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Not at all hubb, get the small Genelecs if you can afford them.
You don't hear that advice much in dance producer circles, but it's
a very good choice.

Every solution has it's drawbacks. With this one it is of course the lacking low end.

I think it is completely unacceptable to just write off a band of the spectrum. Like, I don't need to hear that... There are very serious issues <80hz. I'm speaking from experience, working with krk 5's, not working with the krk sub, working with the krk sub, and then not working with the krk sub. There is just nothing there.

I believe in 6's or 8's, and managing your room as best as you can.

And I believe more and more in moving monitoring up in your balance of priorities.

I must admit I really want to get a small 8" sub to go with my rp5s cos its so uninspiring working with no sub bass

Let me expound further on shit I'm only marginally qualified to discuss: I'm no fan of subs. Supposedly sub is not directional or whatever, bullshits. Also putting your sub below a desk creates a resonant space, causing all kinds of issues. I'd rather just monitor with woofers that can LEGITIMATELY get you down to 40hz. 40 is not that low, it is only the open E string on a bass. But I'd like a solid, stable stereo image.

I have to say also that I moved recently and the space that I'm in now is so so much better, my shitty krk's are much more usable, sub or not. My point being that your space plays a huge roll in your sound reproduction. If I was a normal person and had money to spend, and I was in a normal room, treatment would be the thing.

But get something with woofers that can get down to 40hz.

U are meant to put the sub in the corner of the room. Its not that directional really its just that the standing waves can often give that impression. Idk I still think I'd be using headphones a lot too

Maybe if he has a dedicated room to build a studio space in.
How much of those issues are actually in your music and not just in your
10x3m2 bedroom? Unless you have the room to perceive these
massive waves, you will have to properly contain them. In the average student
living situation you are more likely just firing low end into the next room or apartment
while you keep the higher lows and their out of phase buddies to yourself.
A secret mountain lair can of course be an entirely different situation.

Putting a sub in the corner will add at least 6dB of low end that is not in the music.
Depending on the cabinet design and the materials in the room.
If you want to go down to 40Hz with decent loudspeakers, you have to spend around
€800 per unit I think. You need an 8" woofer really.

On the other hand, the 4" Genelecs don't even respond to an input under 60Hz.
Good low end is just very expensive. The maniacs at Galaxy Studios can tell you
all about this

Yeah, It's a little akward knowing they don't go down to 40 hz.

The ones I have now do though. So maybe I should just keep both around.

I think it could be good to have atleast two sets two mix down on, but then again if they are in the same room it might not make that much sense.

Cheers

Also there's reasons for not working with a sub when you produce at these tempos tbh, but I appreciate the thought ofcourse.

I think having two sets of monitors, one accurate in the uppers and one reaching down into the foundations is a good idea. I have to say, though, I suck at using a couple of monitoring sources. I guess it is something I have to get used to. But when I switch monitoring, say from the krk 5's to dt 770's, it is like a totally different mix. I'm totally lost. INVARIABLY I have to re balance the kick, snare, bass, lead, and chords... Like the whole freaking song. And then when I listen to that mix then on the other monitors... it is like, I'm lost again. I can mix okay for one set of monitors. I haven't figured out yet how to mix for a variety of play back systems. That's hard. Like I'm good enough to hit the target, but if there are two or more targets, fuhghetaboutit.

That's just me, and I'm working on it.

Those looks very appro there fragments

cheers

nowaysj wrote:I think having two sets of monitors, one accurate in the uppers and one reaching down into the foundations is a good idea. I have to say, though, I suck at using a couple of monitoring sources. I guess it is something I have to get used to. But when I switch monitoring, say from the krk 5's to dt 770's, it is like a totally different mix. I'm totally lost. INVARIABLY I have to re balance the kick, snare, bass, lead, and chords... Like the whole freaking song. And then when I listen to that mix then on the other monitors... it is like, I'm lost again. I can mix okay for one set of monitors. I haven't figured out yet how to mix for a variety of play back systems. That's hard. Like I'm good enough to hit the target, but if there are two or more targets, fuhghetaboutit.

That's just me, and I'm working on it.

I'm totally with you. In my experience though despite every other opinion I've encountered, I feel like HPs never translate. Had a period where this club had a function one we could monitor off and it turned out the volume or physicality of a mix (like the abstract notion of what weighed what so to speak), was closest to listening through the ½ shitty monitors, whereas the HPs had it's own 'world' entirely. Just a feeling I got out of that ofcourse, I dont want to stick to one opinion when I dont necessarily 'know' know .

Thanks again

hubb wrote:Also there's reasons for not working with a sub when you produce at these tempos tbh, but I appreciate the thought ofcourse.

Your current monitors go down to 40Hz? What are they?
The old HR824's had decent response that low, but they are an exception
as far as I know. Actually the only flaw of those speakers was containing that low
end reflected by the passive diaphragm in the back:



I'm somehow mixing low end quite well on headphones. I checked some of my beats
on the Void rig before soundcheck one night and they were not far off. Needed quite a boost
in the 900-2000Hz range though. Guess I'm overcompensating on the DT770's.

Oh -- maybe they dont. They say they do though. But haven't done any tests.

Funny thing is that the bit that tells what model and brand it is has broken off sometime.

But a pretty generic crap brand (that sound decent next to others tbh)..

looool

AxeD wrote:Guess I'm overcompensating on the DT770's.

Unfortunately, my DT770's translate the best of any monitoring I use. But I hate working with them, I hate wearing headphones for more than like 5 minutes. I haven't checked any mixes in this new space though.

I'm also of the opinion that sub is not that difficult btw


yes im on the 'wrong' forum

I switched from KRK Rokit 6 to Equator D5...while I subjectively miss the low end, my mixes improved a ton. On the Rokit 6s I had no clue what the bass was really doing until I listened on several other systems (also the mids for that matter...but I digress...). It took a while (some months) and then I rearranged my studio so had to learn it over again, but I've come back to knowing what the low end should sound like on my D5s to sound good elsewhere.

hubb wrote:I'm also of the opinion that sub is not that difficult btw

Imo, anything with a kick and a bass you need to know whats doing with the sub. Also, reaching down to 40 ensures that you get a really accurate picture of 80. Kind of a headroom issue.

nowaysj wrote:

hubb wrote:I'm also of the opinion that sub is not that difficult btw

Also, reaching down to 40 ensures that you get a really accurate picture of 80. Kind of a headroom issue.

QTF. The roll off on monitors isn't going to be accurate. I can't decide if I want to add a sub or a pair of 8 inch monitors in the fall when I have money again...

(fucking summer time...I get almost a 4 month vacation, but I'm like ramen noodle poor...)

nowaysj wrote:I think it is completely unacceptable to just write off a band of the spectrum. Like, I don't need to hear that... There are very serious issues <80hz. I'm speaking from experience, working with krk 5's, not working with the krk sub, working with the krk sub, and then not working with the krk sub. There is just nothing there.

I believe in 6's or 8's, and managing your room as best as you can.

And I believe more and more in moving monitoring up in your balance of priorities.

definitely the utmost but you have to remember i refuse to own stuff if i can

i dont like 'stuff' anymore than i like having the stuff that i need
which is monitors that are just below what i want
soundcard that is fine
box of percussion
mic