alex jones worshippers. this is for you. MASSIVE rant.

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j_j
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Post by j_j » Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:50 am

Shonky wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy

Quite interesting and (I think) pretty balanced view on the various conspiracies. Thought these last two paragraphs were pretty interesting

"There are psychological explanations for why conspiracy theories are so seductive. Academics who study them argue that they meet a basic human need: to have the magnitude of any given effect be balanced by the magnitude of the cause behind it. A world in which tiny causes can have huge consequences feels scary and unreliable. Therefore a grand disaster like Sept. 11 needs a grand conspiracy behind it.

'We tend to associate major events — a President or princess dying — with major causes,' says Patrick Leman, a lecturer in psychology at Royal Holloway University of London, who has conducted studies on conspiracy belief. 'If we think big events like a President being assassinated can happen at the hands of a minor individual, that points to the unpredictability and randomness of life and unsettles us.' In that sense, the idea that there is a malevolent controlling force orchestrating global events is, in a perverse way, comforting"

we know.
Although the direct questions are there...so conspiracy really isnt the key word.
the cops are all over tube stations to control 'football' crowds with assault rifles,these things are happening.
i think a lot of you are undermining.
wrap your head in tin foil to block out the messages.
:D
Last edited by j_j on Wed Jun 06, 2007 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

j_j
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Post by j_j » Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:59 am

Parson wrote:its not a matter of buying into anything

the amount of evidence is so overwhelming that to ignore it or dismiss it is irrational and akin to stuffing your fingers in your ears and yelling la la la

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Post by doomstep » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:27 am

showguns wrote:
doomstep wrote:^^^

wat r u on showguns, do you only have disscussions with pre-determined outcomes perhaps?
what.
nvm - penny dropped, yr smily was a paranoia ting yh.


So yh, the evidence is overwhelming, it takes more of an effort to ignore than to aknowledge it.

The point I've been tryna make is people know things arent right, they did long before google video & they will after its gone.

The point of politics, of bein politically aware is, what next? It isnt political until its entered the public arena.

I know why der are armed police on the streets of 'civilised' nations - but the rule of law has been erroded to such an extent that most citizens are un-aware of their rights.

I think effective propaganda rests on making people aware of the little things (like the rule of law, the duty of government etc. etc.) - not tryna create grand narratives of corruption.

'Here is a group is trying to do one thing - & that is, to get into the future'

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Post by doomstep » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:32 am

oh, and at the end of the day, I think the important things are induvidual
morality & ethics.

Once these things are abandoned for 'the greater good' or any other reason we quiklly find ourselves in the mess we're in now.

Rebuliding community is prob the most radical course of action at present.

That and learning to trust our instincts - dont believe the hype. 'We' are not inherantlly corrupt, scandelous & evil beasts - we only allow ourselves & each other to act in these ways. The question there is why & who benefits.

edit:

Singapore airport is scariest place on earth - blacked out guys with heavy guns everywhere - you know that H.S.T line about Vegas beein wat the whole world would be like if the sizan hadda won the war - fuck that, this is it. This is the future & I dont like it.

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Post by human? » Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:34 pm

alex jones is a awesome character.

my main points that i dont feel him on are..

1. Nationalism. the nation state is dead. it has nothing (well not nothing, but yeah nothing) to do with a secret cabal of elite satan worhsippers. its communications technologies. so while Alex wants to save this country, i say good riddance.. New World Order? nah, New World CHAOS. and its gonna be beautiful.

2. The Occult. there is absoultely nothing intrinsicly wrong with Occult. Jesus was a cool dude imo, but who am i to say worshipping a giant owl statue is fundamentally "wrong"... eating children? taht shit is wrong, but ima place a guess that more practicing "Christians" (some wine & wafers anyone?) get down like that than Occultists.. Jones' rants against "pagan" ideas are reactionary indoctrinated garbage.

3. Any God without worshippers ceases to exist. meaning, the more power you give to "The Powers That Be", the more they have over you, when imo, the wealthy elite are totally disorganized and work primarily for individual gains, destroy one another frequently, and have no set goals and are basically tryin to figure out what they can do to hang onto their power in the face of the inevitable.


that said, Jones is a fascinating media character. via public access, radio, internet radio, websites & dvds, he has created a epic mythology. i respect that he has done it all on his own, independent of all traditional media, and it should be inspiration for anyone who has ideas they feel need to be conveyed. Jones is a wonderful example of exactly why we are going to actually fix things, its because we are able to talk about them... and come up with ideas, and problem solve. and share.

Conspiracy "theory" is def the holistic approach. its what happens when you are bombarded with info, rather than a linear typographical mechanical man approach, we recognize patterns to try and comprehend what we are seeing, and imo, it works better than books ever did. its a new style of thought, in its infancy, but time is also changing, so its growing up fast :) thinking in hypertext is the move...




Noam Chomsky is boring, refuses to address critical issues, has (imho) a very obnoxious condescending psuedo intellectual tone to everything ive ever read or heard.

dont get it twisted, Chomsky also makes $$ running around talking shit, its his profession.


i also didnt listen or watch any of the links or videos, havent been able to really vibe with this topic for over a year now, my 2001- 2005 immersion into Para Politics has left me disgusted with the whole thing...


the REAL solution is us, music is the weapon of the future.

one
human?

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Post by shonky » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:34 pm

J_J wrote:'we know.
Although the direct questions are there...so conspiracy really isnt the key word.
the cops are all over tube stations to control 'football' crowds with assault rifles,these things are happening.
i think a lot of you are undermining.
wrap your head in tin foil to block out the messages.
:D
Disagreeing with a theory and ignoring it are completely different things. If theories don't stack up they deserve skepticism.
Hmm....

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:31 pm

there's tons of aliens evidence

tons

it gets more credible all the time

watch the vids

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:34 pm

doomstep wrote: 'Here is a group is trying to do one thing - & that is, to get into the future'
hahah i used to have windows play that sample when i turned my computer on like 10 years ago

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Post by seckle » Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:56 pm

i was using chomsky as an example of people that've pulled the card on alex jones. i'm not a chomsky worshipper by a long shot. he's got some fascinating ideas, but at times he too starts getting a bit blinded by his own manifesto.
the answer is reading widely and seeing all angles. people in this thread claiming that infowars is factual miss the point ENTIRELY.
if you give a set of commonly acknowledged events to mickey mouse, and ask him to connect the dot's and come up with an interpretation, he'll do it. it might be well assembled, but is his interpretation factual? of course not.
none of us will ever know what really happened with 9/11 and the pentagon. blindly subscribing to one formula regarding it leaves you crippled to deal with it's consequences.
conspiracy culture presumes that there's always a darkside to every issue. it's almost like religious fervor. in one sense you get trapped by your own gulibility. you sit in the conspiracy box and wall yourself in.
our society is filled with extreme thinking. religions are filled with extreme thinking. the way forward is rational ingenuous thought.

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:13 pm

watch the vids

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:24 pm


pk-
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Post by pk- » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:36 pm

the WTC video zomby posted is just like the alex jones one about 7/7; some interesting stuff, a few strange coincidences and quite a bit of jumping to conclusions.

there's a great deal of things in the video recordings that can be interpreted in completely different ways. the "squib explosions" you can see bursting from the windows and the pulverisation of the concrete, for example - i'd have thought that several thousand tons of tumbling upper floors bearing down on the rest of the building would a) atomise anything directly below it and b) send the atomised material spraying out of any available space. having said that, i can see how to others it would appear to be demolition charges and evidence of high explosive, but can't help thinking that you have to want to believe it in order to see it. watch any video of any building being demolished by controlled explosion. the most obvious evidence of the explosives being detonated are the visible shockwaves in the building's structure - why were none seen on either of the twin towers before they collapsed?

just like TerrorStorm the eyewitness accounts of people inside or around the buildings are used, which are tempered by shock, terror and confusion. also as in TerrorStorm, some of the video's evidence contradicts itself. the businesswoman's recording of the bangs, for instance; if she's however many floors up in a seperate building, how would her dictaphone pick up a bang from the subterranean explosion that the video asserts took place?

the collapse of building 7 is probably the most intriguing thing about the video, but the oddness of its collapse doesn't make it a concrete fact that it was deliberately demolished.

also, the quote Shonky posted from wikipedia is a sentiment i've agreed with for a while; that the idea of an internal conspiracy in your country's government is a much more comforting one than that of a faceless, relentless external threat so great it can topple your landmarks and strike at the nerve centre of your military.

i'm not trying to call anyone who believes in these conspiracy theories a crackpot, i just don't buy it. nothing in any of the material i've read or watched strikes me as being unquestionable evidence of foul play, which is why i can't disagree enough with this statement;
the amount of evidence is so overwhelming that to ignore it or dismiss it is irrational and akin to stuffing your fingers in your ears and yelling la la la
Last edited by pk- on Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:38 pm

i wasn't talking about terrorstorm i was talking about the disclosure project. the iraq conspiracy vid is good though and is nothing like alex jones' conspiratainment

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Post by pk- » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:43 pm

sorry :oops:

which one of your links is the iraq conspiracy vid?

or do you mean Why We Fight

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Post by parson » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:49 pm


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Post by shonky » Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:25 pm

Robert Newman tackling the petrodollars crisis with some stand up and a fair bit of history http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 2978336967

Well worth watching, vid might be a bit glitchy though
Hmm....

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Post by seckle » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:52 pm

Shonky wrote:Robert Newman tackling the petrodollars crisis with some stand up and a fair bit of history http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 2978336967

Well worth watching, vid might be a bit glitchy though
thats a great find. Thank you. Well worth watching.

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Post by doomstep » Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:07 pm

Parson wrote:conspiratainment
awesome word :D

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Post by doomstep » Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:51 pm

pk- wrote: i'm not trying to call anyone who believes in these conspiracy theories a crackpot, i just don't buy it. nothing in any of the material i've read or watched strikes me as being unquestionable evidence of foul play, which is why i can't disagree enough with this statement;
the amount of evidence is so overwhelming that to ignore it or dismiss it is irrational and akin to stuffing your fingers in your ears and yelling la la la
I get where yr comin from man.

But, just ask yrself one question, one question we should all ask ourselves about everything;

who benefited from the towers falling?

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Post by doomstep » Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:53 pm

Parson wrote:
doomstep wrote: 'Here is a group is trying to do one thing - & that is, to get into the future'
hahah i used to have windows play that sample when i turned my computer on like 10 years ago
yhman, its all about leaving the 20thC. Still.

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