Organising sounds in a bass drop?

[Tiger Blood]

Hey guys

This might have already been answered before but im looking for some detail on the structure or the drop sections of tracks im learning the heavier style and the drops are made to sound really massive and epic and i know this is from all the processing and covering the full freq range etc however I am looking at how they are made. Its the number 1 thing that holds me back at the moment since I just cant grasp how to put the sounds together, ive made a tonne of patches but I always end up with 1 noise and sticking some modulation on it which isnt epic or interesting really.

So im looking for tips or anything on how to piece together the differenet synths and sounds in the drop in terms of structure as I really just cant get it on my own after weeks trying. Its always just 4 bars of 1 note with some modulation and then the same thing perhaps with different pitch rather than any other tracks (from the producer masterclasses i have watched) that have like 6-7 sounds all pieced together to sound good.

Heres a quick example of my newest track which shows exactly what I mean:

Soundcloud

Thanks for any tips or help here as I really need to get the hang of this to get anywhere now.

[acrap]

i know what you're talking about lol i'm having the same problem. it seems like alot of these producers use like 6 different sounds making them sound like they should perfectly come right after the other. I really dont know how to help you because i'm looking for the same answer but you could start by adding like melodic fills like notes on the scale that you're using going up and down like zomboy uses at 1:00 in this song below. I started pretty much a whole thread on how to make that yesterday but i'm still looking to make my drops more interesting.

[Tiger Blood]

i know what you're talking about lol i'm having the same problem. it seems like alot of these producers use like 6 different sounds making them sound like they should perfectly come right after the other. I really dont know how to help you because i'm looking for the same answer but you could start by adding like melodic fills like notes on the scale that you're using going up and down like zomboy uses at 1:00 in this song below. I started pretty much a whole thread on how to make that yesterday but i'm still looking to make my drops more interesting.

yeah thats what i mean, im sure there must be a few pointers or logic behind it since ive heard so many tracks that do it well.

So far all i heard was to use your main rift and just arrange cut up parts of other bass lines around it but getting it all to gel and sound right just isnt happening. I cant work it out !

[Dublicious]

In response to that Zomboy tune, that's not particularly hard to achieve, specifically theres a pulsating pad, (similar to Gemini etc...) a panned lfo synth in the right speaker, thats cut at about 1000, so it's acting like percussion to add some structure to the track, and then these bell percussion things (high passed) that have really heavily boosted high ends and reverb which soak the track in high end reverb, instead of adding a boring mediocre riser, he's automated the entire sequence to lose its low end and then it drops, pretty much because the loss of all bass, and then every frequency coming in at once is a good effect and works well in a club. The idea is easy... but that's not reality haha, all the individual sounds complement each other, which is what separates the good from the 'almost good'

Reverb = makes things appear bigger
stereo spread = things appear bigger
panned synths = can create the effect of alot of 'sounds' happening at once, because you also home in on the mono sounds

But of course it isn't as easy as that, everyone will tell you, the more sounds you layer at once, the better you've gotta be at eq'ing, obviously he's cut all those sounds perfectly so it doesn't sound like shit, but if you layer loads of high end sounds and add reverb to them, all your music is gunna sound whack.

[Tiger Blood]

In response to that Zomboy tune, that's not particularly hard to achieve, specifically theres a pulsating pad, (similar to Gemini etc...) a panned lfo synth in the right speaker, thats cut at about 1000, so it's acting like percussion to add some structure to the track, and then these bell percussion things (high passed) that have really heavily boosted high ends and reverb which soak the track in high end reverb, instead of adding a boring mediocre riser, he's automated the entire sequence to lose its low end and then it drops, pretty much because the loss of all bass, and then every frequency coming in at once is a good effect and works well in a club. The idea is easy... but that's not reality haha, all the individual sounds complement each other, which is what separates the good from the 'almost good'

Reverb = makes things appear bigger
stereo spread = things appear bigger
panned synths = can create the effect of alot of 'sounds' happening at once, because you also home in on the mono sounds

But of course it isn't as easy as that, everyone will tell you, the more sounds you layer at once, the better you've gotta be at eq'ing, obviously he's cut all those sounds perfectly so it doesn't sound like shit, but if you layer loads of high end sounds and add reverb to them, all your music is gunna sound whack.

useful info to try out, thanks

What im mainly looking for though is the actual main drop section not the buildup to it, people always mix it up when i ask so perhaps i am using the wrong term, I can build up to it easily but its the actual 16 bar section of bass that im taking about and how thats sequenced.

[acrap]

i'd really like to know this too lol my drops are boring as fuck, my transitions are akward this is pretty much whats stopping me from making a good song

[Dublicious]

ooooooo, so you mean like, when you don't have one set wobble, you have many? kind of a random example


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUomDcskYhE

[acrap]

well yeah i guess sorry for taking over your thread OP but in my case atleast i'd like to have a track that'll keep sounding interesting and the way i see that its done is by adding a ton of stuff and making them all sound like they go with eachother this is an example of what i'd like.

[Dublicious]

d

[Dublicious]

Okay, this is one of the most common problems producers face, (i think anyway) battled with this for ages and im still not amazing at it, basically if you have like 20 amazing wobbles in a track it will sound shit, this is becuase when people listen to songs, there brains need the song to be structured etc.. i dont know the inner working of why etc.. but hence why 16bar loops are always used, and a loop always goes back to the kick,or whatever you started the loop with, when you listen to these type of songs, after a few listens you'll realise that it's not that random its just a loop (4bars,8bars), it will always go back to the original starting wobble and then restart the loop again, this is what gives you the structure in a track, people just create loads of wobbles of 1 bar, and just put them at different LFO's and place them in a sequence, and then don't understand why the wobbles don't gel, you need a few good onces, and create a good sequence with them, using the same scale is imperative, which is again down to musical theory, think of listening to Bethovens music, and then suddenly a electric guitar wrenches in, it JUST doesn't fit, obviously some sounds just don't fit together, thats life unfortunately, keeping octaves in the same spectrum i.e.

-24
-12
-6
0
+6
+12
+24
(semitones)

helps keep structure

Billain makes the most un orthodox organic music i've heard for a long time, this song is one of his tame ones, and listen to the randomness!!


sounds very organic and randomised, but listen carefully and it's really just loops of the same sounds for so and so bars, and then after 4,8,12,16 bars he'll change it up

This probably hasn't helped you in the slightest, but it's hard to explain what i mean by having a structured loop in your track

[acrap]

i understand about our brains needing structure and thats why we make songs in phrases of 4,8 or 16 but what i dont quite understand is picking the right sounds that compliment others and how to properly mix them in (in the drop section) so its not 1 bar of 1 sound follow by another bar of another sound. good producers know when to interrupt a sound for lack of a better term with another and still keep things organized and entertaining

[[asterisk]]

Coming from a relatively straight forward trance and breakbeats background (in terms of song structure) and into the more "chaotic" dubstep style, I can relate with this issue, as it was the hardest part for me to get my head around since I had to unlearn my established structures and even workflow habits. In the styles I was accustomed to, there weren't nearly as many options for structure variations, especially if you wanted your track played out by other dj's. This freedom is what drew/draws me to dubstep, but at the same time is what makes it so challenging, I think more so for producers coming from other genres of edm where, like them or not, have many more unwritten rules in their creation. For instance I'd never used more than one bass sound (not including filtered and effected variations) for any tune until I came over here to the darkside. I was however using some techniques that translate without knowing it, such as the "call and response" type structure of my drops, ect.. But as for solutions, I would say use the advice above and also try putting your bass sounds on the same bus or group and use some compression and maybe a bit of reverb or other effects to help unify the bassline and coax the different sounds to fit together better. Good luck!

[123kidd]

Im eager to know this as well.

This might help,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCQJqGCCNtk

also a bit about basic structure but not very detailed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hhvw5Oop ... re=related

I think another way is to load a tune into your daw, just analyze it and try to recreate it.
Don't worry about the sounds in particular. Focus on how lfo's and envelopes are used.
Also try to pick out how many different synths were used.

[Dublicious]

Ye i know it's hard to put into words, and it's relatively untouched in all producer producer masterclasses i've seen,

So we're talking as if you have a 2 bar wobble (1/8), 1 bar wobble (1/12) 1 bar 'roar sound', (just for a quick example)

but if you have one really good wobble, try making all the other sounds out of that preset, obviously you can use distortion etc, but if your good enough at using your chosen synth, you will be able to change the preset into other sounds aswell, and hopefully they will keep the original wobbles feel = hence easily fusing with eachother, so it doesn't all sound disjointed and weird, obviously making each sound the same level and compression is recommended

[Tiger Blood]

just as an example heres my fav track at the moment (i know some people wont like it but thats fine / keep personal taste out of it)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzOgbE476Zc

In their drops they use like 4-5 synths and ive watched their master class but they dont go into structure just how they made the sound.

I can get like 5 synths to blend like they do and compliment each other rather than sounding like 5 random bits of a song ive mashed together.

Also if people are going to ask questions within my thread please keep them as on topic as possible ! thanks

[filtersnake]

totally stuck in this position but slowly working my head round it. takes alot of practice and patience.
Tips I can give are writing a bassline first in one bass patch. then chop out parts of it and add in other sounds into the different parts of the bar so that way it flows better together. Solves half the problem but sometimes the results can be a bit mehh.

[Kasshern]

Hello all!!
I had the same problem with the structures of my drop during a long time..the method i find and who work for me is to write the whole melody of the bassline with a very tonal sound(like a lead for exemple).Then when you have yours final notes for your basslines open like 4-5 differents synth ,cut your bassline midi note sin little pieces and then add the midi notes in the differents synth you oppened before.Pay attention to the differents octave of your synth to have something consistent.Later if the sounds of the differents synth don't fit you can alwaus correct that when you mix it.For me that method help me to have my drop sounds interesting.I don't know if my explication were very clear but if you understand it , it might help you

[acrap]

Hello all!!
I had the same problem with the structures of my drop during a long time..the method i find and who work for me is to write the whole melody of the bassline with a very tonal sound(like a lead for exemple).Then when you have yours final notes for your basslines open like 4-5 differents synth ,cut your bassline midi note sin little pieces and then add the midi notes in the differents synth you oppened before.Pay attention to the differents octave of your synth to have something consistent.Later if the sounds of the differents synth don't fit you can alwaus correct that when you mix it.For me that method help me to have my drop sounds interesting.I don't know if my explication were very clear but if you understand it , it might help you

I really didn't understand this but I'd like to

[Kasshern]

Sorry for the messy explanation.
What i would like to say is:
1.Find a good bassline with one synth
2.Open the synths you want to have in your drop(one wobble , one groar , one uplifter ,etc...)
3.Chop your midi bassline into short notes but in the same order as your original bassline.
4.Place the notes you have chopped into your synth.
For Example the bassline is : C,A,C,D
The first C note will go ine the wobble synth.The A note will go in the uplifter synth , the second C note will go Go in the groar synth and the last note (D) in the wobble synth again.
I don't know if it is clear this time , my english is not as good as i thought.

[acrap]

I understand this now it's a pretty new approach to me thank you