Hearing Loss Danger - High vs. Low Frequencies?

[Omega Dub]

So I've been wondering about this for a while, and give the obvious affinity for sub-bass around here, I figured DSF might turn up some good answers.

Does anyone know (preferably with some sort of scientific support) if there is a significant difference between the potential threat of hearing damage from different frequencies? My purely subjective impression is that higher frequencies are more harmful at the same db spl, because they are more obviously uncomfortable/painful... but I'd rather not gamble my hearing on this assumption. I always wear my etymotic ER20s to shows, but it doesn't seem like these, or any other earplugs, do much below 60hz or so, so I'm really starting to worry about all that super loud sub-bass causing some permanent (but not immediately apparent) damage.

This is also a concern for determining a safe monitoring level in the studio. Because of those loud, low sine waves, I'm finding that when I use a db meter in the studio to set an average monitoring level around 85db, it just seems too quiet with dubstep - but with other, less sub-heavy types of music (rock, jazz, etc.) 85 seems adequate.

Thoughts?

[ammo]

Higher frequencies are worse but I think at v high levels low frequencies can still cause damage. From my first degree in biomedical science. If u get a book on physiology and look at the ear section it might have the answers. Sorry can't remember more, the alcohol has destroyed my memories.

[Caski]

i thought it was only high frequencies (for the most part) that can actualy do proper damage to your hearing?

but im no scientist...

would be cool to know for sure whats what tho

[DRTY]

high frequencies are defo the dangerous ones, learnt that in acoustics....... can't remember exactly why. I think it's because the wavelengths of lower frequencies are too long to cause damage to your ears.

[NickUndercover]

High frequencies are the most dangerous ones. That's why I hate Doctor Pee

[brasco]

High frequencies are the most dangerous ones. That's why I hate Doctor Pee

alot if his stuff sounds like slightly melodic tinnitus anyway, o the irony

[NickUndercover]

High frequencies are the most dangerous ones. That's why I hate Doctor Pee

alot if his stuff sounds like slightly melodic tinnitus anyway, o the irony

Hahahahahahaha the only artist you can listen without earphones of any kind... Just go seeing him live and his music will never let you sleep again !

[Imme]

I just tried to find the answer on the internet and it seems that there's no difference between high or low frequencies.
It's the amount of db's that matters, the high frequencies seem to hurt more, this is not explained though. I'm not
quite sure if this is all really true but this is what I found.

[dan_thompson07]

high frequencies are defo the dangerous ones, learnt that in acoustics....... can't remember exactly why. I think it's because the wavelengths of lower frequencies are too long to cause damage to your ears.

I was also taught the same in acoustics. It's to do with high frequencies resonating the cilia in the ear and causing them to become damaged. As somebody has already pointed out though it's more to do with the level of the sound rather than the frequency. Still, I'd much rather have a 60Hz sine wave looped at 120dB for an hour than a 6kHz tone. I'm 90% sure that pure sub bass is pretty harmless.

[jackquinox]

As far as hearing loss is concerned the majority of peoples ears will over time be subject to detriation through age (presbycusis) in the 4-8kHz frequency bands, the problem is that if you combine this with noise induced hearing loss you can end up with a massive notch in the audiogram of the person you are testing and thats when the ability to hear speech goes right out the window, I did a study of noise induced hearing loss in DJs and how the noise levels compare to the current noise at work regulations and the majority that had been playing for over five years had some form of billateral hearing problem mainly in the form of tinnitus from high frequency damage to the inner ear and all of them where way way way over the weekley noise dose exposure limit.

Basically if your wondering how loud it should be in your studio by way of using the regulations then the exposure times should be measured or condensed over the course of an 8 hour working day and not exceed 80 dB so to stay on the side of caution with noise exposure the below is recommended:

80dB 8 hours
83dB 4 hours
86dB 2 hours
89dB 1 hour
92dB 30 mins

as far as high and low frequncies go, high frequencies are alot more detrimental to hearing but there are some infrasonic frequencies which at the right amplitude can do some serious damage to internal organs.

Hope this helps

[Omega Dub]

thanks for all the replies, and keep em coming!

I'm really having trouble working in the studio producing dubstep in the safe 80-85 db range. Dubstep (and a lot of dnb, and other bass heavy stuff) always seems to read a lot higher on the db meter than other types of music at a similar subjective volume (using C weighting, on a Radio Shack db meter). As I understand it, this is because of the loud sustained bass notes that do in fact raise the average spl, but at frequencies that we are less sensitive to, and are (hopefully) less likely to cause hearing damage. So I'm wondering if it's safe to push the level up into the 85-90 db range

[timparker]

Doctor P is killing your ears!!!!!!

On a more serious note though, good topic - hopefully some real nerds join in and spill some facts - it's very useful knowledge for us people who are addicted to hearing great music out and loud.

[ashley]

All about the ER15's for raves.

[Killawatt]

1khz and 4khz are regarded as the most dangerous frequency areas to the human ear. The ear amplifies the 4khz area the most (due to evolutionary factors e.g. babies crying) so be careful around that but 1khz is considered to be the most physically damaging frequency to the ear. if you set up a pure sine wave on logic, cubase etc., filter all frequencies either side of 950hz and 1050hz and turn up to a reasonable level (not too loud tho), you'll be able to feel the effect it has on your ear very strongly.

This is a general rule but everyones ears are different so you can test which frequency is most painful for you by just sweeping up and down on the filter or EQ.

Try this again with decent ear plugs in and you'll definately appreciate what they do much more!

[jackquinox]

thanks for all the replies, and keep em coming!

I'm really having trouble working in the studio producing dubstep in the safe 80-85 db range. Dubstep (and a lot of dnb, and other bass heavy stuff) always seems to read a lot higher on the db meter than other types of music at a similar subjective volume (using C weighting, on a Radio Shack db meter). As I understand it, this is because of the loud sustained bass notes that do in fact raise the average spl, but at frequencies that we are less sensitive to, and are (hopefully) less likely to cause hearing damage. So I'm wondering if it's safe to push the level up into the 85-90 db range

The C-Weighting curve is a much more flat response weighting with less bias on high and low frequencys, if your meter has it (which most will) the A-weighting is used in most EU and especially UK legislation (I assume it is used in the US aswell but dont hold me to that as I have never worked there) which is based on the hearing response of the average human (you will find that the low frequencies are seriously reduced based on the a-weighting and will provide you with a better overall representation of what noise level you are being subjected to), basically all noise at work codes of practice with regards to hearing loss and the majority of environmental health complaints are done with noise meters on an a-weighting.

[Omega Dub]

The C-Weighting curve is a much more flat response weighting with less bias on high and low frequencys, if your meter has it (which most will) the A-weighting is used in most EU and especially UK legislation (I assume it is used in the US aswell but dont hold me to that as I have never worked there) which is based on the hearing response of the average human (you will find that the low frequencies are seriously reduced based on the a-weighting and will provide you with a better overall representation of what noise level you are being subjected to), basically all noise at work codes of practice with regards to hearing loss and the majority of environmental health complaints are done with noise meters on an a-weighting.

this is very helpful, thanks!! 85 db on the C weighting with bass music seems absurdly quiet, whereas 85 db on the A weighting is much more reasonable.

[Dub Pilgrim]

Can anyone recommed a reasonable set of earphones? Im finding dubstep nights fine on my ears ( other than the dirt soundsystem at subloaded) but reggae dances seem to destroy me ear drums

[ras-claat]

http://www.elacin.com/hearing-protection/

[Bass Music]

Going to use this opportunity to say WEAR EARPLUGS! I have tinnitus and it is very annoying. Once you get it you can't get rid of it! I think music in the car, terrible nightclubs and of coarse big sound systems did it. I have to wear earplugs everytime I go out where music is playing now.

EDIT:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alpine-Music-Sa ... B000VO8PR0 these are pretty discreet and only 12ish quid on amazon, I paid £16 a few months ago. I find they are maybe a tiny bit too big for my ears but still fit fairly well.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Advanced-Commun ... 593&sr=1-2 : These are cheaper, fit better but are much less discreet. Depends if you don't mind people thinking you look a bit odd...they dont go down too well with girls

or you could push the boat out a bit and go with custom earplugs, I still need to invest in these

[Dub Pilgrim]

Sweet man deffinately needed! For the standard amazon ones how much does it affect the sound?