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There's no phase modulation going on in that bass, only ring modulation or FM. Phase modulation doesn't effect the frequency of a sound and sounds more like pulse width modulation.

Just download Tal-Elec7ro and follow the steps I wrote in a previous post above.

Stick with the simple wave shapes.

futures_untold wrote:There's no phase modulation going on in that bass, only ring modulation or FM. Phase modulation doesn't effect the frequency of a sound and sounds more like pulse width modulation.

Just download Tal-Elec7ro and follow the steps I wrote in a previous post above.

Stick with the simple wave shapes.

they both use massive, and told BB they use PM.
also NI say,

modulation oscillator can be used to vary the main oscillators' signal. It can be used for ring modulation, phase modulation (which sounds similar to FM) as well as further modulation modes

so whats with the

Fair enough, maybe they do use phase modulation. Who cares?

Why faff and fart about fretting over how Massive was used to make the sound when one could use any synth capable of FM to achieve the sound with ease? (Hence headbanging) ...

Literally knocked out the sound in question in 30 seconds using subtractor.

Naamsayin g?

futures_untold wrote:Fair enough, maybe they do use phase modulation. Who cares?

Why faff and fart about fretting over how Massive was used to make the sound when one could use any synth capable of FM to achieve the sound with ease? (Hence headbanging) ...

Literally knocked out the sound in question in 30 seconds using subtractor.

Naamsayin g?

TIZ ALL KOOL MANGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111

why any one would want to make that sound is beyond me?

I load a complex graintable waveform into my access firus and turn the F-shift to 3 o'clock

instant annoying doctor p noise

FSTZ wrote:I load a complex graintable waveform into my access firus and turn the F-shift to 3 o'clock

instant annoying doctor p noise

i need to get me one of them access firus

Just had a go at it myself for a few minutes and this is what i got so far..

http://www22.zippyshare.com/v/33273187/file.html

and another

http://www7.zippyshare.com/v/70449909/file.html

3za wrote:

futures_untold wrote:Fair enough, maybe they do use phase modulation. Who cares?

Why faff and fart about fretting over how Massive was used to make the sound when one could use any synth capable of FM to achieve the sound with ease? (Hence headbanging) ...

Literally knocked out the sound in question in 30 seconds using subtractor.

Naamsayin g?

TIZ ALL KOOL MANGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111

why any one would want to make that sound is beyond me?

Kinda what I was thinking too

Great minds think alike!

Here's a quick screencast to show how silly easy this sound is to achieve.... http://www.mediafire.com/?dlr6qzyfq5xnsiy

FM synth ftw if trying to achieve this sound.

/thread


Ps, I'm actually getting agitated over this shit lol... I'm a twat.

This one is easy. In massive, use formant on the oscs. You can layer them and pitch them at different octaves for a more dramatic effect if you want. I did that on the tune in my sig.

narrator wrote:Just had a go at it myself for a few minutes and this is what i got so far..

http://www22.zippyshare.com/v/33273187/file.html

Sounds better than the original imo...

Why aren't you famous?

Doctor P sound = Distort a Sine Wave and use a high pitched note, that's it, but make sure you are CLIPPING the sinewave though not just fuzzy distortion, it has to be some sort of hard clipper, mastering plugins work well for this.

futures_untold wrote:Either use a saw wave on both oscillators, or use a saw wave on the modulator and a square wave on the carrier.

Shouldn't a saw wave as a modulator have no effect on the carrier because the slope of the saw is constant?

nowaysj wrote:

futures_untold wrote:Either use a saw wave on both oscillators, or use a saw wave on the modulator and a square wave on the carrier.

Shouldn't a saw wave as a modulator have no effect on the carrier because the slope of the saw is constant?

not if its working at 1/2 phase (octave kids, I know noways knows what this means but...), then you get intersections.

The oscillators waveshape (phase shape would be a more acurate description) is not to be confused with the oscillators 'start phase position' (which often just shortened to phase). The oscillator 'phase start position' sets the starting degree of the oscillators (phase) waveshape with each 'note on' message.

So the carrier in our case has the phase shape of 'saw'. The modulator also uses a 'saw' waveshape, but this only effects the way the pitch of the carrier is modulated. The two waveforms could by in phase, but this wouldn't 'cancel out' the sound (as mentioned by 3za below). Check out the video I uploaded in an earlier post to see the FM from our example in action.

Interesting variations could undoubtedly be acheived by changing the phase of either the modulator or carrier.

nowaysj wrote:

futures_untold wrote:Either use a saw wave on both oscillators, or use a saw wave on the modulator and a square wave on the carrier.

Shouldn't a saw wave as a modulator have no effect on the carrier because the slope of the saw is constant?

using PM with a ratio of 1:1, yes, because it effects the playback position in a linear way.
FM, no, because it effects the pitch, not how it plays back.

Futures beat me.

Your demonstration video didnt reaaaaly show anything mate, sorry to say.

Pat sorry to say, but i think its not down to FM synthesis, anyways isnt subtractor subtractive???.
Anyhow. To get this sort of noise, you can achieve it in many ways. More than one way to skin a cat right? so saying its FM FM FM FM isnt right, because my I have created sounds similar by using an additive synth layering the sounds in 5ths and whole octaves. He also uses several synths with several oscillators to fill the gaps needed. It sounds like he uses 'organ' type oscillators as it sounds to have that rich organy sound.

FM synthesis you can get the high pitch stuff going on, but its almost always really screeeeeching and sounds terrible.
to create sounds like these, In most cases, its filling the 'gaps' and also leaving spaces in certain frequencies as to separate the highs from the lows.



^^^
This sound is definitely not FM, just layers and layers. Notice how its not 'screechy' like FM is.
It also has a bit of vibrato set to a slow envelope on the higher regions.

With a lot of these sounds, its not down to one technique but many. He may have used Phase modulation, ringshifters etc... he may have not...

Depone wrote:ringshifters

that sounds dirty, he must be using these.

futures_untold wrote:You need a synth capable of FM between the oscillators.

Set one oscillator to frequency modulate the oscillator. (For instance, set osc 2 to FM osc 1).

Set the pitch of the modulator two or three octaves above the carrier. (The modulator is the one doing the modulation, in this case, oscillator 2.)

Set the mixer level between the two oscillators so you can only hear the carrier.

Either use a saw wave on both oscillators, or use a saw wave on the modulator and a square wave on the carrier.

Adjust the FM depth to taste.

Viola Flux Pavillion!

Patrick

Nice.

I thought DX7 style fm was phase mod unlike analogue fm?
Anyways in massive have a square wave tuned to -24 add the mod osc tuned to +24 at 12 oclock for a start.

There are many ways to skin a cat indeed sir!

The video was created solely to show that a spot of FM could get you in the right ball park in a matter of seconds.