed garage/US style tune etc so the categorisation kind of worked. The big difference with dubstep is the variety of styles you'll get from a single producer on a single EP. Look at Benga's Invasion EP or the Skreamizms. That brilliant diversity just didn't exist with garage producers and that's what makes dubstep so fresh (for me anyway).

Likewise with labels. DMZ, Deep Medi, Hyperdub etc focus purely on quality and diversity, not a style or a sound. That's what defines them. Not a name like 'deep' 'organic' or god forbid 'intelligent'.

And likewise with the nights, big or small - DMZ still puts out unpredictable line ups, Platform 1 represents a brilliantly diverse array of sounds and Box of Dub rocked down to sheer quality and diversity of sounds all night. Anyone disimissing recent nights as all wobble and rewinds should've checked this (there was a criminally short aftermath thread buried under the weight of the FWD mud slinging).

The minute you can put things in boxes, they become much less interesting. I completely agree with Shonky, the only categories you need are stuff you like and stuff you don't. The fact that so much dubstep (whether it's producers, labels or nights) is hard to categorise is surely a reason to be cheerful isn't it Mr Blanks?

you're right, garage was different, and you're right to mention that there wasnt much cross-subgenre productions (barring few producers). i guess alot of this comes down to what we take to mean sub-definitions and how they would manifest themselves in reality, and also subjective opinions on how we both think producers would react to them. i guess i also have strongly in mind the techno world, where genres are (sometimes to an absurd level!) sub-defined, but where nevertheless some producers (usually the top producers) create the most diverse techno; say mathew jonson, mathew dear, alex smoke et al make music ranging from the most minimal to the most 'maximal'. my feeling is that such catergorisation would not restrain the more innovative and creative producers in dubstep, and would provide a more appealing platform for other producers to create differeing styles of dubstep, as they would be aware that punters would be more easily and better informed, increasing accessibility to a style which previously may have been unviable/too risky.

again you're right to mention the labels, and i not for one minute would suggest that labels should be defined by subgenres. i guess it comes back to how these sub-genres were termed and used.

and i'm never cheerful! (although i am enjoying a reasoned discussion for once, without anyone flying off the handle and looking to jook someone in the face cos they're haters of the scene and the music )

[human?]

the map is not the territory.




















and music (and pretty much everything) grows like trees. branches extend...... and leaves fall off.... but they grow back

[*grand*]

educate.. just takes a little conversation.....

[primate]

Dubstep is in itself an amalgamation of several styles and influences. so whatever. music is music and we shouldn't give a rats ass what label it falls into or who's listening to it. you like it or you don't. end ov.

[human?]

Dubstep is in itself an amalgamation of several styles and influences.

thats the problem i think tho.... if there is a problem that is...

Dubstep isnt actually a "thing" in itself... its a abstraction...

and its def the vagueness of the abstraction that i think has attracted the heads...

i mean, its essentially a description of a range of frequency of oscillation...

140 bpm (or thereabout)... heavy in the lows (maybe? or maybe not )... and besides that totally abstract, to the heads...

i do think however that certain musics "catch on" at certain times AND in certain places because they resonate somehow with people (make them dance & feel good) .... so the attention "dubstep" is getting is because the MUSIC that the term loosely describes is "in tune" (which imho, is actually not 140 at all, but 280... having done a serious speed increase, only SEEMS to be 140 )

sooooo like its been pointed out in this thread, the term Dubstep is basically a press release a way to sell the sound, which is what needs to get done to sell it... which is def not altogether a bad thing whatsoever, its how we work, how we navigate chaos, by drawing maps
..

so whatever. music is music and we shouldn't give a rats ass what label it falls into or who's listening to it. you like it or you don't. end ov.

i think deconstructing genre in convos like these is healthy...

but i also think "Dubstep" is one of the more usefull abstractions (genres) due to its vagueness... ima borrow from TC Izlam & KRS One and say..

Dub is vibe, Step is the move... seems to sum up how i feel about the beats..

[chilinindrin]

that´s really what it´s gonna happen if we don,t say anything .
producers outta the scene it´s copying tha sound...
watch out britney´s frakshoW!

[incyde]

All this talk is nice to take up our time but won't really get anyone any scene or any movement anywhere further than they are. It's just all talk!!

I'm gonna use the time instead to learn how to use Logic. byeeeeeee

[contakt]

All this talk is nice to take up our time but won't really get anyone any scene or any movement anywhere further than they are. It's just all talk!!

I'm gonna use the time instead to learn how to use Logic. byeeeeeee

You speak the truth.