Starting up a label...

[Elkie]

Hi guys,

I've been thinking of starting up a little label (primarily digi) and I just wanted a bit of advice from anyone who's done this before...

Basically any advice on how people have done this in the past would be awesome - I have a strong concept for a label, I'm just trying to get my head around the logistics and business side of things a bit!

For example, how do you go about hitting up producers for tracks? I am willing to put some cash into this, so I'd be prepared to pay upfront for tracks from semi-established producers, but is this the done thing? I don't want to insult anyone by offering them a flat fee - I know people who have run drum and bass labels before using this method, but I guess it depends from producer to producer, no?

Thanks in advance.

[Riddles]

I'd have thought the standard way would be to make contact, say you wanna sign some tracks, then they'll get a % fee of each sale (possibly after you've recovered costs for mastering).

[Elkie]

Cheers for the reply Riddles, I was thinking this... however, as I'm a nobody and this will be a fresh label with no reputation to go off, it might be difficult getting the artists I'd like to get involved on board with the idea... I know if I was an established artist, I'd be wary of handing over a track to a label who, for all I knew, could only sell 10 downloads of it and make me pence (if anything). Was just thinking an up front payment might be the way to go for the first few releases?

[jrkhnds]

Before going through with it, I'd try to start building a network. Go to nights, talk to the people there; maybe set up your own night (unless you already did that). This has multiple benefits: make yourself a name within the "scene", get to know the right people, and, when starting a night, you already get some promotional platform that may be used for the label aswell a bit down the road.

Just setting up a label without any connections or a decent network seems a bit risky to me. Unless you got Burial vol. 2 in store, this would be a failproof way of losing a lot of money and staining your name a bit.

Edit: in regards to your actual question... Can't tell you more than you already know. I know in drum'n'bass it's fairly usual to just pay the producers upfront a fee previously agreed upon. At least with the smaller labels.

[Lye_Form]

Go Vinyl if you want to sign semi-established artists, many will be willing to sign tunes if you are offering a physical release. day trip to London to set up SoR with the main record shops.

If you go purely digital find some music you believe in and do everything you can to get it played by DJs, well known youtube channels are a massive way to promote music, my email box has been flooded with sales just after some YT uploads. You have to learn to be a hype machine without being obnoxious.

Small amount of facebook advertising can get the ball rolling.

Its ideal to find somone just before they blow up (Y)

[Elkie]

I've played a part in running several events around Birmingham at the minute, I'm currently co-running a night that provides a platform for up and coming producers in Birmingham a chance to showcase their own music, and we recently ran the main stage all day at the Custard Factory for a big street art festival (City of Colours). I've also been involved in more traditional events, booked Cyrus way back in 2008-ish, and more recently I've been involved in bringing acts like DjRum, Om Unit and Loxy to the city.

I'd say as far as the local scene goes I'm a fairly well known guy, and I have a large amount of contacts (I'd say I know every well-known drum and bass/dubstep promoter in the city well enough to at least say hello). I worked in the city's only "electronic music" record shop for a short time as well, and saw how much it struggled (it's since closed down), so I'm pretty aware of how the physical market works. Also, without giving too much away, I have a fairly unique plan regarding physical releases. so I'm a bit hesitant to jump straight in with standard vinyl releases.

I'm not trying to toot my own horn, just saying I kind of have the connections and network bit down in my immediate area. The thing is getting in touch with bigger more established artists from outside of this area - the way I see it, a few well chosen artists with a bit of a reputation already could help generate some noise to build a platform to promote those closer to home.

The only thing I'm really unsure on is how to approach these artists... I know like jrkhnds said, in drum and bass, it's not unusual to be paid an upfront fee, but I'm just not sure if this is the same in dubstep.

People who have released material, what sort of deals did you get? Upfront or paid as a percentage of sales?

Thanks for the help guys!

[Be-1ne]

dont pay shit, spilt the profit once costs have been recouped.!

[Dystinkt]

dont pay shit, spilt the profit once costs have been recouped.!

this, ive never had a contract involving an upfront fee, and for the most part I really wouldn't expect one. If an artist you want to sign can see you believe in what you're doing, going about things the right way and pushing quality music, then its unlikely they'd want paying up front, and would be happy with 50/50 split on profits once costs are recouped.

[codeStep]

Most deals involve the artist receiving a percentage of the profits. Don't do an upfront fee.

To put it bluntly, most established artists aren't going to sign there music to be the first release of an unknown label unless you know the artist personally or have a bit of branding/following behind you already (like a club night as previously mentioned).

The first releases are gonna be the basis for your label, you can't really just hit up a big name and ask them for an EP. It takes a lot of networking or finding some new unknown talent who'd be willing to sign. If you think the artist would know of you then you may have a shot. But usually you'll need to have built up a bit of reputation as a label with proven track history of quality

[xtcvsmistycold]

i know a few record labels that do upfront fees tbh.

fairly established labels that do vinyl

would probably work better with established labels though

[skimpi]

Not to shit on your idea of doing a label and everything, but I was just watching an interview with Ron Morelli, and he kinda says he doesnt see the point in starting up a label to just go and find tracks from people, and I dunno I kinda think the same. Why do you want to start a label to just go and e-mail people who are already established for tracks? Like shouldn't the spark for starting a label be that you have lots of music at your grasp that needs releasing, and no one else will or has the guts to, rather than just wanting to have your own label?

[jrkhnds]

like, you know, stuff like that.
I have to agree with skimpi's point though.

[wub]

Agree with Skimpi...if you're not adding anything unique that no-one else is doing or has the balls to do, then what's the point?

[xtcvsmistycold]

Agree with Skimpi...if you're not adding anything unique that no-one else is doing or has the balls to do, then what's the point?

4 lv and $$$

[Elkie]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I'm currently co-running a night that provides a platform for up and coming producers in Birmingham a chance to showcase their own music.

I HAVE access to a decent amount of quality, locally produced music that I would love to provide a platform for... the issue is getting some exposure for this platform - hence being interested in getting a more established (or a couple of more established) artists involved. Say I was to put out a 4 track EP - having 3 tunes from local producers and one from a recognised name would influence people not to just scroll past the release in online stores and in shops. On top of this, I have a strong, original and interesting concept for a label, both as a visual style and as a physical product, which I don't wish to disclose just yet...

I'm simply asking for the best way to go about getting tracks off big names, and whether up front payment is something that happens often in the dubstep scene. The only people who are really gonna be able to help are A) established artists, or B) people with experience in running a label.

Thanks to all the people saying "don't bother" without reading the whole thread though

Good old DSF, reminds me precisely why I hardly bother with this forum anymore.

[pete_bubonic]

Thanks to all the people saying "don't bother" without reading the whole thread though

Good old DSF, reminds me precisely why I hardly bother with this forum anymore.

Eh, this doesn't make sense. You don't state why you think a new label is needed in your area and not one person said 'dont bother'??! Are *you* reading the thread?

[Elkie]

You don't state why you think a new label is needed in your area...

...I'm currently co-running a night that provides a platform for up and coming producers in Birmingham a chance to showcase their own music, and we recently ran the main stage all day at the Custard Factory for a big street art festival (City of Colours)...

...Also, without giving too much away, I have a fairly unique plan regarding physical releases. so I'm a bit hesitant to jump straight in with standard vinyl releases.

I'm not trying to toot my own horn, just saying I kind of have the connections and network bit down in my immediate area. The thing is getting in touch with bigger more established artists from outside of this area - the way I see it, a few well chosen artists with a bit of a reputation already could help generate some noise to build a platform to promote those closer to home.

(Granted not exactly a reason a label is needed in my local area, but I have reasons for doing what I'm doing - I don't just "want to start a label to just go and e-mail people who are already established for tracks" as previously stated.)

...and not one person said 'dont bother'??!

what's the point?

Not to shit on your idea of doing a label and everything, but I was just watching an interview with Ron Morelli, and he kinda says he doesnt see the point in starting up a label to just go and find tracks from people, and I dunno I kinda think the same. Why do you want to start a label to just go and e-mail people who are already established for tracks? Like shouldn't the spark for starting a label be that you have lots of music at your grasp that needs releasing, and no one else will or has the guts to, rather than just wanting to have your own label?

like, you know, stuff like that.
I have to agree with skimpi's point though.

Not exactly words of encouragement

EDIT: Do you not have anything you could add to this that's like, I don't know, a little more constructive, given your personal experiences?

I have a concept that is fairly solid, so for obvious reasons I'd like to keep them quite close to my chest at this point. Is it too much to ask for a little advice on a fairly specific subject?

[wub]

You've taken my comment out of context though;

if you're not adding anything unique that no-one else is doing or has the balls to do, then what's the point?

This is a valid observation IMO. I understand the desire to start up a label, and haven't said don't do it. However, if the label doesn't have a Unique Selling Point, then how is it going to stand out?

You've talked about hitting up already semi-established artists to release tunes on your label. Are the tunes going to be a different style from those they already release on other labels? Will you be tapping up producers who don't release anywhere else? Will there be a production/style ethos that underpins the label? etc etc

It's not that you shouldn't do it, just that I don't personally think that a label that doesn't add anything special or different to an already saturated marketplace is necessarily a good thing.

[Elkie]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I'm currently co-running a night that provides a platform for up and coming producers in Birmingham a chance to showcase their own music.

I HAVE access to a decent amount of quality, locally produced music that I would love to provide a platform for... the issue is getting some exposure for this platform - hence being interested in getting a more established (or a couple of more established) artists involved. Say I was to put out a 4 track EP - having 3 tunes from local producers and one from a recognised name would influence people not to just scroll past the release in online stores and in shops. On top of this, I have a strong, original and interesting concept for a label, both as a visual style and as a physical product, which I don't wish to disclose just yet...

[wub]

Fair enough, but you didn't mention in that your OP, did ya


If you've got unique aspect to it, that's different. Release on vinyl, do a run of 500 for a four track EP. Tap up a local guy to do artwork. Have a word with a local promoter/club to see if you can do a label showcase night to celebrate the launch.

Once you've covered costs, split the profits with the artists and start all over again.

(Guessing you've got mastering of the tunes sorted etc.)