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scspkr99 wrote:I'm older and the first World Cup I can remember is Argentina 1978. Scotland made it England didn't, as kids then we weren't going to let Englands absence stop us enjoying it and gangs of kids were singing we're on the march with Ally's army. Can you imagine that now. By the 80's Liverpools Scottish contingent were more important than the English players.

I've definitely mellowed. I've thought at times that proper club fans are too invested for international football to matter that much and I've always considered the mad random Bournemouth and Swindon flags indicative of an England support who's demographic was the lesser teams unlikely to secure any real glory for themselves. I now think that's largely bullshit. I still think there's a pretty significant section of club supporters that think as I do though.

I think it's fairly common - I was just giving my personal experience really. It's definitely the case that people who "follow" England tend to support smaller clubs.

I find the opposite pull from following big clubs though... in today's world where Premiership titles can be bought, the Champions League is largely Two Spanish Clubs Vs The Rest Of The World and even the FA Cup becoming an irrelevance domestically, the International game seems to have a tiny bit more romance about it.... even when the England team has someone like John Terry in it.

Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

southstar wrote:

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

Even I remember that.
I would be hard pressed to watch an England game now.

southstar wrote:

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

Goal of the tournament that one

wub wrote:

southstar wrote:

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

Goal of the tournament that one

Was that the bicycle kick? Euro 96 squad was so good.

Euro 96 Strikeforce: Shearer, Sheringham, Ferdinand, Fowler
Euro 12 Strikeforce: Rooney (for the 2 games he can play before we get knocked out by spain) Carroll Sturridge, Welbeck?

southstar wrote:

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

I was in Germany for that match on a school exchange. We spent pretty much every coach journey singing Three Lions and every day following the Scotland game trying to recreate Gazza's goal.

It's striking how much people forget about individual personalities when the team starts doing alright - Gascoigne was/is at least as much of a boorish oaf as Rooney (who, for all his faults, doesn't appear to be an alcohic wifebeater with a soft spot for shotgun wielding maniacs yet), but he was a national treasure when he put an England shirt on... he disgraced himself over and over at all levels of the game and life, but we all wanted to see him score the winner in a World Cup final.

There's always going to been one or two wankers in the England team. It's a professional sports team! Most professional sportsmen are a bit wanky. There are wankers in the cricket and rugby teams too... the only reason they don't get the same treatment is because they a) occasionally win things and, more importantly, b) play sports that nobody fully cares about. As a Somerset-born wannabe-poshlad, I love both cricket and rugby, but England winning the Rugby World Cup made me happy for a few hours at best - if the England football team won the World Cup I'd still be grinning 4 years later!

Squad should be out in a couple of minutes...

garethom wrote:

wub wrote:

southstar wrote:

Dead Rats wrote:Does anyone actually care about the National team? Like, really?

I remember celebrating like a proper gimp when Gascoigne scored against Scotland and when Seaman saved the final penalty against Spain. Really wish i could still get that excited about England again but its not going to happen..

Goal of the tournament that one

Was that the bicycle kick? Euro 96 squad was so good.

If you can look at this without swearing, then I believe you when you say you don't care about the England team.

And:

England squad for Euro 2012:

Goalkeepers: Joe Hart (Man City), Rob Green (West Ham), John Ruddy (Norwich)

Defenders: Glen Johnson (Liverpool), Phil Jones (Man United), John Terry (Chelsea), Joleon Lescott (Man City), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), Leighton Baines (Everton)

Midfielders: Theo Walcott (Arsenal), Stewart Downing (Liverpool), Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Arsenal), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Gareth Barry (Man City), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Scott Parker (Tottenham), Ashley Young (Man United), James Milner (Man City)

Forwards: Wayne Rooney (Man United), Danny Welbeck (Man United), Andy Carroll (Liverpool), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham)

I count 2 wankers out of 22. Maybe 3. Not bad actually.

what about if I lol?

that's pretty poor man

No Jagielka . Grrr.

Big up Jack Butland making the stand by list. Rob Green, urgh.

Stewart Downing must be the most universally disliked player in the prem... Liverpool fans hate him, probably even his own mother doesn't return his calls

gwaan the ox!

garethom wrote:Rob Green, urgh.

Never to be forgiven for his fumble against the US.

Yeah downing can fuck off.

Can't really complain with the rest of the squad, maybe swap sturridge and defoe over.

Realistically Green isn't going to play with Hart in the side

scspkr99 wrote:what about if I lol?

that's pretty poor man

Everyone said we'd got a shit squad going into Euro '96 as well. Shearer was in a goal drought, Sheringham was already 30 and not even at Man Utd yet, Stuart Pearce had to be brought back, Gareth Southgate, Nicky Barmby and Darren Anderton were in there... we hadn't even qualified for the World Cup two years before and only made it to the Euros because we were hosting. We drew 1-1 with Switzerland in the opener and the whole country had already decided it was going to be a damp squib.

But as you well remember, all made themselves national heroes in the space of 3 weeks.

You can't predict international tournaments. Hell, South Korea can get to a World Cup semi - you don't need a team of galacticos, you just need a team.

magma wrote:

If you can look at this without swearing, then I believe you when you say you don't care about the England team.

And:

England squad for Euro 2012:

Goalkeepers: Joe Hart (Man City), Rob Green (West Ham), John Ruddy (Norwich)

Defenders: Glen Johnson (Liverpool), Phil Jones (Man United), John Terry (Chelsea), Joleon Lescott (Man City), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), Leighton Baines (Everton)

Midfielders: Theo Walcott (Arsenal), Stewart Downing (Liverpool), Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Arsenal), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Gareth Barry (Man City), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Scott Parker (Tottenham), Ashley Young (Man United), James Milner (Man City)

Forwards: Wayne Rooney (Man United), Danny Welbeck (Man United), Andy Carroll (Liverpool), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham)

I count 2 wankers out of 22. Maybe 3. Not bad actually.

Glen Johnson: Nicked a toilet seat. Usually doesn't qualify you as a wanker, but guy was earning about £40,000 a week at the time.
John Terry:
Ashley Cole: Standard football wanker (but about the only player we've got who's in the top 5 for his position in the world)
Stewart Downing: Acted like a top wanker in Birmingham City Centre when we were talking to Luke Young and trying to convince him to reverse his international retirement.
Steven Gerrard: The DJ punching thug arsehole wanker
Gareth Barry: Just a retard.
Ashley Young: Rat cockroach cheating bastard.
Wayne Rooney: Just a wanker in general.
Andy Carroll: Top wanker.

Can't belive Carroll got picked over Grant Holt. Shall we take the 2nd highest scoring english striker? Nah, we'll take one of the worst strikers of the season. Don't even try the argument that he isn't good enough at the top level or experience or whatever, when he's been bagging against defenders in the self-proclaimed 'best league in the world' all season.

Was hoping Oxo wouldn't be in the squad. I knew he would be though...

magma wrote:I count 2 wankers out of 22. Maybe 3. Not bad actually.

Come on mag, let's see your hand?

magma wrote:

scspkr99 wrote:what about if I lol?

that's pretty poor man

Everyone said we'd got a shit squad going into Euro '96 as well. Shearer was in a goal drought, Sheringham was already 30 and not even at Man Utd yet, Stuart Pearce had to be brought back, Gareth Southgate, Nicky Barmby and Darren Anderton were in there... we hadn't even qualified for the World Cup two years before and only made it to the Euros because we were hosting. We drew 1-1 with Switzerland in the opener and the whole country had already decided it was going to be a damp squib.

But as you well remember, all made themselves national heroes in the space of 3 weeks.

You can't predict international tournaments. Hell, South Korea can get to a World Cup semi - you don't need a team of galacticos, you just need a team.

Myabe that's my problem with International football in that they become hero's for making the Semi's at home There was only really one result of note the game against the Dutch.

I think my problem with the squad / team is that it is going to get set up as a strict 4-4-2 and I don't see much scope for variation. I'm not sure why Wellbeck makes it, Downing too for that matter and if we accept that Gerrard and Lampard can't play in a 442 alongside each other then one of them is redundant. Terry is also not playing well but will start.

I also think taking Terry after stripping him of the captaincy is a bit rubbish.