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Perfecture wrote:Right,

I have read through everything and still having a bit of an issue with sub bass.
I thought it was fine till recently when I noticed there is no way near enough beef when compared with other tracks.

Heres a run down.......

I have my sub bass playing F1, Using the EXS24, it's a pure sine, Its peaking at -12db and peaking at 40hz (from what I have read this is the IDEAL rumble frequency).
for some reason it's just not booming through like other sub basses I hear in 'Big name' tracks.
I have tried limiting, compressing, adding distortion for harmonics and I still can't get the beef needed.

Is the mastering stage going to help with this or should my sub bass at mixdown stage easily be able to match 'big name' tracks and their sub bass?

I can't figure out what I am doing wrong, Anyone have any tips at all?

Your help is much appreciated guys.

therapist wrote:

Perfecture wrote:Right,

I have read through everything and still having a bit of an issue with sub bass.
I thought it was fine till recently when I noticed there is no way near enough beef when compared with other tracks.

Heres a run down.......

I have my sub bass playing F1, Using the EXS24, it's a pure sine, Its peaking at -12db and peaking at 40hz (from what I have read this is the IDEAL rumble frequency).
for some reason it's just not booming through like other sub basses I hear in 'Big name' tracks.
I have tried limiting, compressing, adding distortion for harmonics and I still can't get the beef needed.

Is the mastering stage going to help with this or should my sub bass at mixdown stage easily be able to match 'big name' tracks and their sub bass?

I can't figure out what I am doing wrong, Anyone have any tips at all?

Your help is much appreciated guys.

When you say peaking do you mean that' the highest frequency? You will feel that in a club but don't expect to her much of it producing at home.

therapist wrote:I just meant that that may be too low, unless you know you're hearing that same pitch in the 'big name' tracks. I never use 808s (basically just a sine wave under that kick sound anyway isn't it?) but the only thing that will stop a sine wave hitting properly is clashing frequencies, or being too low/high (for your speakers).

JFK wrote:

therapist wrote:I just meant that that may be too low, unless you know you're hearing that same pitch in the 'big name' tracks. I never use 808s (basically just a sine wave under that kick sound anyway isn't it?) but the only thing that will stop a sine wave hitting properly is clashing frequencies, or being too low/high (for your speakers).

Agree 100% 40hz is going to be too low for you to hear with any clarity on your home monitoring system mate.

Perfecture wrote:

JFK wrote:

therapist wrote:I just meant that that may be too low, unless you know you're hearing that same pitch in the 'big name' tracks. I never use 808s (basically just a sine wave under that kick sound anyway isn't it?) but the only thing that will stop a sine wave hitting properly is clashing frequencies, or being too low/high (for your speakers).

Agree 100% 40hz is going to be too low for you to hear with any clarity on your home monitoring system mate.

Fair enough, what you reckon is the 'Ideal' frequency for pure beef?

LX_Nen wrote:Some more tips...

Sub bass should be monophonic. If you play 2 sub notes at once, things will get very messy, and you'll have to turn the volume down to stop distortion. Don't forget that decaying notes count too, if (like Reason's Thor) the synth you are using has the ability to add polophony for release tails, turn this off as well as the normal poly.

Sub Bass will be louder if it's in mono. Simple maths really: 2 speakers cranking out your mono sub is louder than 1 pumping out a sub panned hard left or right.

Sticking effects on a sub very rarely leaves you with a usable sub. Reverb and delay are especially unlikely to give good results, because they introduce polophony. Vibrato, portamento, pitc-bend and tremelo work fine, while shapers, octave shifters and so on can give useful results, but they tend to turn sub bass into plain old bass - not that there's anything wrong with that, but if you end up thinking 'this is banging... but it would be better if I layered it with a sub', then you've sort of missed the point of a sub bass.

Fix your clicks! Having a very short attack or decay often leads to clicks, because the envelope cuts off the sine wave unnaturally. It's tempting to think of this clicking as an unexpected rhythmic bonus, because it happens in time with your track, but don't, you'll eat up headroom, you'll have nowhere to turn when you decide your breakdown needs the clicks but not the sub bass, and because the clicks vary depending on where in the cycle your sine wave is, you'll get unpredictable results.

A very short portamento works wonders. Those irritating clicks when you stop one note and start another often can be solved by simply not stopping one note and starting another! If you turn portamento on, so the sub glides from one note to the next, the clicks should practically vanish, even if you make the glide so fast it's unnoticeable.

JFK wrote:

Perfecture wrote:

JFK wrote:

therapist wrote:I just meant that that may be too low, unless you know you're hearing that same pitch in the 'big name' tracks. I never use 808s (basically just a sine wave under that kick sound anyway isn't it?) but the only thing that will stop a sine wave hitting properly is clashing frequencies, or being too low/high (for your speakers).

Agree 100% 40hz is going to be too low for you to hear with any clarity on your home monitoring system mate.

Fair enough, what you reckon is the 'Ideal' frequency for pure beef?

As a general rule I would say 60 - 70hz peak. Try moving your sub up an octave mate.

highdrake wrote:Hi guys is this a pretty accurate representation of how a sub should fit?

Maybe put a compressor on it? I have a low pass filter on it to bring it out a little louder.